Is anybody else seriously disappointed with Eternal?

I like it.  I prefer Doom 2016 for a few reasons. This game improves on 2016 in a number of areas, definitely.  But in other areas I feel like I did after the glory of the Star wars Trilogy after watching the Prequels.   WTF did you do there....

12 hours ago, Sergeant_Mark_IV said:

Second level in, I'm actually enjoying it, it's a huge improvement over D2016 so far (minor the stupid tutorials).
I'm glad that I have kept my expectations at floor level.

That's...unexpected. But good!

But answer the OP's question: Nope.

17 hours ago, Redneckerz said:

This makes incredibly little sense on a technical level, and on a emotional level it just sounds irrational. Besides, you are comparing two development environments that are 27 years apart as of writing.

Nah, both games called doom and centered around traversing maps with different mobs on them. One makes you go trough closed-arenas and connected tunnels over and over, and other makes you go trough maze-like levels with different scenarios on each map. There's no doubt in my mind what's repetitive and boring after 20 mins and what's imaginative, lasting and most importantly for this discussion: hard to make.

18 hours ago, Redneckerz said:

The fact that you claim something like the bolded tells me you have very little idea of how game development works. I am sorry to put that so bluntly. On a practical level, the way developers design games couldn't be further from being lazy. The paradigms used, yes, those can be discussed, but calling current game dev design as lazy is just insultive.

That's just a language barrier, i guess. I meant that core game design is really simple(because with current system they don't need to fine-tune the challenge and can throw at you hoards of mobs without second thought about resource management) and repetitive in application (because they don't do anything outside making you go trough arenas of some sort, kill everyone,door unlocks, go the next area, repeat). 

Look there's no point in discussing this, it's just a bad game that i don't like, and no one will make me like it, as well as one will make you dislike it. 

12 minutes ago, twq1337 said:

it's just a bad game that i don't like,

I don't like =/= Bad Game.

Sorry to tell you.

For a game you don't like, you sure love talking about it.

No point really in posting anything then, other then to tell everyone how much of a "REAL DOOM" fan you are, if you don't even want to discuss it in a open minded manner.

1 minute ago, jazzmaster9 said:

I don't like =/= Bad Game.

Sorry to tell you.

 

For a game you don't like, you sure love talking about it.

Yeah, i know, i kinda fixated on hating this game, probably cause i really expected to enjoy new doom game in 2016 and everyone else seems to live in different dimension with different version of new doom. So now i try to find people that share my opinion so i won't loose my sanity.

And yeah, for example Deadly premonition is a bad game, but i love it. So when i say doom is a bad game i mean it outside of my emotions about it. Gameplay's wack, map design's wack and even graphics are wack for a new game(did you even see those textures of people in blocks?).

30 minutes ago, jazzmaster9 said:

you know its trolling when you have to resort, to childish comments like this.

I don't know why i even took you seriously.

I have that with the recent influx of people as Eternal got released. So i rather not bother and focus on other Doom things, like making news items or such.

Also John Linneman from DF said its amazing so like the bleeting sheep that i am, i trust his opinion 100% over any new member here. :P

25 minutes ago, twq1337 said:

Nah, both games called doom and centered around traversing maps with different mobs on them. One makes you go trough closed-arenas and connected tunnels over and over, and other makes you go trough maze-like levels with different scenarios on each map. There's no doubt in my mind what's repetitive and boring after 20 mins and what's imaginative, lasting and most importantly for this discussion: hard to make.

Glad you take into account nearly 3 decades of game evolution, then!

A fine day as ever to link to DF's review of the game. Disregard the opinion making, but it does provide a look at one of Eternal's levels.

Please tell me if the above level design (starting from 26:04) is repetitive to you.

Level design has changed. Doom 2016 was praised for bringing back some of the level design choices back from the 90s. Eternal emphasizes much more verticality, by comparison.

Quote

That's just a language barrier, i guess. I meant that core game design is really simple(because with current system they don't need to fine-tune the challenge and can throw at you hoards of mobs without second thought about resource management)

No, its not. Core game design is easier in the sense of advanced development tools, but its not simple to generate assets. You need quite a reliance on math knowledge and the like. 

Quote

Look there's no point in discussing this, it's just a bad game that i don't like, and no one will make me like it, as well as one will make you dislike it. 

''I don't actually know what i am trying to convey, but look, its just a bad game that i don't like.'' is a more accurate statement.

In which case, why are you posting that, exactly? You don't like the game. What can be discussed if any argument is shut down with ''Look, there is no point discussing this''?

11 minutes ago, twq1337 said:

 So now i try to find people that share my opinion so i won't loose my sanity.

This is very healthy way to live...

11 minutes ago, twq1337 said:

Gameplay's wack, map design's wack and even graphics are wack for a new game(did you even see those textures of people in blocks?).

Nice Opinion, cuz that's all it is.

Im still yet to see anything that shows Doom Eternal is objectively bad, apart from the Bethesda launcher and Denuvo-Free fiasco.

I mean, I hate TNT: Evolution, I think it's rather boring and drags on for wayyyy to long, but I would dare not call that a Bad Game.

Jazz, the way I see forums like this is that each post IS the poster's own personal opinion, but not everyone sees them that way.

Does a poster HAVE to state that their opinion IS an opinion by using the word in each of their posts? If they don't, is it interpreted as fact?

28 minutes ago, Foebane72 said:

Does a poster HAVE to state that their opinion IS an opinion by using the word in each of their posts? If they don't, is it interpreted as fact?

 

sure about that pal?

1 hour ago, twq1337 said:

And yeah, for example Deadly premonition is a bad game, but i love it.

1 hour ago, twq1337 said:

So when i say doom is a bad game i mean it outside of my emotions about it. 

That's no longer stating an opinion.

He literally thinks the game is objectively bad,

its bad not because he doesn't like it, he believes that the game is Bad as a FACT.

but this is neither here not there. Don't wanna derail this further.

Not disappointed at all with this game personally. I knew what I was getting after playing Doom '16 and watching trailers for this one so nothing surprised me as far as how the game plays. I think they knocked it out of the park with their new direction and can't wait for dlc and I haven't finished the base game yet (but am very close I think). Gameplay is crazy intense. Atmosphere is just incredible. Secrets are fun to hunt down. It's not The Ultimate Doom or Doom 2 and I never expected it to be that in the slightest. It's just a ton of fun to play.

To all the people who are here just shitting all over it for it not being "doom enough" for them, maybe try clearing your mind of those expectations and go in and try to take in what this game has to offer which isn't the same old thing from over 20 years ago. I went into Doom '16 with some of those expectations and began to feel a bit disappointed after a few map. Once I did just that it made it a hell of a lot more enjoyable :)

31 minutes ago, Foebane72 said:

Jazz, the way I see forums like this is that each post IS the poster's own personal opinion, but not everyone sees them that way.

 

Does a poster HAVE to state that their opinion IS an opinion by using the word in each of their posts? If they don't, is it interpreted as fact?

 

You can post your opinionn, sure, but take care that also if you take your opinion like some subjective, or objective, and more calling it bad names, take for sure people will take bad your opinion. Also if something like you say it's only to hurt other people ,  is really necesary?

I came to post about how I'm seriously disappointed that it doesn't have four times the levels because it's fantastic and I don't want it to end.  Then the thought arrives that it's funny how the negative threads draw in the yeasayers, the positive ones the naysayers.

That's balance on The Internet for you: everything covered in shit and jizz.

On 3/21/2020 at 11:24 PM, Tony_Danza_the_boss said:

I just finished it and have to say I'm pretty underwhelmed. There are elements of greatness within the game, but it ultimately feels like it takes two steps back from what made Doom 2016 so good. The glory kills, combat, graphics are all top notch, but it really stops there.

 

The platforming is utterly ridiculous. This is Doom, not Super Mario. Why am i jumping from platform to platform, doing Tomb Raider flips off monkey bars to get to a shiny 1UP? Chuck E. Cheese tokens for suit upgrades? Floating, glowing weapon pickups straight out of 1996 instead of the cool pickup animations from D16 we got? What game am I even playing?

 

And then there's the resource management. My god running out of ammo for my shotgun on the first level was downright infuriating. You're telling me I can't rip and tear how i want and have to watch a lengthy chainsaw animation 4-5 times per fight to farm ammo. Are you kidding me?

 

The story is equally convoluted. D16 was concise, focused and didn't bounce around from locales other than Mars and Hell. Here, you're in a different dimension/planet every level and it's incredibly jarring. On top of that, there are entire textlogs you have to read if you want to understand what happened between D16 and Eternal. And the absurd amount of lore that was added to this game is so incredibly dumb. Someone at Id is a 40k fanboy and was definitely inspired by the lore of that series and tried to bring it here which does not work at all. I don't care about the Makyrs, the Argenta, Urdak, etc. Doom has been about humanity and hell, the UAC, weapons, and killing demons. The sheer absurdity and convolution of lore that was added in for no reason whatsoever makes the game incredibly confusing if you're not willing to spend good amounts of time reading the textlogs you pick up.

 

I really wanted to like this game, and as a shooter, it's decent. But the changes to the formula and to the overall game are just too jarring for me to really like it as a Doom game. Jarring interruptive cutscenes and tutorials, abhorrent ammo caps, ridiculous platforming and a story that reads like a coked-up fan fiction gone bad just really detract from an otherwise decent Doom game. Really hope Id do not go this arcadey way for the next installment. 

I'm 5-6 hours in so far and can see where you're coming from.  I was hoping I wasn't the only one thinking the platforming was way, way over the top.  I can't tell you how many times I died trying to jump around the mountain with the fire lake, over and over and over again.  Or the monkey bar deal where you have to hit a lever and get to the bar and to wherever you're going before it times out.  I didn't think this stuff was in the 2016 version I played.  Or wasting 30 minutes figuring out I didn't have to waste a burst to get to the bar because if I did I couldn't get to the target wall.  Good lord that was frustrating.

I loved the gunplay and the visuals and the overall environment.  I can take or leave the way the story is doled out as most games seem to be going this way.  I read the tiles for the first couple of hours and then decided to not waste my time anymore.

One other thing.  I'm 61 so I don't know if that has anything to do with it or not, but I'm playing at the lowest difficulty and some areas are seriously insanely difficult.  I cannot imagine playing this at any higher level.

On 3/22/2020 at 1:19 AM, Foebane72 said:

 

OP, shush, you'll get us all crucified with remarks like that! They've already nailed me to the cross over saying the same thing! And for loving Doom 3, too! It's a capital crime over here!

 

Hahahaha, he speaks the truth and the platforming does blow IMO.  I'm not sure it needs to be in a game where slaughtering is the main focus.

I was very very relieved after playing the game, so I suppose I am the opposite of disappointed. I’d like to preface this by saying that my love for id Software extends far beyond Doom. I’m a massive Quake and Rage 1 fan, so maybe I’m a little more lenient than most here in what I can tolerate in my Doom games. 
 

That said, while I’m totally happy with the game and plan on playing it for years to come, it isn’t perfect and it doesn’t totally make Doom 2016 obsolete as the devs have been claiming.

Lets start with the good:

POSITIVES -

Variety:

In environments, in gameplay, in content

Pacing:

The game is great at setting pacing between exploring, combat, and traversal. It is also the perfect length. Of course I’d like more content, but I was very satisfied by the end of the game.

Combat Loop:

It’s everything they claimed it would be: fast, visceral, and cerebral. Not drastically more so than Doom 2016, just different. It is way less forgiving when it comes to failing to play the game “the right way”

Gamey-Ness:

It makes no apologies for being a video game and I absolutely love that. It feels like most decisions were made based on gameplay and not on how “realistic” it might be. This may have been at the detriment of some other aspects of the game, though, and that brings me to the negatives...

NEGATIVES -

Atmosphere:

The game is simply too bright and clashes aesthetics to a point where it loses the thick atmosphere other Doom games absolutely nail. There are portions of the game that scream DOOM, but more often than not it felt way too “Modern Blizzard” when it comes to atmosphere and art direction.

Difficulty:

I played on UV and for the most part it was perfect, I died about 2 or 3 times per level and it made my palms sweat and I had to be in a zone to win. But there were some intense difficulty spikes that were really jarring and I think some of those instances could have used some more play testing.

Progression:

I had this same problem with D2016, putting mobility options behind progression systems may work for platformers and character action games, it is just very frustrating in an id FPS. Also, there are just way too many options going on.

Technology:

Simply put, I expected more. Now, id has always employed some of the best artists around, so I’m not questioning graphics. It’s more of, I was expecting something that truly wowed me... instead I got something that is roughly on par with the game they released 4 years ago. Fine for any other studio, but this is id Software we are talking about. I feel targeting 60fps for old outdated consoles really limited us PC guys at the top end.

———————————————————

I feel the reception here is pretty on par with what I remember the Doom 2016 launch being like. Meaning, overall pretty polarized. Now, from what I’ve experienced, that’s pretty par for course regarding doomworld when it comes to id Software games post-Quake 1.

I’ll end this with something directed to the disappointed folk: try going in wanting to enjoy a game you purchase to play. If you can’t get pumped for the game, the lore, the art, the music. Save your energy for something you can really immerse yourself in and jive with. Life’s too short to force yourself to play games that aren’t on your wavelength, much less complaining about them. Try not to waste your energy convincing other people why they shouldn’t like the things you also dislike, save it for the things you love.

4 minutes ago, Obzen said:

I was very very relieved after playing the game, so I suppose I am the opposite of disappointed. I’d like to preface this by saying that my love for id Software extends far beyond Doom. I’m a massive Quake and Rage 1 fan, so maybe I’m a little more lenient than most here in what I can tolerate in my Doom games. 
 

That said, while I’m totally happy with the game and plan on playing it for years to come, it isn’t perfect and it doesn’t totally make Doom 2016 obsolete as the devs have been claiming.

 

Lets start with the good:

 

POSITIVES -

 

Variety:

In environments, in gameplay, in content

 

Pacing:

The game is great at setting pacing between exploring, combat, and traversal. It is also the perfect length. Of course I’d like more content, but I was very satisfied by the end of the game.

 

Combat Loop:

It’s everything they claimed it would be: fast, visceral, and cerebral. Not drastically more so than Doom 2016, just different. It is way less forgiving when it comes to failing to play the game “the right way”

 

Gamey-Ness:

It makes no apologies for being a video game and I absolutely love that. It feels like most decisions were made based on gameplay and not on how “realistic” it might be. This may have been at the detriment of some other aspects of the game, though, and that brings me to the negatives...

NEGATIVES -

 

Atmosphere:

The game is simply too bright and clashes aesthetics to a point where it loses the thick atmosphere other Doom games absolutely nail. There are portions of the game that scream DOOM, but more often than not it felt way too “Modern Blizzard” when it comes to atmosphere and art direction.

 

Difficulty:

I played on UV and for the most part it was perfect, I died about 2 or 3 times per level and it made my palms sweat and I had to be in a zone to win. But there were some intense difficulty spikes that were really jarring and I think some of those instances could have used some more play testing.

 

Progression:

I had this same problem with D2016, putting mobility options behind progression systems may work for platformers and character action games, it is just very frustrating in an id FPS. Also, there are just way too many options going on.

 

Technology:

Simply put, I expected more. Now, id has always employed some of the best artists around, so I’m not questioning graphics. It’s more of, I was expecting something that truly wowed me... instead I got something that is roughly on par with the game they released 4 years ago. Fine for any other studio, but this is id Software we are talking about. I feel targeting 60fps for old outdated consoles really limited us PC guys at the top end.

 

———————————————————

I feel the reception here is pretty on par with what I remember the Doom 2016 launch being like. Meaning, overall pretty polarized. Now, from what I’ve experienced, that’s pretty par for course regarding doomworld when it comes to id Software games post-Quake 1.

 

I’ll end this with something directed to the disappointed folk: try going in wanting to enjoy a game you purchase to play. If you can’t get pumped for the game, the lore, the art, the music. Save your energy for something you can really immerse yourself in and jive with. Life’s too short to force yourself to play games that aren’t on your wavelength, much less complaining about them. Try not to waste your energy convincing other people why they shouldn’t like the things you also dislike, save it for the things you love.

I think a lot of people are in the boat I am.  You can both love some aspects and feel disappointed about some others in this or any other game.  Either doesn't exclude one from sharing those feelings on a forum such as this.  Nobody forced me to play Doom Eternal since I've played Doom all my life it was a normal thing to do.  I'm pretty sure people don't buy games thinking "I'm going to hate every minute of this", if they do, then there's something else going on in their life that needs to be addressed.  I play all assortment of games and rate them critically on the various forum sites.  My hope is you don't think people come on here and try to "convince others to dislike things", that's not what a forum is for and I don't see that happening on any of the ones I participate in.

3 hours ago, jazzmaster9 said:

No i understood just fine, if they say Doom Eternal is meh, Early No Review copies to follow the hype, Less Views.

Nice try though.

 

Yes i do, thanks for asking.

you know its trolling when you have to resort, to childish comments like this.

I don't know why i even took you seriously.

Looks like you have something personal to me. Sorry sweet boy, but I already have a boyfriend :-*

And now two steps back.
Where did I said that

15 hours ago, jazzmaster9 said:

the only reason anyone can like DE is because we don't know any better or are forced to like it.

Or even better question, where did you think i said that?
Because what I was saying is that advertising shows thing only from good sides, and keeping silent about thing flaws.
And even more, I personally said that

17 hours ago, Kronecker–Capelli said:

Again, I, and other peoples, dont says that game is bad. Its okay, but only for one or two times for the most part. But I can see a reasons why someone can play in it for hundred of times.

For me it looks like you like Eternal TOO MUCH and cant stand aside when someone says "I dont like it, its a bad game".

I'm in the Super Gore Nest level and I reminded myself about how much I enjoyed the mid to later levels of Doom 2016.  After seeing how much people enjoyed Mars Core and Arc Complex, the best part is yet to come.

I really love the more colorful graphics and the more strategic approach to Eternal compared to 2016.

And tell me why this game is critically acclaimed across the board?  A great suggestion is to actually finish the game before making a thread like this.

um...WAT

4 hours ago, Foebane72 said:

Does a poster HAVE to state that their opinion IS an opinion by using the word in each of their posts? If they don't, is it interpreted as fact?

Let's show some examples. 

2 hours ago, force58 said:

I'm 5-6 hours in so far and can see where you're coming from.  I was hoping I wasn't the only one thinking the platforming was way, way over the top.  I can't tell you how many times I died trying to jump around the mountain with the fire lake, over and over and over again.  Or the monkey bar deal where you have to hit a lever and get to the bar and to wherever you're going before it times out.  I didn't think this stuff was in the 2016 version I played.  Or wasting 30 minutes figuring out I didn't have to waste a burst to get to the bar because if I did I couldn't get to the target wall.  Good lord that was frustrating.

 

I loved the gunplay and the visuals and the overall environment.  I can take or leave the way the story is doled out as most games seem to be going this way.  I read the tiles for the first couple of hours and then decided to not waste my time anymore.

 

One other thing.  I'm 61 so I don't know if that has anything to do with it or not, but I'm playing at the lowest difficulty and some areas are seriously insanely difficult.  I cannot imagine playing this at any higher level.

This is a well worded opinion. 

On 3/22/2020 at 6:16 AM, twq1337 said:

Well, they killed doom when they stopped making good maps and thinking about good monster behavior design. Shooting stuff is cool, but you gotta admit that there were a lot of quite moments in original games that paced that "brutality" and that's where Romero comes in. He showed us how to make maps and why this is important and i'm not saying that there's no one outside that period of time that can do good maps. You can find a ton of custom wads with better design then original 3 episodes, but doom 2016 and eternal feels like their levels were shit out by Oblige generator with a little bit of afterwards polish. New game design is just lazy: instead of putting us trough pre-designed situations where every hp and bullet count they make a system where there no need to worry about hp, cause you can just punch red glowing mob, or bullets, cause you can wipe out that 'ol chainsaw. Every encounter feels the same, especially doesn't help that color pallet is pretty dull compared to ultimate/ doom 2, which is weird considering how many time has past. just think about blue fire, nothing on this level of contrast or eye catching in new games. 

So in the end we got a skin of an old game stretched to fit new idea. Some may find this cool, but pls don't call this "OLD-SCHOOL", nothing here's old-school, if only we're talking about 2005 looking graphics. I genuinely hate these games, they ruined map obsession with good game design and showed us that crowds can just ignore criticism even on the internet and it doesn't have to be a real life issues.

So yeah, these games are trash, here's better game utilizing the same gameplay loop worth your supporting https://store.steampowered.com/app/422970/Devil_Daggers/

 

This is drivel. 

It’s one of the best FPS games I’ve played. Definitely the best I’ve played in the last decade. The ridiculous amount of attacks defenses and evasions you constantly have to utilize are a breath of fresh air. A great FPS game to me is very heavy on real-time strategy, which this game does masterfully. 

99% of the polarization I’ve seen has come entirely from the fact that it’s following up 2016 and I guess people wanted something more similar to 2016, but I’ve never played that one so... I’ve just had a fucking ball 

3 hours ago, Obzen said:

Technology:

Simply put, I expected more. Now, id has always employed some of the best artists around, so I’m not questioning graphics. It’s more of, I was expecting something that truly wowed me... instead I got something that is roughly on par with the game they released 4 years ago. Fine for any other studio, but this is id Software we are talking about. I feel targeting 60fps for old outdated consoles really limited us PC guys at the top end. 

DE throws around a lot more geometry and overall higher texture resolution than 2016. Watch that Digital Foundry review, they go into some nice technical detail. The optimisation they did in this engine is next level stuff.

9 hours ago, Kronecker–Capelli said:

For me it looks like you like Eternal TOO MUCH and cant stand aside when someone says "I dont like it, its a bad game".

Notice how the original posted criticism of the game?

Also notice why I didn't jump on him because of that?

Why is that?

I notice a language barrier issue here since i can tell english is not your first language.

13 hours ago, ptoing said:

 

DE throws around a lot more geometry and overall higher texture resolution than 2016. Watch that Digital Foundry review, they go into some nice technical detail. The optimisation they did in this engine is next level stuff.

Oh I definitely did watch the DF video when it came out. Between the higher poly count and improved texture resolution combined with the higher enemy count, there’s no doubt it’s impressive stuff compared to 2016.

That’s a pretty large gap though, 4 years. That’s nearly a console generation. It seems iterative and not so much the revolution I’m used to from id Software.
 

That said, I’d like to emphasize that my “negatives” are nitpicks and are not strong opinions at all. It’s still an amazing looking game and I was consistently impressed with the environments and enemies on display.

1 hour ago, Obzen said:

That’s a pretty large gap though, 4 years. That’s nearly a console generation. It seems iterative and not so much the revolution I’m used to from id Software.

You also have to remember that they need to sell the game to people who do not have a super current GPU, etc. I am really happy that I can play it at 1920x1200 at 60fps with my GTX1080 and Ryzen 7 1800X at high detail.

Not everyone who plays games is the core gamer type who gets the newest stuff asap. Companies know this. And hence they take it into account as well as consoles.

Though I am sure there will be an update that will support raytracing and the like in the future for those who have the hardware for it.

On 3/23/2020 at 8:16 PM, Kronecker–Capelli said:

For me it looks like you like Eternal TOO MUCH and cant stand aside when someone says "I dont like it, its a bad game".

For me though it seems like you hate Eternal too much and can't stand when one says "I love it"

Why am I saying this? Because of the whole "reviewers are paid" thing.

On 3/23/2020 at 10:12 PM, Dr. Toboggan said:

I’ve never played that one

You really should though, D16 is where every Doom fan agrees it's great. IMO Eternal is way better, but try that for sure.

On 3/23/2020 at 7:32 PM, Obzen said:

intense difficulty spikes

Boss fights give you sentinel armor if you die a few times. And those have no negative effect on progression.

So, I think game is being very nice generally.

23 hours ago, ptoing said:

The optimisation they did in this engine is next level stuff.

1000FPS max, that shit is superb.

Though I never get above 200 in pause menu. (In-game it's 50-60FPS) And my System isn't High-End

6 minutes ago, The Doommer said:

1000FPS max, that shit is superb.

Though I never get above 200 in pause menu. (In-game it's 50-60FPS) And my System isn't High-End

I don't think many people, if anyone, are getting 1k frames atm, it is mostly future-proofing.
I got 60fps steady, never dropped. Had VSYNC on though, so no idea what framerate I could have gotten. In 2016 I topped out a lot with VSYNC off.
But yeah, really good stuff.

1 minute ago, ptoing said:

future-proofing.

Still a great idea, makes the game not need a remaster for another 20 years probably

I have just beaten it. I rate it 8.5/10. Way superior to Doom 2016 (which is a 7/10).
Game starts weak but gains a lot of traction at Super Gore Nest, Final boss is really worth it, New Game+ with cheats is actually interesting.