Is the Doom community in decline?!

Is the Doom community in decline?! I think so, according to what's happening!
Raed this article: http://tormentor667.covers.de/Tormentor667/index_2.php
and mine: http://utenti.lycos.it/ismaele85/.

who cares?

No. While some people are extremely upset about the KDiZD thing, the vast majority of the community doesn't give a crap about the project at all. Quit trying to pretend the community is in shambles simply because of a stupid leak. In fact, if anyone has a beta of anything of mine, feel free to leak it.

It is not. First of all, see this. Second of all, the presence of a few unscrupulous individuals proves nothing as to the general state of the community.

Ismaele said:

Is the Doom community in decline?!

No, the Kool Aid community is in Decline

The community is in good shape. A lot is happening (projects, etc.), this place is lively (and so are a few other Doom sites), and people are generally nice and helpful towards each other.

People join, people leave. Inevitably some of those who leave do so because they feel the community is in a bad way. That doesn't mean that it is.

Since 1993.

"few unscrupulous individuals"!? How many people attackED the "KDiZD" project!? :O
But this is just one of the aspects of the problem...! For instance, there are several Doomers who are isolated from the Doom community... and not because they chose it: they are ignored (@ Bloodshedder: why didn't you post something about my article? Why don't you sometimes post any piece of news about my updates? DoomWorld often isn't up-to-date for long time... although the community is still active: just have a look at my site and many others!). Another aspect of the problem is the "/newstuff Chronicles": it is turning into "/oldstuff Chronicles" and new .WADs are missing.

Scuba Steve said:

Since 1993.

I'm pretty sure the online Doom community grew during the period 1993-1995.

What happened was their private project affair. Dron and some of the participants ended up not liking each other, Dron got pissed and saw an opportunity to mock the others.

All these actions are related to specific "doomer" names, not "the community."

And then NiGHTMARE came here expecting this issue of theirs to be dealt with severity and grandeur, flaming Doomworld because we didn't all dress in black and post a huge update on the matter, saying we were all going to Hell.

Th DOOM community has been in "decline" for 10 years, because the game has been getting older and older. While some events have brought life to it (the release of the source, DOOM 3, the movie, etc.) it is also affected by other events (new glossier games, the original game hardly works on newer computers, etc.) This though, has little or nothing to do with the general morality of the community. And, hey, some news just came in; there seem have been jerks in every community since the dawn of time, and it is said the definition of "jerk" varies a lot according to the eye of the beholder (or the Cacodemon.)

It's pretty lame to go around saying the community is to blame when you have a problem. People with half a heart and half a brain sort out their issues themselves without going into theatrics with bizarre expectations, knowing how to keep together a development team, and not demanding that others do something about their dilemmas.

If you ask me, as long as at least one (preferrably classic) project is in development, and one person is recording demos, the community thrives.

Ismaele said:
Another aspect of the problem is the "/newstuff Chronicles": it is turning into "/oldstuff Chronicles" and new .WADs are missing.

Really? I usually look through the list and there's too much enhanced engine specific stuff, and few old school wads (which I prefer.) I'd agree though that "ports" are kind of losing it as their novelty value declines; but I don't really care, since in my opinion the best thing they do is to act as ports in the changing computer environment.

Also don't put too much faith in getting stuff in relation to some guy that prematurely blames the site about corrupting the community to hit the headlines; when and if KDiZD has something relevant to show, I'm sure you'll be seeing it posted. Nothing stops you from writing whatever you want on your site, or in a blog, but expecting it to be posted as news is another matter, since it's in the administration's hands to determine if what you're offering is productive, or flamebait.

I think the Doom community hasn't ever been in decline... although the game become older and older: just look at the projects in development!

Ismaele said:

(@ Bloodshedder: why didn't you post something about my article? Why don't you sometimes post any piece of news about my updates? DoomWorld often isn't up-to-date for long time... although the community is still active: just have a look at my site and many others!)

While with some of your other updates I just didn't have time to update Doomworld with them (or I'm just lazy), in this particular instance I specifically opted against it because this discussion has already taken place on Doomworld. I didn't want the flames directed at NiGHTMARE directed at you too.

Wow. Kinda high and mighty to think the community is in decline because of the bad rap around your own over hyped project eh?

The community has been in decline ever since I joined haw haw.

One thing I've noticed is /newstuff just hasn't been as exciting these past few months. Less and less quality releases. There were some weeks where it was just like .. wtf. Oh well, maybe that will change.

Grazza said:

I'm pretty sure the online Doom community grew during the period 1993-1995.

Sorry, I meant to say 1996 when Quake was released.

I haven't been making wads anymore, maybe that's the reason why idgames is dying and the community going to shite!11

Kaiser said:

who cares?

Oh, the irony ;)

gargoylol said:

I haven't been making wads anymore, maybe that's the reason why idgames is dying and the community going to shite!11

You made wads?

oh, cry on

also the second article makes my eyes bleed :(

Heh, I dont ever plan on leaving the community, DooM is one of my hobbies (mapper for life)! BTW I always see noobs running around asking questions and and wondering how to map so I dont beleive the community is suffering in any way...

I think the community declined a while ago, but it's been where it is since. Seems healthy enough to me though. I still check in daily for entertaining stuff in the forums, and I always look for a new /newstuff (which I wouldn't mind doing once or twice actually).

I'm still amazed at how many people make good stuff for this old game. It's still my most favorite game to edit with, even though it lacks brushes and real 3D. Then the source ports come along and revive everything.

Pretty cool if you ask me. :)

Heh, old news.

There is no such thing as the Doom community, there is only individuals and their projects.

god who cares

@ Bloodshedder: thank you for helping me in avoiding flames...! ;) He, he! =D Actually I didn't know that this topic have already been discussed and that Nightmare was "flamed"! ;)

@ Jehar: my "own project"?! :o UH?!? Anyway I've supposed that the Doom community is in decline because of the rise of "bad Doomers".

@ Udderdude: you've noticed what I noticed too! :P

@ Stealthy Ivan: Doom editing is one of my favourite hobbies too and, if the Doom community is still alive, we must thank people like us, who really enjoy editing new levels, both for own and other people's fun. :)

@ Jonathan: that's a sad vision of the Doom community! :(

"internet community" wtf

k communities are social and the internet is antisocial. and a decline would mean people got bored and left. a few people getting rightfully pissed off and leaving doesnt mean anything.

Ismaele said:
@ Jonathan: that's a sad vision of the Doom community! :(

It's not sad, I think. Perhaps we could simply define the "community" as the collective individuals that play and work on DOOM, particularly when they interact in well-defined channels (news groups, forums, IRC, websites, etc.) but it's also a good point to note that the "community" can't be defined specifically since it doesn't have a center of any sort and its continuity is always fragmentary. And if it can be perceived, it will be seen in many ways, if any, by anyone involved in DOOM affairs.

Jonathan said:

There is no such thing as the Doom community, there is only individuals and their projects.

Wrong, asshole. "People" are just an abstract concept to describe collections of cells which form our "bodies". Similarly "projects" are just collections of bits on computer hard drives and electrical phenomena in "our" "brains".

Nobody ever gets my obscure political jokes.