What do you want id to do next after Eternal?

To be honest, Doom Eternal had a strong Quake vibe, it felt like Doom 2 Arena. And this might be the reason some people think the difference between Doom and Quake 1 is too small. 

There's nothing wrong with that because id Softwares games always focused on fast and intense gameplay, combined with impressive visuals. Of course there are exceptions like Doom 3.

But the art direction of Quake was very different. It felt more solid and steelish. The weapons had a stronger impact on the player and the enemies. Doom had a plasma gun, Quake a nailgun. The movement was (in mph) slower than Doom, but it felt more free.

I'm excited how a new Quake 1 game would feel. 

@whatup876 Quake 1 had a Lovecraftian final boss, but the game itself wasn't Lovecraftian at all. Lovecraftian horror is all about the cosmic horror, the fear of the unknown... doesn't really work in your game when you have zombies with chainsaws, firing grenade launchers at you, while being chased by skeletons swinging a claymore. Quake 1 was more of a Doom game than anything else. But it's 2022, if they make another game, they can definitely make it more cinematic, story driven and rich on Lovecraftian lore... then, maybe we can have that Lovecraftian Quake game, but the original game was never even close to being that.

On 2/5/2022 at 1:54 PM, whatup876 said:

But there's still an interest for what Quake was going for with its aesthetic or theme.

Even Doom Eternal being more cartoony and colorfull only makes it a bit more different from Quake in that regard.

Dimension of the Machine gives me some small hope that they’re aware of this difference, even if it could also be that the “new Quake” comes out as varied and colorful as Champions. Lovecraftian or otherwise, there was a definite style to its moody dark fantasy worlds. Honey is also a wonderful emphasis on that kind of style, it’s one of my favorite pair of maps ever.

On 3/17/2021 at 11:34 PM, IrOn7HuB said:

Doom 4. Not a spin-off, not a slayer rewrite. Just the original project as it was intended and originally directed, or simply let it be released unfinished.

That's the last Doom game I want to try and nobody can't convince me otherwise.

 

I tried all Doom games, even after DOOM Eternal, I want to go back to the roots when demons used to be scary, feeling alienated by it and fighting them with serious gore. The feel of Doom has science-fiction alongside action packed elements around it as a method of survival.

Eh, I'd prefer not. The OG Doom 4 kinda looked like Call of Duty with demons in it. Not my cup of tea and I think it'd disappoint alot of fans.

3 hours ago, GraphicBleeder said:

Eh, I'd prefer not. The OG Doom 4 kinda looked like Call of Duty with demons in it. Not my cup of tea and I think it'd disappoint alot of fans.

Yea I agree. Doom should be about gameplay in a ham as fuck setting. Doom1/2 are the best playing FPS of their era, as is Doom: Eternal. Doom 3 is underwhelming as the focus wasn't so much on gameplay but more on being a survival horror experience. 

I don't want to play as a random marine, and I don't want to play a Doom title where you're constrained to vaguely realistic gameplay.

I don't think too much of Quake. I appreciate what Quake 1 brought to the table, and Quake 3 was fun as hell, I played the shit out of 2 and 3 deathmatch in the 90's. What was that super popular Quake 2 map? The Edge? Spent so much time in there. And the railgun space map in 3.

But the quake campaigns just aren't for me, 2 especially. What a drab, ugly game. The strogg are just unremarkable compared to Doom's bestiary 

With all that said, I don't know exactly what I want. I trust that Hugo guy. I wouldn't have thought deep into my 30's that I'd be into a FPS game, but Doom Eternal is some of the most fun I think I've had with a videogame. It plays sooooo fuckin good. If Doom continues to be the videogame equivilant of a heavy metal album cover, that's cool. As long as the gameplay continues to feel great. As long as it continues to be a massive power fantasy

Personal aside though, I like the crazy backdrops - go nuts, let those graphic artist designer guys earn their 60k a year. I don't like bombed out cities. The first level of Doom Eternal is ugly as hell, it's really an off-putting start to the game.

I feel like Doom always had a lot of interesting cut content/unused concepts that could be used but the cancelled Doom 4.10 is so detached from Doom, that it's not even comparable to Doom 3.

I do like to think of a Doom 3 follow up that is to Doom 3, what Doom Eternal is to 2016.

A "hyperfixation" on the previous game's aspects.

Because i think you can make a "tactical" game that is still fun/challenging on its own and separate from the COD/BF/PS3/360 zeitgeist.

My comparision has been "the gameplay of Hideous Destructor combined with DeimosRemus' Doom redesigns" or something close.

A game that exists to be opposite to Eternal but still solid on its own merits and it would be "Hell on Earth", taking advantage of potential diverse Earth areas and creativity with Hell's impact on Earth.

Like, you would still have exploration, big enough arsenals and rely on resources, with occasional power ups or artifacts buffing you in some ways.

Maybe ditch the lantern but also do something with the light amp visors like "wall hacks" Predator x-ray vision or finally make the Blursphere an actual invisibility power up for stealth.

Basically a different kind of "sand box" to make/add new stuff and experimentation, since 3 in itself was clearly not "gameplay first".

To me, the classic Doomguy was always between being "doomed" and "doom bringer", so the D3 marine and Slayer are just different sides of the Doomguy. (the latter in itself being influenced by fanservice and memes)

I also think Doom has more potential to be more "epic/badass" in ways that may even ignore parts of Eternal's lore or aesthetics.

There's still bits of classic Doom aesthetic not really in Eternal.

Even making Hell scarier can be "cool" and complement the Slayer power fantasy.

44 minutes ago, Kute said:

 

But the quake campaigns just aren't for me, 2 especially. What a drab, ugly game. The strogg are just unremarkable compared to Doom's bestiary .

You’d have to appreciate their style of being like the Borg while also seemingly being proud and war-like. Aside from that it’s a thoroughly rounded-out enemy roster, they even made sure to have an archvile equivilent in the medic - and holy crap, those medic commander fights in the Reckoning…!

This is also solely from the perspective of Q2, I wasn’t a fan of 4’s direction or how QC is trying to link 1 with 2 - is what it is, I suppose.

Quick snippet @whatup876: “I do like to think of a Doom 3 follow up that is to Doom 3, what Doom Eternal is to 2016.”

I’m in the tiny part of the venn diagram that liked 2016 because of how much it reminded me Doom 3, just much more lacking on the ‘weird and creepy’ bits while having more appealing encounters and gameplay.

Depending on how a Doom 6 ends up, i hope they still have creative takes on the enemies.

Like, in case they can't come up with newer types, they could always change stuff about existing enemies, be it visual designs, gameplay or even both.

There was some novelty in how Eternal modernized classic Doom designs but i think there being new designs for the enemies would be great, specially if that even correlates with a demon's strengths and weaknesses.

One idea for a creative design would be a "reverse" on the Mancubus and Arachnotron where the flesh and metal parts are reverse, like a mostly metallic Manc with flesh cannons or an Arachnotron that has real spider legs but the brain is like a computer thing shaped like a brain.

Something i also feel like wasn't that explored was how in 2016, Cacodemons could blur the player's view with their projectile, so i feel like that could inspire an enemy with some blinding abilities: one being a projectile with slime and/or blur on screen and another being the smoke bomb that Mancubus as in Battlemode. (i also recall the 2016 MP grenade launcher having a smoke bomb)

Same would probably be cool for weapons like new alt fires, even if the SSG in Eternal is irreplaceable.

This in general depends on the gameplay "system" and effort behind it.

18 minutes ago, whatup876 said:

One idea for a creative design would be a "reverse" on the Mancubus and Arachnotron where the flesh and metal parts are reverse, like a mostly metallic Manc with flesh cannons or an Arachnotron that has real spider legs but the brain is like a computer thing shaped like a brain.

That’s disgusting - I LOVE IT, especially giving the arachnotron more fleshy spidery bits; I’m getting a few goosebumps…and some fun Doom 3 flashbacks!

And I’m not sure how you’d feel about this, but the “fleshier weapons” seem like they would make more sense as “weakpoints” than the current implementations.

They could even work for a new iteration of the Cybermancubus: It has armor to make it more beefier than the main Manc, but carries over the former's shootable cannons, as they're flesh tubes. (in which according to lore, could even have a nasty lore background)

and a spider enemy could be how you can incorporate a "purple goo" attack, because i always imagined an enemy with a "spider web" that is thrown like a Cybermanc acid pool that can slow down the player.

i also imagine a spider enemy pulling the player with a slinging web MK Scorpion style and said web could also be used when it tries to attach to ceilings and stuff. (like how the Whiplash even uses its whips to go to some places)

Also, i remember when 2016 MP had a health regeneration power up: i wonder if that could work for a power up that regenerates both health and ammo, like a "soft" equivalent of pure invulnerability or infinite ammo because there's still a bit of a risk.

What else could i mention? oh yeah, whenever i think of people complaining about the HUD in Eternal and how they compare it to 2016's HUD and UI design, i always thought 2016 was still mostly flat holographic shapes.

I feel like a way for Doom to be more stylish is make HUD's and stuff more stylish to the point it can factor in actual illustrations (specially if done like a comic book or heavy metal) and ignore most minimalist stuff.

I feel like Doom 2 RPG is the one time a HUD in Doom was "too literal" where it was made of actual objects/materials and it had an actual heart and armor in the HUD, instead of just symbols representing those.

The most popular Doom hud historically was 1/2's which is essentially a block of concrete with Doomguy's face.

Then you have a beta/alpha thing like this https://tcrf.net/images/5/5e/DoomPCtechdemo-normal.png (which isn't that ideal)

There's just something about stylized or personality heavy videogame HUD's that i think would be cool to see in Doom.

edit: apparently, collectables would come in boxes and i assume some of them come in different ranks, specially "smash boxes".

And apprently, id's Alex Palma did a (mostly unofficial) take on the Quake's Shambler.

Something completely different. A platformer.

If they ever do a platformer, i always thought they could collab with some indie studio behind some popular game to work on Keen.

Now that Microsoft is working to acquire Activision, and already owns Bethesda, that legally would resolve the copyright limbo over the Serpent Riders Trilogy. I'd love to see a new Heretic or Hexen remake/reboot on modern engine tech. It would be even more glorious if they not only did that, buy also expanded on the "Id Multiverse" fan theory and depicted a confirmed connection between Doom and Heretic/Hexen's universes.

Sometimes, i wonder if a mindset of "we don't need another Doom game ever" is from the same that says "Doom truly returned to the roots".

Because to me, the success of modern Doom is from the risks of innovating/reinterpretating a classic series and the open opportunities of how much can still be done. (while D3 is just an experimentation that didn't work out, but not because "it's too different")

And TAG2 specially feels like it has ideas that could have been more, for a series where the fanbase paints it as "Most badass thing ever".

Like, timing to avoid saturation and inspire creativity or a better engine is needed.

I guess there's also people not liking the platforming and fearing id does more experimental ideas or stuff like that.

But at least most of this stuff makes differences and keeps people talking. (and again, opens opportunities for stuff)

In a way, one could argue that Romero would never think of another game after 2 and Carmack wanted the fans to keep the series going but the mere fact that Final Doom and 64 still existed means Doom doesn't have to end. (at least take some breaks)

And there's something nice of seeing new features canonically attached to Doom.

Anyway, speaking of new ideas: imagine a demon design of a demon's head on 2 legs.

Like the Hell equivalent of a Goomba.

4 hours ago, whatup876 said:

Because to me, the success of modern Doom is from the risks of innovating/reinterpretating a classic series and the open opportunities of how much can still be done. (while D3 is just an experimentation that didn't work out, but not because "it's too different")

I agree with this. I also think TAG "has ideas that could have been more" as you said, though I also know they had to create most of TAG during the beginnings of the pandemic and it wasn't really the perfect time to try and reinvent the wheel. I enjoyed TAG 1&2 but they leaned too heavily on monsters with gimmicks imo. My ideal next id game, Doom or not, would be a mix of Doom 2016 and Eternal regarding gameplay philosophy and the core loop.

On 4/7/2022 at 1:33 PM, Alex S. said:

Now that Microsoft is working to acquire Activision, and already owns Bethesda, that legally would resolve the copyright limbo over the Serpent Riders Trilogy. I'd love to see a new Heretic or Hexen remake/reboot on modern engine tech.

I wouldn't say no to that! I think the general look and feel of Hexen could work incredibly well with modern graphics. The game could be a bit more RPG focused, like the original Hexen compared to 1993 Doom, while still sticking to the same core gameplay loop that the new Doom games use. You could have different classes that are better against certain types of enemies or threats, meaning that the 'hard' parts of the combat loop will change depending on which character you choose. It'd be neat if you could travel to some Hexen II type of locations like ancient Egypt and fight the horsemen of the apocalypse, too. Go all out.

A reimagining of the stuff described in the Doom Bible as a survival horror game. You have to retake the base and solve puzzles to open doors.

Here's a weird idea:

You know how everyone's fav alt fire is the Meathook while the seemingly most disliked is microwave beam?

Both essentially revolve around shooting a locked on stringy thing (hook chain or energy beam) to an enemy.

What if somehow these 2 were fused or made related into a single weapon mod?

How EXACTLY, i dunno lol.

Something moderately original

On 2/11/2022 at 1:52 PM, whatup876 said:

They could even work for a new iteration of the Cybermancubus: It has armor to make it more beefier than the main Manc, but carries over the former's shootable cannons, as they're flesh tubes. (in which according to lore, could even have a nasty lore background)

 

and a spider enemy could be how you can incorporate a "purple goo" attack, because i always imagined an enemy with a "spider web" that is thrown like a Cybermanc acid pool that can slow down the player.

i also imagine a spider enemy pulling the player with a slinging web MK Scorpion style and said web could also be used when it tries to attach to ceilings and stuff. (like how the Whiplash even uses its whips to go to some places)

 

Also, i remember when 2016 MP had a health regeneration power up: i wonder if that could work for a power up that regenerates both health and ammo, like a "soft" equivalent of pure invulnerability or infinite ammo because there's still a bit of a risk.

 

What else could i mention? oh yeah, whenever i think of people complaining about the HUD in Eternal and how they compare it to 2016's HUD and UI design, i always thought 2016 was still mostly flat holographic shapes.

I feel like a way for Doom to be more stylish is make HUD's and stuff more stylish to the point it can factor in actual illustrations (specially if done like a comic book or heavy metal) and ignore most minimalist stuff.

I feel like Doom 2 RPG is the one time a HUD in Doom was "too literal" where it was made of actual objects/materials and it had an actual heart and armor in the HUD, instead of just symbols representing those.

The most popular Doom hud historically was 1/2's which is essentially a block of concrete with Doomguy's face.

Then you have a beta/alpha thing like this https://tcrf.net/images/5/5e/DoomPCtechdemo-normal.png (which isn't that ideal)

There's just something about stylized or personality heavy videogame HUD's that i think would be cool to see in Doom.

 

edit: apparently, collectables would come in boxes and i assume some of them come in different ranks, specially "smash boxes".

And apprently, id's Alex Palma did a (mostly unofficial) take on the Quake's Shambler.

It's not fuzzy. Shamblers are fuzzy and hugable. 

Something i also would like to see is a more creative take on the DOOM logo.

Because the classic one is a blue top area with pipes and an orange bottom with bricks, you'd see that as UAC vs Hell.

But i feel like a great potential in Doom is customizing the logo, as long as it follows that "2 sides" contrast rule.

Like UAC could be actual screens or hexagon patterns and Hell could be flesh and twisted faces.

Or even Earth buildings, Sentinel argent energy with symbols and Urdak features.

Like just thinking of stuff like ingame objects that fit their themes and the podiums, the logo in itself could be another way to show off the themes of the worlds in Doom.

They could even make a "Doomslayer" themed logo where the upper parts of the DOOM logo are grey and have features from the helmet, then the lower parts are green and have Praetor suit features.

Like with videogame HUDS, even a game's title logo has potential to be more stylish and abandon minimalism.

Quake II remake/sequel/prequel 

gimme that sci-fi action and biomechanical body horror Strogg

or

orrr

Catacombs 4D 

New Quake game that isn't MP focused. We play as Ranger, of course.

People talk about how cartoony Eternal felt but i can see how a Quake revival has to feel gritty.

Not too edgy to cause needless controversies (like stories of devs being forced to watch gruesome shit just to work on gore in a game), but at least stuff that gets into that "inner rebel teen phase", like a twist to "getting in touch with your inner child".

The first Quake had sounds and music work from Trent Reznor and one of its setting/theme influences was HP Lovecraft: this description alone makes you want to see something live up to that personality.

Not just horror in itself but rather a certain mood.

Mick Gordon's music is great but it's clearly made for a "you are the horror" direction while most of Trent's works go for a "underdog" feel.

Which could suit more serious/dramatic works as well as action packed stuff.

Maybe for a Q5 to work, you have to let Trent do whatever he wants as if the music is like directing the story or game. (even Mick was like this for Eternal, despite the things that came after)

And with how modern Doom games try to incorporate music into gameplay, this too could be relevant into Quake 5.

Also, i had an idea about the Hellknight: 2016 made it eyeless and Eternal gave it eyes, while 3 sits in a middleground of having weird eye sockets but no eyes.

What would be the "reverse" to the D3 HK?

On one hand, you could give it seperated eyes like floating eyeballs that assist the HK which is like D3's Hell Guardian but to a certain enemy type. (and maybe mechanically different)

On another, imagine if the 2016 HK had a giant eye for the top of his head, like the upper half of its head is a giant eyeball looking up, so the demon has to turn the head down to look at the player and run in a charge-like move.

You could even tie this into gameplay weakspots or unique/different animations too.

If the 2 coexisted, one could join the gray muscle brute of 2016/Eternal lineage and the other could be more "goat-like" like the classic or at least the Gladiator. (Eternal had concept art of a HK that fused both the classic and modern iterations too)

I want a new Quake stylized as the first one was. Maybe add Cthulu or something

I'd like to see a true Doom 2016 successor. No hell vs heaven drama which even got downsized in TAG 1 + 2 to a minor political conflict instead of a epic "the source of all evil vs. mankind". 

I even think Doom Eternals story, especially TAG 1 + 2s, somehow damaged classic Doom 1 + 2 because now it's just part of a minor plot. 

Another thing about a Quake 5 feeling gritty is probably the tech aesthetic. it would work if it looks "used and outdated" to aim for a certain 90/80's feel, specially compared to the tech we see in 2016 and Eternal.

Giving the impression that the world was this dirty and nasty before the invasion even happened.

At the same time, i always thought the Knight Sentinel could fit Quake even if their magical tech stuff seems a bit "too modern" for Quake 1 standards.

But Strife's aesthetic was kinda like medieval stuff with tech, even if still "outdated" and not under modern tropes or elements.

Also, instead of a Heretic/Hexen 3, wasn't there supposed to be a third Serpent Rider series called "Hectic"? i suppose that would also mean needing Romero's assistance and i guess even make it an indie/retro "boomer shooter" to make it feel like a lost game from the 90's that never came to be.

I wonder if we could have gotten an expansion to tie 2016 and Eternal, where they add in new enemies and level features or power ups to make up for potentially using the same arsenal or even maybe borrow some weapon or inventory from the MP.

Preferably something entirely different. I appreciate what they did with Eternal but to me it missed a lot of what made Doom fun. I hope the next game is more focused on straight up simple combat and exploration instead of juggling grenades and low ammo. Keep the glory kills and the dash and the double jump, that’s all well and good, but the whole chainsaw enemies to get ammo/use flame blech and ice bomb and whatever to win stuff really really isn’t for me 

On 3/3/2021 at 4:26 PM, Captain Keen said:

Another Doom game?

 

Sometimes I think that it would be cool if they could go back to the original doom engine and make a new doom game in there. Of course, being honest, they would probably make it to get money from peoples nostalgia but I still do think it would be cool. Imagine a new weapon like the ballista in Doom 1993. And completely new official maps.

doom 64 remake maybe?

Honestly: Nothing.

Not that I have something against them, but there's nothing connecting Id Software and the original team. Now they are just a team under Zenimax, some of them are fans of the original Doom and Quake games (even though there are not many of them that are part of the community), but the same could be said about Machine Games, Arkane Studios and Tango Gameworks. If they make an original IP that relies even more on the concepts Hugo Martin had for Doom Eternal I'm not going to instantly buy just because it's made by Id Software, I'm going to treat it like most games out there and buy it only if the game turns out to be good or if it has something that interests me.