yakfak Posted March 29, 2018 (edited) combat style: more lawful - positive difficulty, tested for breeziness and ammo supply, draws player into the level. arcade-like. a map like this could be a sixty imp chaingun fest or a two thousand enemy slaughter map - it's the approach to fun i'm looking at more neutral - monsters and supplies are placed atmospherically cos that's where they live more chaotic - difficulty is deliberately challenging in other ways ie. ammo is sparse or monsters are placed in annoying, time-consuming positions; player has to understand that monsters are to be tackled in a certain order or even be tricked into fighting on your behalf. a negative/chaotic map can still be very well tested, this isn't me calling out "bad maps" or anything, my tastes take me in this direction anyway layout style: more lawful - map loops and funnels you to where you need to go, gives you visible radsuits, health in the exit room and sends you a postcard two weeks later; an intuitive place to traverse more neutral - map is a place where a variety of activities may occur... a traditional early doom 2 map layout (might not have been designed as a battleground as such) more chaotic - map dumps you in untenable situations; the monsters are not the only thing on the map that can kill or obstruct you; having to fight on slime or on treacherous platforms; part of the idea of the map might be picking the optimal route or even just intentionally getting the player lost Plot your own maps on this grid; plot your favourite maps on this grid; plot your favourite mappers on this grid; tell me why this scale is all wrong! 17 Share this post Link to post
yakfak Posted March 29, 2018 (y axis should really be Evil at the top and Good at the bottom, i wasn't thinking when i did that bit) 0 Share this post Link to post
Fonze Posted March 29, 2018 Just now, yakfak said: (y axis should really be Evil at the top and Good at the bottom, i wasn't thinking when i did that bit) Lol was just thinking the same thing. 0 Share this post Link to post
muumi Posted March 29, 2018 I thought this was about how well aligned textures are in those map sets.. 3 Share this post Link to post
RaphaelMode Posted March 29, 2018 The two chaotic/lawful axes sound like they'd frequently correlate, and when I attempt to put my own maps on this, they tend to either go off the scale to an extent hard to quantify, or get pulled in two directions of two aspects of the same axis (according to the detailed explanation) belonging to two opposite ends. Then there are other major aspects of a map that don't seem to be considered in this in any way. Perhaps the medium of maps is just too complex to represent like this! In RM_PORN, there's no combat whatsoever. You can be killed by monsters and arguably kill a monster too, but there's no combat present. Technically you can engage in "combat" in a few occasions, but in all those cases you'll just get stuck forever if you don't die. Is that chaotic "combat"? Layout-wise, it's impossible to get lost, and that's because taking a wrong path equals inevitable death. RM_5CENT has seemingly normal layout and combat, but what seems like helpfully presented solution is actually a deception of such an extent that it prevented everyone from beating the map despite the fact that... it's no harder than laeving home to get groceries. So to speak. I also made some lawful maps. Probably. I do think that I perceive maps and have opinions about them, I also understand all the concepts being talked about, but I don't perceive those concepts. To some extent I perceive those concepts on maps but other indescribable aspects dominate my attention. 2 Share this post Link to post
kmxexii Posted March 29, 2018 I like lawful layouts just fine but my heart belongs to chaos 2 Share this post Link to post
Nine Inch Heels Posted March 29, 2018 Whatever it is that I am into, it is impossible to represent with that chart. Disturbia is well placed, big up! I would think "NoChance" can fit in that spot just fine as well :-) 2 Share this post Link to post
yakfak Posted March 31, 2018 :) then I wonder what mapping factors I'm missing with these two axes, I thought I had captured everything apart from the map's looks 0 Share this post Link to post
Catpho Posted March 31, 2018 (edited) Yo @yakfak! Kinda off topic but i saw this thread, and it made me think that you could be a big rougelike fan! Are you? On topic: CHaOs 0 Share this post Link to post
RjY Posted March 31, 2018 I cannot understand Disturbia's placement at "most chaotic" on the layout axis. Obviously its similar placement on the combat axis is inarguable, but navigating the map is simple. It shows you exactly where to go at all times and there is even a network of teleporters for your convenience of backtracking to caches of consumables. A good example for -5 chaotic layout might be Rat in a Maze—"You've been thrown in this maze like a rat to be confused, disoriented and killed to sadistically entertain the architect." 0 Share this post Link to post
Grain of Salt Posted March 31, 2018 9 minutes ago, RjY said: Obviously its similar placement on the combat axis is inarguable, idk about that RjY. Also, putting HR on the second leftmost column doesn't leave much room for nuance in ranking the chaotic gameplay of a lot of other wads imo. 0 Share this post Link to post
