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revenant_fister

Just Cleared TNT

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Hi,

I just woke up in the middle of the night (couldn't sleep because I had a stomach ache) and ended up FINALLY clearing TNT for the first time. I played on UV, only saving if I went away from the computer.

My thoughts..

The last level - WTF?! You shoot the fucking demon in the nose?! That took me forever to work out. Well, 3 days anyway heh. And when I did it was like.. how boring? You end up killing it in like.. 10 seconds. I was hoping for something a bit more original than a John Romero monster for the last boss. That cyberdemon in there was utterly feeble, too. A real anti-climax.

However, there are some fucking CRACKING levels. Central processing and Admin center both stand out for being huge, rock hard, but ultimately supremely satisfying (and fair) levels. And the hell levels like Mount Pain, Heck, and River Styx were just awesomely atmospheric, in a Doom 1 kinda way. Green bricks and hell skies rock!

This wad has some absolete classic levels. It's a shame it was let down by such a crap ending. And WTF is up with the difficulty level? It goes up and down like a yo-yo.

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I only liked one or two maps from the final episode, then there's the one horrible map that somehow ended up in the mix ala Memento Mori map12 (talking Habitat yo).

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I thought a lot of TNT's later maps (especially in the Hell episode) seemed half baked and not very fun. Admin Center is one of those levels that made me do a double-take and then go WTF. I'm still not sure what the hell Admin Center is supposed to be.

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revenant_fister said:

ended up FINALLY clearing TNT for the first time. I played on UV, only saving if I went away from the computer.

Good. Now try playing each level from scratch, with no saves. A whole new game, isn't it =).

The last level - WTF?! You shoot the fucking demon in the nose?! That took me forever to work out.

I recall Ty Halderman referring to it back then as "pulling a dirty trick", so you're not alone.

I was hoping for something a bit more original than a John Romero monster for the last boss

Many ppl expected Final DOOM to be a further step in DOOM evolution, like DOOM II was (sort of). But it looks like to id themselves it was little more than an opportunity to cash in again on the DOOM franchise (not there's anything wrong with that :). So Final DOOM ended up being glorified mega-WADs ...

However, there are some fucking CRACKING levels. Central processing and Admin center both stand out for being huge, rock hard,
but ultimately supremely satisfying (and fair) levels.

I find Central Processing to be a lot more playable than Admin Center; its sheer atristic superiority is above question, of course.

And the hell levels like Mount Pain, Heck, and River Styx were just awesomely atmospheric, in a Doom 1 kinda way. Green bricks and hell skies rock!

There were some good bits in Mount Pain - the cobwebs in the tunnels and the view of the Mount itself - but it seems to be universally recognized as the ugliest level of the set.
If I had to pick a favorite from the TNT Hell levels, I'd probably go with Ballistix. Now that's a true DOOM (without a 2) level! Exquisite lighting; cramped, convoluted architecture; design bits that are there just for the hell of it (e.g. the barrels burning in the dark outside windows), and a supreme eery soundtrack.

This wad has some absolete classic levels.

Absolutely.

It's a shame it was let down by such a crap ending.

The ending is okay. The individual levels and the tally screens upon their completion are what counts most. As usual with DOOM ...

And WTF is up with the difficulty level? It goes up and down like a yo-yo.

Unlike Plutonia, TNT was designed by a large team of designers from all over the world. That's why it seems less cohesive, the (minor) fault shared by other such mega-WADs like Memento Mori.

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Never Again: When I said I only saved when I went away from the computer, I didn't mean by that that I reloaded that save game if I died. Whenever I died, I restarted that level from scratch. And yeah, Central Processing is a beautiful level, but the original sky sucked a bit. When I played through I was using the starry night sky from those Dante levels. Fucking cool.

The level I thought most like Doom was actually River Styx. Very cool indoor areas. And hey, I actually thought Mount Pain looked cool too. Those hellish buildings on the horizon were rocking.

As for the cashing in on Doom II thing; why couldn't they have just done something a bit more original, with the existing monsters? Maybe a battle with two cyberdemons and a mass of other mosters.. anything other than the boring old Romero head monster.

But that shit in the second last text screen (the one before admin center)- the thing about "this place smells familiar- like fried excrement" that had me laughing my ass off. So THAT'S what he lived on during Doom II.

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revenant_fister said:

And hey, I actually thought Mount Pain looked cool too. Those hellish buildings on the horizon were rocking.


That's supposed to be the mount itself. A kind of a hill, y'know. I did acknowledge the view in the previous post; the thing is, for the most part of the map the scenery you see is crap.

But that shit in the second last text screen (the one before admin center)- the thing about "this place smells familiar- like fried excrement" that had me laughing my ass off. So THAT'S what he lived on during Doom II.


Heh. Never thought of it that way.

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I especially enjoyed level 30, what with the maze-type thing at the beginning. I spent probably a half-hour trying to figure out the path through it! I hated how you died if you made a wrong jump, though. And yes, I, too, was annoyed by the fact that you had to shoot the Icon through its nose.

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It was cool the way the flaming torches at the start corresponded to the correct route, but the rest of the level was disappointing.

I recently cleared Plutonia the same way, and, although Plutonia had a better final level, and a lot of cool cyberdemon levels, I thought TNT had a much better mix of levels, and was generally a little more fun.

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well I dont really care as long as the wad's got a lot of big levels with cybies for me to obliterate! 8D and of course, a big puzzle in thte last level wouldn't hurt either.

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I thought the maze type thing in the last level was out of place.. I would rather have fought through a level that was long and filled with demons instead of having to walk on the platforms in the correct order... Even in hell that type of thing wouldn't make sense.

they could have done something more better for the last fight though, instead of making it very similar to doom2. maybe make it so you would have to cross through the room where the icon of sin is several times, getting keys to open other doors in the main room, and then opening the last door to encounter John's head guarded by somethings..
yeah, that is what I would have done.

I enjoyed TNT, when I didn't know about WADs you could download, this was the best set of maps I have played..

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While I subscribe to Korn's wishful thinking for a better ending, one has to keep in mind that from the start TNT was not meant as a standalone commercial product but a freeware megaWAD.

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We made "Evilution"...it was to be a free d/l on the net but John Romero liked it and made us an offer we could't refuse...:) Id had some special requirements so some changes had to be made. The Casali brothers made Plutonia....


Cadman - Member TeamTNT

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deldelda said:

I especially enjoyed level 30, what with the maze-type thing at the beginning. I spent probably a half-hour trying to figure out the path through it! I hated how you died if you made a wrong jump, though. And yes, I, too, was annoyed by the fact that you had to shoot the Icon through its nose.


Yeah that sucked with the telefrag, me and my brother even used iddt to see if there was something we were missing, we idclipped it to begin with, since we thought it was a game flaw, later I figured it out...Plutonias end was a Baphomet as well,
how unoriginal...*sigh*

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