What's the best way to do secrets?

So, I'm working on a Hell map and I'm wondering if it would be too stupid to make the following a secret: The player starts on an elevated position, in front of them is a path leading to the main area but around them is a fall that with mouselook you can see is blood. The blood is damaging. To the right, there's a teleporter to bring you right back up so you don't die immediately. To the left is a box of shotgun shells(super important since you start the map with a super shotgun and 3 shells pickups). Is it a bad idea to label the box of shells a secret? I feel as if no sane player with mouselook off would see a ledge in hell and go "hmm I'd like to jump down there see if the floor will kill me".

Also what are some general guidelines for secrets? I've seen misaligned textures, switches that open far away walls, different colored variations of a texture, platforming where you have to run super fast and fall somewhere, switches behind switches where if you press the regular one first it sinks the switch so you can't press the secret one... Is there some sort of rule I need to follow when I do secrets to make them better and more fun? I try not to make them too too hard because I feel like that's a turn off for people who want to 100% the map.

I'll start with your example. From the short description of the encounter, I think you shouldn't mark it as a secret since what you have to do to get to the secret isn't very hard. Multiple times, there are secrets in maps where all you have to do is dive into a damaging floor. You have two variables here: how long you have to be in the damaging floor to get to the secret, and the difficulty of getting out of the damaging area.

Making the 1st variable longer & the 2nd variable harder makes the secret more secretive. 

Looking at your example, the first variable is very low, and the second variable is either "Super easy" or "I'm not sure if I can even get out of here."

It might be secretive, but it's not a Secret secret, you know?

EDIT: Yeah, you shouldn't mark your box of shells as a secret. The risk is very low as it is near the start and due to the reasons I stated above.

All right, thank you for the feedback!

37 minutes ago, Pompeji said:

Also what are some general guidelines for secrets? I've seen misaligned textures, switches that open far away walls, different colored variations of a texture, platforming where you have to run super fast and fall somewhere, switches behind switches where if you press the regular one first it sinks the switch so you can't press the secret one... Is there some sort of rule I need to follow when I do secrets to make them better and more fun? I try not to make them too too hard because I feel like that's a turn off for people who want to 100% the map.

That's a damn good question.

I will say this though: There are many DO's for secrets that can range from "Ok..." to "That was a cool secret! I liked that!" when you get past the secret.

The DONT's for secrets are much more limited, so you should focus on those while thinking of secrets.

On 2/24/2021 at 10:59 PM, Pompeji said:

I feel as if no sane player with mouselook off would see a ledge in hell and go "hmm I'd like to jump down there see if the floor will kill me".

You'll be surprised at how fluid the definition of "sanity" is when it comes to DooM players. Or to humanity in general, I suppose.

Many players, myself included, will explore every playable part of map - even if it means facing a possible hazard. Therefore, don't dismiss your idea.

On 2/24/2021 at 10:59 PM, Pompeji said:

Is there some sort of rule I need to follow when I do secrets to make them better and more fun?

One rule is to make sure that finding your secret is not essential for making progress in the map. There are few things more frustrating in a game than being unable to find a way forward, only to discover that you needed to find a secret in order to advance.

Another suggestion (not really a rule) is to make a secret area and its contents visible but not immediately accessible. A great idea is the outdoor area with the blue armor in Map E1M1. This gives the player a side objective without providing a direct or easy path.

Shootable switches, especially where the switch does not use an obvious switch texture, is a way to introduce a little more challenge while also requiring the player to be observant. In MAP 16 of DooM2 the building with the super shotgun (480, -368) has 2 such switches. One uses a FIREMAG3 texture set in a wood-paneled wall (thus providing a contrast) and the other uses a WOODGARG texture but with only the red eyes of the gargoyle showing.

54 minutes ago, ReX said:

One rule is to make sure that finding your secret is not essential for making progress in the map. There are few things more frustrating in a game than being unable to find a way forward, only to discover that you needed to find a secret in order to advance.

In extension to that, make sure that finding (or not finding) secrets doesn't screw with the desired balance of the map too much. If your map as 10 megaspheres having another one in a secret will not change the balance much. Having the only megasphere in a secret might screw with the balance of a map a lot - it might suddenly make beating the map very easy. Personally I like the "the journey is the reward" approach, where the main reward is actually finding the secret, and some items in the secret are just a bonus.

Sorry to be lazy and not really engage in the conversation, but I posed a similar question a while back and the thread got some great responses by a number of people. It's a worth read, if you're interested:

1 hour ago, RonnieJamesDiner said:

Sorry to be lazy and not really engage in the conversation, but I posed a similar question a while back and the thread got some great responses by a number of people. It's a worth read, if you're interested:

 

 

I checked it out and I'm glad I did. Since my map includes harder enemies to kill, I think I did right by giving access to a gun you would normally get later in the map earlier.

One good guideline for secrets is to assume that players could miss any or all of them. So test your map at least once without finding any of them. If you cannot beat your own map without finding secrets, how could you expect players who don't know the secrets are there to find them?

I also like to make sure that it's possible for a player to go back and find any secrets they missed, even if they're at the end of the level. That's just my preference though.

Early access to a gun you get later is a good use for a secret.

9 hours ago, Stabbey said:

I also like to make sure that it's possible for a player to go back and find any secrets they missed, even if they're at the end of the level.

Yes, it frustrates me a little when I am nearing the end of a map and am unable to return to earlier parts of the map where I might have stashed goodies for later use (including secret areas I had already found, or secret areas that were visible and to which I decided I would return later).