Huge new DOOM 1 map (5spiders.wad) looking for playtesters

Managed to get softlocked in a section which seemed to require the YK to progress, by retreating outside while the stairs were lowering, you can see in an fda I recorded: 5spidersfdabygal.zip

For the little I could play, compared to how much stuff was left to do, it picked my attention, doesn't look afraid to put the player to think outside the box a bit. Sort of Eternal Doom so far, which is intriguing. I'll keep it in standby for another time until the softlock is fixed or if by any chance I missed a way out.

4 hours ago, galileo31dos01 said:

Managed to get softlocked in a section which seemed to require the YK to progress, by retreating outside while the stairs were lowering, you can see in an fda I recorded: 5spidersfdabygal.zip

 

For the little I could play, compared to how much stuff was left to do, it picked my attention, doesn't look afraid to put the player to think outside the box a bit. Sort of Eternal Doom so far, which is intriguing. I'll keep it in standby for another time until the softlock is fixed or if by any chance I missed a way out.

To get the yellow key, you go down in the slime revine in the area with the yellow door. Go behind the soulsphere and you will see a little cage and head down. You will find the yellow key by full exploring the lower area I believe. 

On 9/29/2019 at 7:37 PM, galileo31dos01 said:

Managed to get softlocked in a section which seemed to require the YK to progress, by retreating outside while the stairs were lowering, you can see in an fda I recorded: 5spidersfdabygal.zip

 

For the little I could play, compared to how much stuff was left to do, it picked my attention, doesn't look afraid to put the player to think outside the box a bit. Sort of Eternal Doom so far, which is intriguing. I'll keep it in standby for another time until the softlock is fixed or if by any chance I missed a way out.

I will check into that and update you. Thank you for your interest and time.

October 3:

You did a lovely job! I really enjoyed to watch you play. (You could do yourself a favor and save from time to time. This is a 3 hour level, it will take you ages to play through it without saving. And it's frustrating to start all over again and again.)

I liked your style of playing since it is similar to mine. You are taking your time and not missing many hints. That's how you got the chainsaw and that saved you lots of ammunition and prevented health damage. That in turn allowed you to enter the voodoo doll/control room with 99% health. And even though you lost a lot of it figuring out how to open the door you still managed to get out with enough health to survive the fight in the first big open area right afterwards. And you have good fighting skills.

The softlock, yes, I had missed that but then, again, that's why I need testers. You did not miss another option. It was a real softlock. I would never have discovered it on my own since I knew I had to proceed to the next area. I have  fixed the softlock now and uploaded a new build on my original post on the top of this thread.

A technical question: Did you run it on PrBoom? Did you play on UV? Were there any setup problems?

On 9/29/2019 at 3:46 PM, I_Punch_Demons said:

Okay I did this as the first part of my stream. But I made the highlight and loaded it to Youtube for the express purpose of you seeing the map in action. You will see what I mean by potential soft locks. For me, the Voodoo one was a potential soft lock. The fact you don't have a 25% health after a required pain sector would mean anything under 10% health would not make this section beatable because you need to essentially shoot your self to proceed. However, I think I had some bugs related to GZDoom. But you will see what happened when I tried PRBoom+. 

 

 

I was very impressed by your patience and positive attitude. 

I have tested this map with PrBoom+ only and have never had the horrible effects in the area where you got stuck for good. I really cringed at the sight. It must be part of the lack of compatibility with GZDoom. There was a bug in build 1021 which is was I guess you used that caused the launch problem. It should be fixed now and I uploaded the latest build (1025) to the original post.

22 minutes ago, ryg said:

 

I was very impressed by your patience and positive attitude. 

I have tested this map with PrBoom+ only and have never had the horrible effects in the area where you got stuck for good. I really cringed at the sight. It must be part of the lack of compatibility with GZDoom. There was a bug in build 1021 which is was I guess you used that caused the launch problem. It should be fixed now and I uploaded the latest build (1025) to the original post.

 

So I was using the wrong version of PRboom which I guess is fixed now, I will revisit it! 

4 hours ago, I_Punch_Demons said:

So I was using the wrong version of PRboom which I guess is fixed now, I will revisit it! 

No, the bug was not in PrBoom, it was in my level.  Build 1021 and 1025 refer to my WAD.

This map is one that I may return to in the future, when I have time to delve into a lot of puzzles. I got to the pool with the computer area map, though when I got inside, I was unable to pick it up. 

There is so much work and detail put into every aspect, it's all a bit overwhelming.

I really, really like the stairs at the beginning, with the lights that go into each other. I didn't even mind the cramped space, as it gives the first part of the map a claustrophobic, eerie feel.

If I ever start streaming, this would be a good map to start with, as on my own, trying to solve each and every puzzle might get tedious.

Keep on mapping, @ryg!

I will say it again for the benefit of everyone playing 5spiders: There is no need to hump walls indiscriminately! Walls that can be activated are hinted either by a switch texture or a variant of it, like a thin switch, a hint on the floor (leakage coming out from under a hidden door), a door texture (or variant), an off texture (not off by one pixel that would require superhuman capabilities and would not be enjoyable for normal guys) or sticking out color variant (not just shading like under the bridges in the first big open area) or when you get a glimpse of the backside of a door (with a door texture) but you are accessing it from the hidden front-side. When you can see a texture that you cannot reach but suspect it can be activated that would be a case of trying to shoot it but then, again, maybe your time hasn't come yet and you have to figure out how to remove the obstacle in front of you. Yes, I agree, 5spiders is heavy on puzzles. Enjoy!

Additionally, if you approach an area that sports pools of blood and killed soldiers/monsters that should be taken as a hint that there is an element of danger there. Don't make the same mistake they did. Also, that would be an excellent moment to save your game.

I'm going to try this, too much controversy, It has to be something, also I like the pics, there is compohso so I like it more lol

On 10/4/2019 at 4:39 PM, nicolas monti said:

I'm going to try this, too much controversy, It has to be something, also I like the pics, there is compohso so I like it more lol

You are going to try my level because there is too much controversy about it? Lol. I like your approach.

4 hours ago, ryg said:

You are going to try my level because there is too much controversy about it? Lol. I like your approach.

So far I'm stuck at the room with the secret computer map in the pool. I'll keep trying though, I like how the map looks but the puzzles seem obtuse, maybe you were biased with your self knowledge of the linedefs and what triggers what. It can happen.

Anyways I will try to replay the map this week.

9 minutes ago, nicolas monti said:

So far I'm stuck at the room with the secret computer map in the pool. I'll keep trying though, I like how the map looks but the puzzles seem obtuse, maybe you were biased with your self knowledge of the linedefs and what triggers what. It can happen.

Anyways I will try to replay the map this week.

I get your point but I have two playtesters who figured it out. Even if you don't figure it out leave the map and go on. You will have more opportunities to get a computer map.

I have been streaming the last few days with @meapineapple who is so kind to play test my map.

In response to his comments and watching him play I started to overhaul the map.

I fixed very many of the problems meapineapple encountered, including tight corridors, a flittering wall, the lift where one gets stuck without explanation sometimes, switches that are removed from the effect (not all of them yet but some), the pop-up switch (which has three linedefs to activate and only the two at the front worked if the player does not come very close to the switch), the door that got stuck on a sergeant and some more. 

One of the lessons I learned was that if you give the player too many options he gets lost. It's the other extreme of linear progress where there is are no options. I have to find the right balance.

So I've made it through the first half. I admit to being off put by the size and number of puzzles at first, but after awhile, I got into it. The map is designed with a lot of care and detailing, looking very Ultimate Doom episode 1-ish. I especially like the scrolling stairs that raise up, that part was super cool.

The puzzles are actually not too difficult, as the map guides you to the areas you need to go, for the most part. Gameplay is good, too, starting off simple and increasing in difficulty slowly.

I will sometime try the second half.

Thank you for your feedback. I am glad you liked it. If you have criticism don’t hold back. I have had very critical play testers. Some got lost, one succeeded in soft locking himself in a way I did not anticipate, some points were valid, like if the map is so detailed it makes it very difficult to discern hints.

Watching some of them play I was shocked to see how some players rush through areas and how they do not look around carefully but turn left and right for fractions of seconds. No wonder they miss some hints.
Maybe my problem is that I assume that most players proceed as cautiously as I do as a player.

For example, when I play a map and there is a switch, I use it and If I don’t see what it activates I listen to the sound it creates and look around to see what it causes. Of course, playing with music on full volume makes it difficult to identify the direction a sound originates from.

Enjoy the second part!

I'm trying out your map, I'm dead in the middle of it. I'm a bit lazy to do a long review, but honestly there's a lot to say and it's a very good thing I think.

It's really not a map for everyone. To be honest, you have to be very persistent to appreciate it at its true value. 

If I could summarize this map, it would be a D!Zone map with a lot of details (but really a lot).

I'm really fascinated by your level, it's really unique in terms of aesthetics and gameplay. You deliberately chose a very obscure and narrow progression. Afterwards, there are unfortunately a lot of flaws, especially the generalized narrowness.

Anyway, I really encourage you to make more maps because you have your own style. This is one of the weirdest maps I've ever played. 

25 years making a map. I say bravo!

Best mod nr 1 🤟✨
EDIT: Specially registered for typing here, silent user from anno 2008 and sounds best mod, I will also post feedback someday. 

On 2/10/2020 at 9:14 PM, Roofi said:

I'm trying out your map, I'm dead in the middle of it. I'm a bit lazy to do a long review, but honestly there's a lot to say and it's a very good thing I think.

 

It's really not a map for everyone. To be honest, you have to be very persistent to appreciate it at its true value. 

 

If I could summarize this map, it would be a D!Zone map with a lot of details (but really a lot).

 

I'm really fascinated by your level, it's really unique in terms of aesthetics and gameplay. You deliberately chose a very obscure and narrow progression. Afterwards, there are unfortunately a lot of flaws, especially the generalized narrowness.

 

Anyway, I really encourage you to make more maps because you have your own style. This is one of the weirdest maps I've ever played. 

25 years making a map. I say bravo!

 

Thank you for your intelligent comments and analysis. I will continue to create maps because I just like to do it. You guys just get to play them as a side-effect. But I learned with the feedback I received after publishing 5spiders that it's important to listen to the public's comments and to incorporate suggested improvements gained from experiences of the players who sent me comments.

As a reaction to the comments I received I am currently splitting 5spiders into separate maps while fixing most of the flaws, improving gameplay and adding some new areas. I have seven maps ready up to now and will probably get to twelve.

Last question: I tried to figure out what a D!Zone map that you referred to is and came up clueless.

Please excuse the EXTREME bump.. But is there anything specifically Boom-requiring in this map, or it just a massive limit-removing map? I quite like it but want to clarify this before passing it onto others as "LR" only to have it blow up their port of choice :)

EDIT: I'm an idiot, it uses colormaps! Could have opened it in Slade and saved the bump. Oh well, a good wad like this deserves it anyway.

On 6/18/2021 at 6:53 AM, Doomkid said:

Please excuse the EXTREME bump.. But is there anything specifically Boom-requiring in this map, or it just a massive limit-removing map? I quite like it but want to clarify this before passing it onto others as "LR" only to have it blow up their port of choice :)

 

EDIT: I'm an idiot, it uses colormaps! Could have opened it in Slade and saved the bump. Oh well, a good wad like this deserves it anyway.

I actually used Slade just for adding colormaps. And yes, there are many Boom trigger types in the map. 

Regarding the extreme bump, you don't know how lucky you are. I have looked at doomworld today for the first time since March 2020. I hope to pick up DOOM editing some time in the near future and finish up the separate 5spiders maps as announced.