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AtimZarr1

The Lost City of Hebeth - Spoilers

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In the Mars Core level, you enter the Lost City of Hebeth at the end before taking the slipgate to Sentinel Prime. Here is its Codex entry:

 

"Amidst the long and enduring history of Sentinel civilization, there are moments in antiquity that have become buried in time – forgotten chapters that remain concealed to Sentinel historians, waiting to be unearthed. The fallen city of Hebeth is one such tale, all but forgotten to the tomes of legacies past. Once a prosperous port city – a proud, gleaming marker of conquest for the distant tribe of Bethian clansmen of the outer worlds – Hebeth bridged the disparate Sentinel cities with the ingenious design of slipgate invention. But it was not meant to last, and among those cities lost in the crusades of Sentinel past was Hebeth. now little more than a smoldering ruin swallowed by the quaking surface of a once habitable Mars."

 

Doom Eternal's story implies a multiverse, since there is no mention of Earth being invaded before despite the Slayer being confirmed to be Doomguy from the Classic series. In this universe, it seems Earth is being invaded for the first time.

 

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In Doom 3, the marine learns about an ancient Martian civilization that lived on Mars a long time ago. All that's left of them are ruins, artifacts, and tablets found underground. The UAC was able to develop teleportation thanks to the ancient teleporters found in the alien ruins. Deciphering their tablets also tell a story of how the Martians were destroyed by the demons long ago, but some of the survivors may have fled to Earth. One tablet in particular featured a nameless "Hero" that fought the demons long ago using the Soul Cube. His fate is unknown, but a sarcophagus in "The Chamber of the Hero" can be found in the ruins. Here is an excerpt from Pierce Roger's audio log found in Site 3:

 

"The ancient people battled the same demons that are attacking us now. The demons came through the teleporters that they built, just like now. They created the Soul Cube and used it to stop the demons, to drive them back to Hell."

 

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My theory is that the Martians in Doom 3 are a tribe of Sentinels from Argent D'Nur, and the Lost City of Hebeth is a missing link between the two. Both civilizations pioneered teleportation technology, both built ruins beneath Mars, and both were destroyed by the demons. Both had a nameless hero that could singlehandedly fight back against the demons (The Hero and the Slayer) and both heroes were seemingly sealed into a sarcophagus. Since Eternal confirms the Slayer is Doomguy, the Doomguy easter egg as The Hero in Doom 3 could indeed be showing Doomguy fighting the demons for the Sentinels (before he had become the Slayer).

 

250px-Ancient_Martian_Hero_Tablet.jpg

 

The Doom Slayer's true sarcophagus would rest in Hell, while the sarcophagus on Doom 3's Mars was perhaps created as a stand-in grave by the Sentinels at a later date (since his body was missing and we know some of the Sentinels respected the Slayer, as seen on Sentinel Prime).

 

In Doom 2016, you can find a carving image of a figure wielding a cube-like object and fighting against demons. Considering most of the carvings in that game are about the Slayer, it is reasonable to assume that figure is also the Slayer/Doomguy. The cube-like object is possibly the Soul Cube.

 

299px-Doom2016_SoulCube_ArgentDNur.jpg

 

As an easter egg, the Soul Cube appeared in the Lazarus Labs in 2016, in the same room where the Slayer was moved to after being recovered from Hell. The Soul Cube would later re-appear in Eternal in the Slayer's Fortress of Doom, again as an easter egg. Having the Soul Cube appear close to the Slayer in both games could imply a connection between the two.

Soul_cube_from_Doom_3.jpg

 

doom-soul-cube.jpg?q=50&fit=crop&w=740&h

 

The Soul Cube calls itself the "Praelanthor" while the Slayer wears a "Praetor" suit, sharing the same prefix. The 2016 Praetor suit was forge by an unnamed "wretch" (the demonic narrator in that game refers to all Sentinels as "wretches", lower-case). This could imply that the Soul Cube may have been created by the Sentinels. Although could also be a coincidence since "Prae-" just means antique or ancient.

 

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In conclusion, the ancient Martians in Doom 3 were possibly an offworld branch of the Sentinels of 2016, akin to the Bethian tribe of Hebeth. Among the worlds the Sentinels colonized in the early days included the universe of Doom 3.

 

Doom 3, part of the multiverse, would take place after the events of Doom 64 (conforming to chronological release). Long after joining the Sentinels, the Slayer is imprisoned by the demons in Kadingir Sanctum. It is during this time do the events of Doom 3 take place, in their own universe. Without the relentless strength and speed of the Slayer, Doom 3 is a darker game with an oppressive Hellish presence bearing down upon the unprepared marine. The marine learns that an ancient civilization, that previously colonized Mars, had seemingly fallen by the demons and their (familiar-looking) Hero had presumably gone missing. Back in the newer universe of 2016, that hero, the Slayer, becomes re-activated by Hayden and returns to the fray. Eternal draws a full circle by confirming the Slayer is Doomguy (Hero carving in Doom 3) and also showing the extent of Sentinel influence across worlds through the Lost City of Hebeth (a branch connecting to Doom 3's Mars long ago).

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It's kind of a shame they went half way in only suggesting all this rather than confirming it with some little nod because it fits very well.

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On mercredi 25 mars 2020 at 12:49 AM, AtimZarr1 said:

since there is no mention of Earth being invaded

The backstory for the Doom hunter would tend to imply there was a previous invasion of Earth long ago.

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@AtimZarr1: That's a very intersting theory. I always wondered if there could be a connection betwwen the ancient Martian culture in Doom 3 and the stuff in the newer Doom games.

I haven't played Doom Eternal yet, might I ask how the Sentinels look? Do they look like regular humans, or somewhat alien?

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They're essentially human in form, but they're also capable of things that humans are not due to their exposure to Wraithcall. The results of this seem to include an ability for their spirits to persist beyond death as transparent hologram-like ghosts, as well as, for the priesthood (called the Order of the Deag originally) to perform magic.

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On 3/26/2020 at 4:22 PM, Gez said:

The backstory for the Doom hunter would tend to imply there was a previous invasion of Earth long ago.

The unused voice lines confirm the multiverse "I will send you back to your home, the earth world in the 7th dimension, before the time of the demons. You may live there again as before no memory of all the suffering you have been through. All your loved ones will be there, waiting to embrace you again. As if you have never left."

 

I always thought the Doomhunter entry refers to an ancient time before mankind.

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37 minutes ago, Quasar said:

They're essentially human in form, but they're also capable of things that humans are not due to their exposure to Wraithcall.

 

That four-eyed face in the Soulcube looks alien, but It's just a guess that it depicts an ancient Martian. Could also be some other species, or a depiction of a god or spirit.

 

On 3/25/2020 at 12:49 AM, AtimZarr1 said:

The Doom Slayer's true sarcophagus would rest in Hell, while the sarcophagus on Doom 3's Mars was perhaps created as a stand-in grave by the Sentinels at a later date (since his body was missing and we know some of the Sentinels respected the Slayer, as seen on Sentinel Prime).

 

A cenotaph.

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On 3/26/2020 at 11:22 AM, Gez said:

The backstory for the Doom hunter would tend to imply there was a previous invasion of Earth long ago.

 

Likely so, considering the Cultist Base was also apparently built atop an ancient Argenta settlement. Although I had meant that there's no mention of a recent-ish modern day invasion like in Doom II. Hell's assault on human civilization is presented as if it's happening for the first time.

 

1 hour ago, Tetzlaff said:

@AtimZarr1: That's a very intersting theory. I always wondered if there could be a connection betwwen the ancient Martian culture in Doom 3 and the stuff in the newer Doom games.

I haven't played Doom Eternal yet, might I ask how the Sentinels look? Do they look like regular humans, or somewhat alien?

 

They appear and speak like regular humans. Here's an armored Night Sentinel:

 

340?cb=20200323130157

 

In Doom 3, we don't get to see any living martians but it is implied they were humanoid as well, in the tablet describing the creation of the Soul Cube:

 

Soul_Cube_Tablet.jpg

 

14 minutes ago, Tetzlaff said:

That four-eyed face in the Soulcube looks alien, but It's just a guess that it depicts an ancient Martian. Could also be some other species, or a depiction of a god or spirit.

 

That's a good point I hadn't considered. Here's an image of the Soul Cube (hard to find one that wasn't angled):

 

tumblr_inline_p8yr4lp5X21svancn_500.png

 

There seems to be a small central face that appears like a human's. Maybe a Sentinel? There also seems to be another above it, a larger golden four-eyed face (which I presume is what you meant). The best I can come up with is that the Khan Maykr's true face has four eyes, she was like a God to the Sentinels. Maybe subconscious divine inspiration struck the Sentinel engineers? I'm reaching here. Doom 3's Soul Cube is shrouded in mystery enough that id could explain the faces however they like, if at all.

 

39 minutes ago, Tetzlaff said:

 

Thanks!

 

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Separately, a few interesting notes about Mars Core I learned a while back:

 

- If you fast-travel on Mars Core, two of the earlier UAC Mars facilities are titled "Alpha Labs" and "Delta Labs", in order of appearance. These are locations in Doom 3 as well.

 

- The final arena is titled "Temple of Sin" and is part of "Hell" apparently. This is interesting because we are in the core of Mars at this point, not in actual Hell. This could possibly be a callback to Doom 3's final level, where the marine encountered a Hellhole under the Mars surface, a location similarly considered to be part of Hell manifesting into the human world.

 

- The Slayer goes from the "Delta Labs" subregion to the "Hell" region of Mars Core, using an escape pod. Somewhat similarly, the Doom 3 marine goes from the "Delta Labs (Sector 4)" level to the "Hell" level, using a teleporter. In both instances, the protagonists reach Hell by the Delta Labs.

 

These are just easter eggs, but id's awareness of Doom 3 on the Mars level of the game could mean the inclusion of Hebeth might be an intentional allusion to Doom 3 lore and not just a coincidental similarity.

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I'm just now realizing how much the Meathook looks like those blades on the Soul Cube.

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15 hours ago, igg said:

The unused voice lines confirm the multiverse "I will send you back to your home, the earth world in the 7th dimension, before the time of the demons. You may live there again as before no memory of all the suffering you have been through. All your loved ones will be there, waiting to embrace you again. As if you have never left."

 

I always thought the Doomhunter entry refers to an ancient time before mankind.

" Earth, it's all what they want. 

They had it on the dawns of time but they lost it"

Elliott Swann said something like this in Doom 3. He knew something else about the demons that we don't. 

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7 hours ago, Gerardo194 said:

" Earth, it's all what they want. 

They had it on the dawns of time but they lost it"

Elliott Swann said something like this in Doom 3. He knew something else about the demons that we don't. 

 

I forgot about that! I looked up the line, it's part of the speech Swann makes when the marine finally meets him in person:

 

""Hell is breaking through in the caverns. If that portal isn't closed before those ships arrive, Earth will be destroyed. Earth... that's what they've always wanted. They were there once. Lost it in the dawn of time. Now it's so close, I can taste it..."

 

There doesn't seem to be any mention of this revelation in the PDAs, but the closest is an implication by Richard Davidson's log entry, where survivors of the ancient Martians are speculated to have fled to Earth via teleportation.

 

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As pointed out earlier, Doom Eternal does make mention of ancient demons on Earth, as well as Argenta too apparently:

 

"Extracted from the frozen depths of the polar tundra, the Doom Hunter belongs to an ancient race uncovered during Cultist excavation in the remote arctic. Preserved below the frozen ice for millions of years, the unearthed remains of this creature were deemed suitable for reconstruction, becoming the subject of Cultist necro-regenerative bio-experimentation."

 

"The UAC's polar cultist facility is built around the ruins of an ancient Argenta settlement constructed over 60 million years ago, during Argent D'Nur's extraterrestrial expansion. Frozen carcasses of the Agaddon Hunters have been located in the glacial wastes surrounding the complex, and though their DNA structure reveals them to be indigenous to Earth there is no fossilized record of these creatures beyond the frozen territories of the Argenta settlement. Carbon dating of the remarkably well-preserved beasts suggests they are nearly 80 million years old, pre-dating all other known forms of complex Earth-based life."

 

So it seems the demons were on Earth before the Argenta were. This could go along with the Doom 3 narrative that the demons lost Earth "at the dawn of time", though 60 million years ago isn't that long ago relatively speaking, maybe it varies per universe. It is interesting that the demons once controlled Earth in both Doom 3 and new Doom universes though.

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On 5/19/2020 at 1:54 AM, AtimZarr1 said:

Carbon dating of the remarkably well-preserved beasts suggests they are nearly 80 million years old, pre-dating all other known forms of complex Earth-based life." 

If we take this at face value, this means Doom Eternal takes place in the distant past. "80 million years" ago from today puts you in the Cretaceous, well after complex life had taken over Earth.

 

Depending on what they mean by "complex Earth-based life." If by "complex" they mean more than just single-celled bacteria and archaea, we would STILL be talking Cambrian period (about 540 to 480 million years ago). Even if "complex" life means terrestrial land animals, that still only gets us up to the Devonian period (about 420 to 360 million years ago).

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13 hours ago, SulfurOccult said:

If we take this at face value, this means Doom Eternal takes place in the distant past. "80 million years" ago from today puts you in the Cretaceous, well after complex life had taken over Earth.

 

Depending on what they mean by "complex Earth-based life." If by "complex" they mean more than just single-celled bacteria and archaea, we would STILL be talking Cambrian period (about 540 to 480 million years ago). Even if "complex" life means terrestrial land animals, that still only gets us up to the Devonian period (about 420 to 360 million years ago).

 

I'm not sure how taking place in the distant past would work. Doom 2016 and Eternal take place in the mid-22nd century, based on several Codex entries: "The Corrax tablets discovered during the UAC Automated Survey of 2143 mention an ancient battle in the Titan's Realm during the third age." and "In 2150, following the loss of communication between Earth and Mars-based facilities, UAC director Dr. Samuel Hayden suddenly resurfaced on Earth before the AN Council."

 

I think it'd be easier to explain it as an error, so either whoever wrote that Codex entry was mistaken about what happened 80 MYA or maybe it's a typo and supposed to be 800 MYA. The latter would make sense, according to Google [Source] the first multicellular animals appeared 600 MYA, so the Codex entry would become true in that the Doom Hunter's complexity preceded those.

 

A user elsewhere (I can't remember the thread) had also pointed out that carbon dating can't be used to date something 80 million years old either. I found a [Source] to confirm this too, apparently carbon dating is limited to objects younger than 50,000 - 60,000 years old. So really, that line about the Doom Hunter's age is a bit of a mess in general.

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On 5/21/2020 at 2:55 PM, SulfurOccult said:

 "80 million years" ago from today puts you in the Cretaceous, well after complex life had taken over Earth.

 

On our Earth.  However, there exists the possibility that is all but confirmed by the leaked voice clips that DE's Earth is a completely different Earth and its evolutionary history could be entirely different.

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6 hours ago, StevieWolfe said:

On our Earth.  However, there exists the possibility that is all but confirmed by the leaked voice clips that DE's Earth is a completely different Earth and its evolutionary history could be entirely different.


A universe in which it makes sense to derive an age of 80 million years from carbon dating an object, is a universe with very different physical laws in operation. Stuff like the decay rate of atoms is fundamental physics, minor differences there would cascade from the beginning of the Big Bang to the present day to produce a universe that we would never recognise.

I think it's more parsimonious to simply consider the 80 million figure to be a goof where someone forgot to add a zero.

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I'm sure iD didn't think about the lore at this length. Assuming it meant to say 800 million works, I guess -- but its probably more a matter of the Codex entries were written up quickly with little review and nobody cared to fact check the details of the grimoire about imaginary inter-dimensional demons. I think its just a matter of whatever the particular player finds interesting, just go with that for your personal head-canon.

 

I kinda like the idea that 2016-Eternal are in the past, like the Doom universe has a reoccurring cycle across time (the slayer's eternal battle), and in-between the evidence of previous human civilizations get ground away in geologic time. Doom 3 fits in this way (sorta?).

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