I'm worried about the future of Doom.

On 12/20/2020 at 3:24 AM, M_W said:

I feel like this seldom gets mentioned whenever discussion of mod tools comes up with nuDoom. Modern games have reached a level of complexity that making custom content for them requires a level of time and talent that, I imagine, most people would rather put toward their own projects.

And, not to discredit the immense talent and dedication of the Doom modding community, but Doom is extremely easy to mod, relatively speaking.

Well, i've made some Maps in Quake 3 and Doom 3 just for fun.

Had to copy some Code found on Sites to make some Things work, but wasn't as hard to make what you imagine.

And i made hole Campaigns in Starcraft.

The Solution is to handle out some Level Editors that are easy enough, so that People can build their own Levels, make up easy Scripts and also be able to write own Code and change out/put in Graphics :).

I think it is just Protectionism that they don't release well crafted Editors and no Option for LAN and own Dedicated Servers.

They lose Control over the Product and are afraight that People aren't buying the newer Games they'll release.

Ironicly one of the selling Points of the rerereleases of Doom on Switch et cetera is that they bring out WADs with new Campaigns.

9 hours ago, Azuris said:

 

 

They lose Control over the Product and are afraight that People aren't buying the newer Games they'll release.

 

Ironicly one of the selling Points of the rerereleases of Doom on Switch et cetera is that they bring out WADs with new Campaigns.

Reminds me of Black Ops 3 and Black Ops 4.

The bo3 had zombie and modding tools, and by this day it's still going with super maps, even ones that's feel that should be done by developers of the game. Then Bo4 not had access to any of this, and the downgrade hits you in the face, so for my friends we ended out buying BO3 instead of BO4 only because this reason.

4 hours ago, Azuris said:

Well, i've made some Maps in Quake 3 and Doom 3 just for fun. 

Had to copy some Code found on Sites to make some Things work, but wasn't as hard to make what you imagine.

Doom 3 is already an old game. It's not comparable to what's being done now.

Have you tried modding Rage? Its SDK was released after all. And look at the shiny, thriving modding community it has! There must be, like, three whole separate mods you can get! How exciting! Oh wait, there are four mods in total, I just noticed the numbers it gave me were 2, 3, and 4 so I wondered, "what about 1?" and entered that URL and yeah, turns out that even for Rage, NexusMods is still NexusMods, the first uploaded mod in there was hidden due to "adult content", lol.

6 minutes ago, Gez said:

Doom 3 is already an old game. It's not comparable to what's being done now.

 

Have you tried modding Rage? Its SDK was released after all. And look at the shiny, thriving modding community it has! There must be, like, three whole separate mods you can get! How exciting! Oh wait, there are four mods in total, I just noticed the numbers it gave me were 2, 3, and 4 so I wondered, "what about 1?" and entered that URL and yeah, turns out that even for Rage, NexusMods is still NexusMods, the first uploaded mod in there was hidden due to "adult content", lol. 

"The probability of any game receiving a crude boobs/etc. mod within first six months of availability of mod tools approaches 1."

On 12/22/2020 at 3:40 AM, Azuris said:

Well, i've made some Maps in Quake 3 and Doom 3 just for fun....And i made hole Campaigns in Starcraft.

Those games are 21, 16, and 22 years old, respectively.

On 12/22/2020 at 3:40 AM, Azuris said:

The Solution is to handle out some Level Editors that are easy enough, so that People can build their own Levels, make up easy Scripts and also be able to write own Code and change out/put in Graphics :).

 

I think it is just Protectionism that they don't release well crafted Editors and no Option for LAN and own Dedicated Servers.

 

They lose Control over the Product and are afraight that People aren't buying the newer Games they'll release.

 

Ironicly one of the selling Points of the rerereleases of Doom on Switch et cetera is that they bring out WADs with new Campaigns.

I don't know what universe you are occupying where 3D modelling and scripting is easier than drawing lines in two dimensions and changing linedef/sector properties.

I can promise you the reason you don't see mod tools on modern games is because it's more work, and is a gamble if there will ever be a return on it, because most of the time the only thing that ever comes out of it is nude mods.

The PC gaming space is more massive and more diverse than it was twenty years ago. Even a commercially successful game like Doom Eternal doesn't have the ubiquity games like Doom, Quake, and Half-Life had back in the day. The days of there being one game everyone uses for modding are kind of a thing of the past. Nowadays, if you have an idea, you're more likely to pick up the Unity Engine and have a go at making a game yourself.

If it were fifteen years ago, I could see something like Phasmophobia being a total conversion mod for Half Life 2, but we live in the era of highly accessible game engines. Hell, there's a Half-Life Episode 3 fan game in the works, and it's built in Unreal Engine 4.

On 12/10/2020 at 8:17 PM, Gez said:

I So when they had the idea to make an Alien-brand shooter and then came back to their sense that they should do their own IP instead of getting shackled to franchise licenses, the decision to replace aliens with demons was obvious.

Ackshually,Doom was always about demons(skip to 0:43)

15 hours ago, M_W said:

I can promise you the reason you don't see mod tools on modern games is because it's more work, and is a gamble if there will ever be a return on it, because most of the time the only thing that ever comes out of it is nude mods.

This needs to be highlighted. People are getting pissy at id because they aren't releasing enough content quickly enough. We are in the middle of a pandemic, and people are working from home. That makes work more difficult. Do people legitimately want id to fracture their focus in order to release level editing tools?

If id is working hard on the DLC (which is a legal contractual obligation to Deluxe owners - give them 2 DLCs within 1 year of release), plus working on Invasion and more Master Levels.. what type of extra resource allocation (money, people, time, energy, testing) would have to be redirected to create a full level editor for DE for public use? Likely not something id sees as a worthwhile investment right now.

16 hours ago, M_W said:

Those games are 21, 16, and 22 years old, respectively.

I don't know what universe you are occupying where 3D modelling and scripting is easier than drawing lines in two dimensions and changing linedef/sector properties.

 

I can promise you the reason you don't see mod tools on modern games is because it's more work, and is a gamble if there will ever be a return on it, because most of the time the only thing that ever comes out of it is nude mods.

 

The PC gaming space is more massive and more diverse than it was twenty years ago. Even a commercially successful game like Doom Eternal doesn't have the ubiquity games like Doom, Quake, and Half-Life had back in the day. The days of there being one game everyone uses for modding are kind of a thing of the past. Nowadays, if you have an idea, you're more likely to pick up the Unity Engine and have a go at making a game yourself.

 

If it were fifteen years ago, I could see something like Phasmophobia being a total conversion mod for Half Life 2, but we live in the era of highly accessible game engines. Hell, there's a Half-Life Episode 3 fan game in the works, and it's built in Unreal Engine 4.

When did you use the last Time a Level Editor?
The good ones liek in Starcraft 2 gives you what you need to build basic Levels, it is like using Legos and it is Way easier than Doom Editors.
If you have more Experience they have prepared easy to use Scripts to make whole Campaigns work.
If you can program, they let you write your own Code and they let you switch out Graphics, Sounds and Music.
 

The only Reason they don't pull so many out is that they can't monetize the Stuff and they lose Control over what is happening with the Game.

You can see it with Bethesda, trying to make a Shop for such Stuff.

The way I see it, I just don't feel that mod tools are that important nowadays for a game like Doom Eternal since anybody who'd want to put in the effort to make a full hypothetical TC can easily just make money off a full commercial game in Unity (Dusk/Prodeus), Unreal Engine (Amid Evil/Hellbound), or even just popular source ports in general (Hedon on GZDoom/Ion Fury on EDuke32/Wrath on Darkplaces).

The fact that Minecraft, Among Us, and Fortnite are among the most popular games in the world is proof enough that people care more about gameplay than photorealistic graphics.

On 12/10/2020 at 8:15 PM, ChopBlock223 said:

The new Doom games can crash and burn and it won't make the community for classic Doom go anywhere.

This is exactly the point I was going to talk about. Modern and new Doom games will never surpass the classics. Unless they offer open source creations for the fans to create and pay tribute to the franchise we know and love.