sarge

I'm surprised noone brought this up (or that I haven't seen it if they did) but I'm not sure I like the idea about the Sarge, that one of the articles, I forget which, said you would be in contact with at some point. It's alot scarier when u think ur the only human left in the universe.
Thoughts?

The earth is still full of humans, all this takes place on Mars, not earth.

Yeah, and in Doom, you were fighting to save Earth, so there was no "fear of being the last human in the universe".

Yeah, I know this, but u also have no idea how far this invasion from Hell has gotten already (meaning that there's a possibility that ur the last one). Besides, even disregarding that, my main point is that its scarier when ur on your own completely.

The_Aeromaster said:

Yeah, I know this, but u also have no idea how far this invasion from Hell has gotten already (meaning that there's a possibility that ur the last one). Besides, even disregarding that, my main point is that its scarier when ur on your own completely.

In Doom 2, Earth beams a message to you saying that there's a way to shut the portal from the other side so yes, he knows that he's more then the only one alive.

It doesn't bother me whatsoever - it gives more in depth feel to the mission objectives if there is actually a guy telling you what to do - what matters, however, is that you are alone in fighting the demons (with no annoying friendlies to watch your back), always with the impression that there's nobody there to aid you (with their guns).

And if you really want to play Doom 3 without a Sarge guy, you can always make your own mod without a Sarge guy to tell you your orders.

It would be cool if you loose contact with Sarge in the hell levels. Suddenly the PDA screen turnes fuzzy, connection failed, and no one can tell you anymore what to do next. Would increase the feel of being all alone in hell :)

Tetzlaff said:

It would be cool if you loose contact with Sarge in the hell levels. Suddenly the PDA screen turnes fuzzy, connection failed, and no one can tell you anymore what to do next. Would increase the feel of being all alone in hell :)

My sentiments exactly.

Tetzlaff said:

It would be cool if you loose contact with Sarge in the hell levels. Suddenly the PDA screen turnes fuzzy, connection failed, and no one can tell you anymore what to do next. Would increase the feel of being all alone in hell :)

Yeah, that would be really cool!

Obvious plot twist: After disappearing on you, Sarge comes at you, possessed, in the last part of the game. Or they pull a Metal Gear Solid, and it turns out Sarge was one of them the whole time.

IMJack said:

Obvious plot twist: After disappearing on you, Sarge comes at you, possessed, in the last part of the game. Or they pull a Metal Gear Solid, and it turns out Sarge was one of them the whole time.

Heh, I detect sarcasm?

IMJack said:

Obvious plot twist: After disappearing on you, Sarge comes at you, possessed, in the last part of the game. Or they pull a Metal Gear Solid, and it turns out Sarge was one of them the whole time.

Both of these twists seem......wrong somehow, especially if it turns out that Sarge is indeed the same hero as the Sarge in Q3A.

Ok, maybe the first one could be a good idea, the other one just doesn't seem to make sense - if he was one of them, then why would he help you at first?

Yeah those would be kool ideas^
I'm still against the base idea though. This guy is gonna have some intelligence, whether he gives u it or not, on what's goin on. Its scarier when u have no idea what the fuck is happening, doesn't anyone agree?
Granted you (as the player) know what's goin on, but live the game damn it.
[enter a dozen disagreeing arguements]

The_Aeromaster said:

Yeah those would be kool ideas^
This guy is gonna have some intelligence, whether he gives u it or not, on what's goin on. Its scarier when u have no idea what the fuck is happening, doesn't anyone agree?

Sarge is most likely trapped in some command center which has been sealed off to keep the demons out. The demons and the interdimensional disturbances have fucked up most of the systems on the base, leaving the humans virtually blind in many respects (kinda like in the old Doom). So I doubt Sarge will have much else to tell you apart from what you can do immediately.

What sort of intelligence were you referring to? Gateway experiments?
Well, in Doom it was revealed to the player that the UAC was doing gateway experiments in the backstory, so it would be prudent to assume that you are told before everything goes to Hell (although I'd prefer it to be so secret that even the marines guarding the rooms with these devices wouldn't know anything about it).
Even if it turns out that it is not known to the player, why would Sarge know it? He's just a damn Marine Sergeant - it's not like Sergeants have that high a rank.

Having a Sarge character like the one described would not only expand the plot but would allow for expanded gameplay. Lets be honest, there's only so much a player can figure out on his/her own. Having someone in the game direct you and give you hints would allow the developers to create more intricate puzzles without fear of making the game too confusing and difficult to play. Look at the resident evil and silent hill games. Those were damn scary IMO and you occasionally had characters come in and give you advice. It's also much better than finding things out in the game via notes and memos which often didnt seem too realistic in the above mentioned games. So I think it's a good idea.

As far as intelligence, I mean information. Yeah he's low rank, but he's probly gettin info from up the chain too, and I'm sure he knows a little more than you do. Sure it leaves room for expanding the plot but I'm still convinced it takes away from the fear, and the imagination, and the ingenuity of the player in trying to figure out what the hell to do besides blindly killing everything that you come across.

The_Aeromaster said:

As far as intelligence, I mean information. Yeah he's low rank, but he's probly gettin info from up the chain too, and I'm sure he knows a little more than you do.

He may know more about the layout of the base, but not about the experiments and some of the weird things that went und before Hell was unleashed.
And how would he be getting info from his superiours if they're dead?
Sarge may be one of the few survivors who, like I said before, could've barricaded himself inside the command centre.

dsm said:

He may know more about the layout of the base, but not about the experiments and some of the weird things that went und before Hell was unleashed.
Sarge may be one of the few survivors who, like I said before, could've barricaded himself inside the command centre.

That's a possibility, but that's all it is. This clown, if he's gonna tell u what to do, knows more than u do, otherwise u wouldn't need him to tell ya what to do. I'm sure he knows nothing about what they've been doing at the area where he's been posted for x many months/years too. He's higher rank than you, so he has access to more areas than you, and knows more about what's been going on up there. The mystery won't be as evident when he starts giving you key information that u need to carry out your mission. [humor] I wouldn't take orders from some pussy who locks himself inside the comm center and sends u to do the dirty work. [humor]

Besides, this is still off from why I originally started this thread. I wanted to know how ya'll thought it would effect the atmosphere if u have someone else to rely on instead of being the only guy in the facility (as far as you know) and not knowing the extent of how far the invasion has gone, or even knowing that it is an actual invasion. And when u get in contact with a superior who's gonna give you instructions on how to stop this and how to prevent that, you'll figure stuff out. I found it alot scarier, and more fun in the original Doom where you hadta figure it out for yourself.

The_Aeromaster said:


That's a possibility, but that's all it is. This clown, if he's gonna tell u what to do, knows more than u do, otherwise u wouldn't need him to tell ya what to do. I'm sure he knows nothing about what they've been doing at the area where he's been posted for x many months/years too. He's higher rank than you, so he has access to more areas than you, and knows more about what's been going on up there. The mystery won't be as evident when he starts giving you key information that u need to carry out your mission. [humor] I wouldn't take orders from some pussy who locks himself inside the comm center and sends u to do the dirty work. [humor]

Maybe you should just wait and see what it'd be like in the final game before judging it - like with the lacking use key (which people claim functions perfectly). I for one am confident that it will NOT ruin the atmosphere.

Besides, this is still off from why I originally started this thread. I wanted to know how ya'll thought it would effect the atmosphere if u have someone else to rely on instead of being the only guy in the facility (as far as you know) and not knowing the extent of how far the invasion has gone, or even knowing that it is an actual invasion. And when u get in contact with a superior who's gonna give you instructions on how to stop this and how to prevent that, you'll figure stuff out. I found it alot scarier, and more fun in the original Doom where you hadta figure it out for yourself.

I believe I already answered that question to some extent but here's an expansion:
I think it'd be really great for the atmosphere - have some badass superior scared enough to be hidin' out in a command centre (because he knows that he'll do more good there, or maybe because he's out of ammo - you don't have to be a pussy to hide), plus it'll make more sense and add a more realistic feel to have a superior to tell you what you will have to do. You're still alone in your part of the base with nobody to aid you with their guns - it's still you against them.

i think it would be cool if you encounter only few humans, most of them already gone completely mad, watch em babble strange stuff, smear words on the walls in their own blood, watch em commit suicide...whatever! but one thing i don't want is a place where u can relax and get your missions, info or whatever....it has to be dark and depressing the whole time, u gotta have that feeling that you are on your own, no one will help you....also, i hope for the mood to be at least partially like doom1 was....episode 1 being fast paced, semi-realistic (in case of doom3 very realistic) settings, episode 2 being very strange, architecture and mood wise, (btw. shores of hell had excellent music, using it for some pwads of mine) and episode 3 being pure horror, difficulty / action / setting wise...also, i hope they don`t make hell too dark..not some twisted dark dimension or something quakeish, rather red, and bright in places, dark in others....i wanna see that infernal sky, those pentagrams and stuff! i like it old school! :)

A Drowning Mind said:

i think it would be cool if you encounter only few humans, most of them already gone completely mad, watch em babble strange stuff, smear words on the walls in their own blood, watch em commit suicide...whatever! but one thing i don't want is a place where u can relax and get your missions, info or whatever....it has to be dark and depressing the whole time, u gotta have that feeling that you are on your own, no one will help you....

That's more along the lines of what I'm talking about, u don't have that feel of being completely on your own. I'm not saying that will ruin the atmosphere, dsm, ur right we won't know till it comes out if it is good or bad, but it will definately change the atmosphere, it's just not gonna feel like the original doom.

A Drowning Mind said:

also, i hope for the mood to be at least partially like doom1 was....episode 1 being fast paced, semi-realistic (in case of doom3 very realistic) settings, episode 2 being very strange, architecture and mood wise, (btw. shores of hell had excellent music, using it for some pwads of mine) and episode 3 being pure horror, difficulty / action / setting wise...also, i hope they don`t make hell too dark..not some twisted dark dimension or something quakeish, rather red, and bright in places, dark in others....i wanna see that infernal sky, those pentagrams and stuff! i like it old school! :)

I like what he's onto^

The_Aeromaster said:

That's more along the lines of what I'm talking about, u don't have that feel of being completely on your own. I'm not saying that will ruin the atmosphere, dsm, ur right we won't know till it comes out if it is good or bad, but it will definately change the atmosphere, it's just not gonna feel like the original doom.

Very little in the new Doom game feels like the old Doom - the new enemies don't look like the old enemies for instance and it doesn't have the mug in the hud and you can't run at 90 mph.

Let's be realistic here, Doom 3 is a new game, but it is going to pay a lot of homage to the original in terms of concept and in terms of trying to make it as frightening a game as possible. What do I care if it feels exactly like Doom? I just want the game to be the fucking best id game since Doom 2 which I'm confident that it will be.

dsm said:

Very little in the new Doom game feels like the old Doom - the new enemies don't look like the old enemies for instance and it doesn't have the mug in the hud and you can't run at 90 mph.

Let's be realistic here, Doom 3 is a new game, but it is going to pay a lot of homage to the original in terms of concept and in terms of trying to make it as frightening a game as possible.

No it don't need to be a copy of the original doom, but u just said it, and I think this will take away from the fear. That's all I wanted to discuss, and get other people's opinions on it. It's not working though, me n u are really the only ones discussing it. Maybe we should drop it, i dunno, ur the boss.

dsm said:

What do I care if it feels exactly like Doom? I just want the game to be the fucking best id game since Doom 2 which I'm confident that it will be.

I agree completely with that.

Is it me or does the Sarge idea remind me of System Shock 2, where you're really being helped by SHODAN and not Dr Politburo (or however you spell it) as you think? :p

He could even be the entity that created the whole mess you know...food for thought.

Livo said:

Is it me or does the Sarge idea remind me of System Shock 2, where you're really being helped by SHODAN and not Dr Politburo (or however you spell it) as you think? :p

He could even be the entity that created the whole mess you know...food for thought.

Yeah someone suggested that already, and that could provide opportunity for an interesting plot twist, but someone else can start a thread about that. I've been trying to see how many people actually realize that it ain't gonna be as scary as it would be if u had no contact with anyone. Like I said to dsm though, it ain't workin.
That happens with most threads, I notice, get way off track and just end up with 2 clowns arguing over somethin that had nothin to do with the base subject. That's what I get for tryin to discuss somethin on a forum.

The_Aeromaster said:

Maybe we should drop it, i dunno, ur the boss.

No, no, no, we shouldn't drop it. You have a point, it's just that I don't feel the same as you.

As in: I don't agree with you, but you're entitled to your opinion. Sorry if I seemed to "oppress" your opinion - that was unintended.

I welcome your opinion as well, and respect yours above many others. But I think we should drop it cause me n u are the only ones talkin about it and I dunno about you but I've used most of my side of it up^.