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The_Aeromaster

plasma rifle

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We were kicking something around in the D3-G forum and this came up. I was wondering what ya'll thought about it.

How do you think the plasma rifle works and what kind of plasma does it employ?

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Some sort of Hollywood science. (ie. implausable, but believable on screen)

Given that a plasma is something like 10,000,000 degrees C and would have to be contained by magnetic fields, it would probably be spit out of the gun by some sort of magnetic repulsion. However, it would cool pretty quick in the (relatively) freezing air unless it hit pretty quick, so that's why it's Hollywood science.

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Isn't plasma dense, white-hot electricity? IE they've mastered fusion and it's channeled through magnetic devices propelling a mass of energy in a direction.

What kind of molecules they use for the fusion process, I don't know.

Edit: Alien Technology. :P

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Heh, who knows what kind of technology we'll have say, a hundred years from now? The Plasma Rifle might actually be plausible by then, if only for elite military groups.
As for how the PR works, your guess is good as mine. I'd have to guess and say advanced technology :)

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Plasma's a state of matter beyond gas, where it's too hot to hold the properties of "normal" matter. The amount of energy needed to heat gas to a plasma state, plus the necessary magnetic compartment needed to contain its extreme volatility, would probably make DOOM's plasma rifle an impossibility.

Although IIRC, there is a kind of electrically-generated plasma that's put to use today (in arc welders if I'm not mistaken). The plasma rifle might be some kind of derivative of that.

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I've used "plasma cutters" before, they're like air and an electric arc or something. Obviously, they can cut metal, so flesh would be no task. Anyway, I think it would be possible for a weapon based on the firing of plasma would be very possible.

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I originally thought that it was the plasma-state matter in use, but then I thought, since the BFG uses the same cells, how would the BFG use that kind of plasma in the fashion it does?
So I figure it's got to be the electrical plasma, although I have no idea how that works... but eletricity can travel from object to object, like lightning does. In Doom's case, how the force of the BFG blast is transferred through all the different enemies on screen, and the Doomguy must have some kind of shield against it.
As far as how it works, I had a theory on that if it was plasma-state matter, like some of you said, is extremely hot and contained inside the cells in an energy field, like a magnetic field. When it's fired it cools so rapidly because of the relative temperature of its surroundings, plus if that wasn't enough some kind of cooling mechanism in what you'd consider the barrel of the plasma rifle. Then, whatever heat it retains burns the fuck out of whatever it hits.
Of course, like I said, then I'd haveta come up with some way the BFG could use the same cells. It'd be more plausible to use the electricity-related plasma. Let's formulate some ideas.

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I'm not certain, since it was a long time ago that i read the article, but physicists were attempting plasma creation by using gigantic spinning magnets and...some other stuff...i've forgotten..but anyhow, the room that they were attempting plasma creation in was the size of a gym, because it required some huge fucking magnets. I think that even in 500 years a doom-style plasma rifle might be an impossibility.

Note: I'm not certain if they actually have used this, or if it were a theoretical way to create plasma. All I really remember was the diagram which showed a huge fucking room with magnets on the outside that would spin at high velocities.

Now this electrical plasma might be possible. I havent read about this one. Anyone have a link to a site that talks about it? It sounds pretty damned interesting.

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You know this got me thinking of something vaguely unrelated. How do those PPGs in Babylon 5 work?

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Dingus Khan said:

I'm not certain, since it was a long time ago that i read the article, but physicists were attempting plasma creation by using gigantic spinning magnets and...some other stuff...i've forgotten..but anyhow, the room that they were attempting plasma creation in was the size of a gym, because it required some huge fucking magnets. I think that even in 500 years a doom-style plasma rifle might be an impossibility.

Note: I'm not certain if they actually have used this, or if it were a theoretical way to create plasma. All I really remember was the diagram which showed a huge fucking room with magnets on the outside that would spin at high velocities.


That's a tokamak. They're used to try to start an energy-producing fusion reaction, but thus far they haven't been able to sustain them for any period using them.

And yeah, electrical plasma seems like the most plausible explanation for the plasma rifle, considering we have arc welders and plasma cutters that can cut through metal rather easily. Beyond that it just becomes an issue of heavily physics-intensive wankery, and I'll settle for the bad-SF-movie explanation for now :)

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Shit, there was a scientific article link on the super old Depot Forums (thru ezboard). The boards, however, are long since dead, and the post gone. :( I forgot who posted the link, but it was a great read, with proof to back it up.

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Nanami said:

A better question might be how the BFG9000 works. Let's see you explain THAT.

If you want to answer that question, you need to come up with a plausible explanation why all living creatures in the area are being destroyed and why all 'normal' matter such as walls and doors are not being touched by those green plasmaballs. And I have no idea..

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Plasma stuff:

About two or three years ago I operated a plasma etching machine for a cell phone company. The basic concept was to run a super high current over the surfaces of the phone cases which would create microscopic pores in the texture of the phone, when they first come out of the machine they're extremely brittle. The reason that was done was when they were metalized on the back side (if you have a cellphone, it *should have a metal surface somewhere on the caseing) it would hold better and would flaw less easily.

The machine was a chamber about 5x5 ft that resembled a $200,000 oven with a small port hole.. while running, the inner chamber would glow a bright pinkish purple. Misc fact...

-plasma smells like waffles.
-someone at my (old) workplace etched a ham sandwich

To add to this lovely convorsation, I cannot possibly see how plasma could be a projectile.. it dissimates as soon as it's out of a contained field, that, and it's completely thin. Who knows what the future will bring though.

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Disorder said:

If you want to answer that question, you need to come up with a plausible explanation why all living creatures in the area are being destroyed and why all 'normal' matter such as walls and doors are not being touched by those green plasmaballs. And I have no idea..


because you can't destroy terrain in doom and objects such as torches etc are flagged 'can't be hit' silly! :P

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There's Nikola Tesla's death ray that the US is developing variations of and Russia has probably had for an anti-air weapon for decades (enabling them to shoot down a spy plane high out of reach of convential weapons).

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My guess is the Plasma Rifle has no explanation. As a matter of fact, I'm positive it's included not because of the way it works, but because it's a cool weapon. You scientific goons!

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Ichor said:

A small piece of fairy cake.

With a miniature fairy too?

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Well, as far as the BFG goes, like I said, if it's the electrical plasma we're talking about, electricity, or anything electrically based could jump from object to object... I'd say it spreads through everything in the room, including objects like walls and chairs and such, but they're not alive so it doesn't bother them.

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Dingus Khan said:

What is the catalyst that produces the reaction? I cant imagine spinning magnets alone would cause a fusion reaction.


I'm remembering reading something about how they either used to operate or planned on operating a fusion weapon by speeding up two atoms of uranium/plutonium to extremely high speed using a series of magnets inside a chamber, going in opposite directions, then colliding them with each other. The resulting force combined the atoms (fusion) and released severe amounts of energy (the big boom and death).

I doubt anything like this is in use for operating the plasma rifle. Like Dingus Kahn said, I'd like to read something about this electric-plasma, cause it does sound interesting. Then after reading it I'm sure I'd be able to come up with something... whether it'd be plausible or not is another matter.

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Dingus Khan said:

What is the catalyst that produces the reaction? I cant imagine spinning magnets alone would cause a fusion reaction.


Well, they're trying to replicate the kind of fusion that takes place in the core of the sun, which involves hydrogen atoms fusing to create helium atoms. The reaction apparently occurs due to the sheer heat and pressure involved, and the tokamak tries to replicate those conditions to a reasonable extent. Therefore, there is no catalyst for the reaction but the heat involved.

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Plasma is simply ionised gas, it does not need to be 10000000 K, it is not necessarily pure electricity (that would be a pure lepton plasma, I'd reckon), there are many forms of plasma, not all need to be contained in a magnetic field (ever wondered what fire is?)

Consider this: Each unit of 'cell' consists of pre-ionised gelatinous material, the plasma rifle itself contains rails similar to a rail-gun, however it gives nowhere near the accelaration (rail-gun projectiles reach speeds measured in km/s) however high enough to give the cell a temperature to innitaite reaction, a high temp. exothermic reaction, this substance, at the temp. it's at is forced to an aerodynamic shape, and since the higher the temp. the lighter the substance is the hottest part will be at the back, creating a sort of self propulsion effect. Upon collision the substance sticks like a blob of molten plastic, burning like a very high temperture napalm.

This idea can also explain the pre-beta BFG and how people guess how the BFG works.

However, some concepts to do with how the BFG is truly observed to work I cannot explain, namely the secondary blast cone originating from you, triggered by the primary sphere making contact, in the direction of the vector of the primary sphere's travel. I'm interested in peoples ideas on how to explain that.

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Nanami said:

A better question might be how the BFG9000 works. Let's see you explain THAT.

It would have to be some of method that causes the plasma only to damage all organic matter.

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I've always thought that the Doom plasma rifle uses a totally new energy technology.

Scientists constantly discover new things, so it does not take much of my powers of imagination to imagine that the plasma rifle uses a new kind of highly concentrated energy that can be warped into a form of energy plasma.

I don't believe that the PR uses any form of modern plasma, because that's just too unlikely. You could convince me that it might be using a highly developed derivative of modern "electricity plasma", but that's about it. Personally, I believe that the "Doom plasma" is neither electricity nor sun energy, but a completely third thing, which is completely unheard of today that uses a highly concentrated energy type (energy cells), which through some sort of massive manipulation (electro magnetic perhaps?) can be warped into different shapes and states of which the plasma state is the essential one here and where the plasma sphere is the basic shape.

The plasma rifle would be fed with energy cells that are converted into this sort of fairly powerful, concentrated energy plasma and the weapon is able to use some kind of advanced magnetic and kinetic forces to propel several pulses through the air at a fast rate.

The BFG would be based on the plasma rifle tech, but much more complex and advanced. I imagine that most of what the gun itself is composed of is more computer systems (a targeting computer would be one example of this) and systems that can go in and manipulate the plasma energy in many different ways. The BFG would have the same plasma rendering systems as the pr, but in addition to that, it has a number of delicate systems which go in and simply manipulate the molecules in the plasma energy.
The BFG's plasma manipulating processes take so long time, that the BFG has a slow rate of fire and a slow firing sequence (the weapon must "warm up" after the trigger is pulled before it actually fires), but once it launches this large concentrated ball of death (alone the building up of such a large concentration of energy requires several complex processes), it fires a ball which is "somehow" kept in contact with the gun's firing systems, through transmitting a few molecules back and forth between the gun and the actual plasma ball, so that there's a sort of "communication" between the two.

When the plasma ball hits a target, it causes an explosion of molecule transmissions, which automatically triggers the secondary fire sequence, which has been warming up all the time while the plasma ball was transmitting molecules back to the gun, and the gun fires a powerful ray composed of energy cells warped into a state different than the plasma state which is exploited by both the pr and the BFG. This ray is highly unstable and will detonate a sort of energy explosion whenever it makes contact with an active system of sort (like, for instance, an organic system), which converts the enormous amounts of energies in the area around the target to pure death.

Just some speculation by an overactive imagination :-P

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The Froon said:

Plasma

So essentialy, the plasma rifle is somewhat like UT's goo gun? :P

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pritch said:

It would have to be some of method that causes the plasma only to damage all organic matter.

Hey, it damages barrels too!

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