[newproject] PROJECT 1994

Ok, it's a working title but who cares:

I've noticed nowadays that people enjoy their lovely newbie-friendly editors like Doom Builder, Deepsea and so on, but what about the people who were stuck with editors such as DEU? I think it's time we went back to the roots and see how 2005 talent can mix with 1994 technology (since you all hate 1994 so damn much). I propose to you, PROJECT 1994!

I plan to create a Doom 1 megawad replacement (not Ultimate Doom) that involves todays mappers going back to the roots of Doom mapping and creating... mediocre detail but excellent gameplay levels for people to enjoy!

Just to prove that I'm serious, I have (almost) finished creating E2M1, which you can see below. If you intend to sign up for this, you must abide to the following:

* DEU 5.21 or earlier, DOOMCAD, and any other 1994 editor
* BSP 1.x (not required)
* Must work with Doom v1.2 (if you don't have it, I can test your map)

Everything else is up to you. Theme, detail, difficulty, you're in control right there!

EDIT: The idea of modifying resources (level title graphics etc) has been thrown around a bit in this thread. If I do consider it, any interested parties must use 1994 applications.

Slots:
E2M1 - deathz0r (in progress)
E2M4 - izm (finished)
E2M5 - myk (reserved)

i want to do the accompanying gfx/sound wad and ill use dmaud for that

can we use deth?

DEU was the first editor I tried way back when...

so cold... so cold... make the bad memories go away...

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FUCKED UP MEGA GASP FOR MEGA AWESOME NESS! AND CAPS!

Hmm...well, I like the concept.

I have to say, though, that I'm not too impressed by the work-in-progress e1m1 you posted. It seemed like you actually went out of your way to make things look bad.

Think about Knee-Deep in the Dead, for example. I'm not trying to turn your project into an episode 1 remake, but KDitD was made before 1994, using the first Doom editor ever, with virtually no other finished levels to get ideas and guidelines from, but it looks good. It has misalignments and some barren areas, but the texture choices are good, the gameplay is fun, and the architecture is creative.

I know you're going for more of an "old-school pwad" feel, but there were some old Doom maps that looked pretty nice. (and not just the ones created by id Software)

Just my two cents.

Mike

I like it.... I really do... I fully support this project. In Fact, I have doomed ready. I will betatest on my 486 for the full experience.

I'm in.

My version of DoomEd came out in 1995, can that work? It crashes routinely and will make random lines part of random sectors if I save something with more than 300 sectors. Also, it took about eleven minutes to build the nodes with the internal builder when doing it on New Nightmare... when it was half done.

I was actually going to try this, but the oldest version of WADED I could find was dated Feb 7th, 1995. Just over 1 month too late. Oh well. :p

superloud4 said:
I have to say, though, that I'm not too impressed by the work-in-progress e1m1 you posted. It seemed like you actually went out of your way to make things look bad.

Who deathz0r? Naaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhh

superloud4 said:

That loong post

Seconded, some very good maps were made on that year. If you want to play the crappy ones, then just play these that are uploaded to TnC. Some of them (the crappy ones) have decent/good gameplay, and are enough to keep you busy for a long time if you feel like playing them all.
Just my opinion, I'd prefer a comunity project based in a more interesting concept.

This is pretty cool overall; I bet I could arse myself to make a map for it. I'd suggest a wad on E2 though, and maybe E3 also if enough people join, since E1 wads weren't encoraged back then: between that and using at least a few E2-3 resources they made sure the wads were not compatible with the shareware, as requested by id (back then the engine didn't have a block on -file for the shareware version.)

Also, what about resources? If anything else were allowed or changed (the title screen, map names, etc.), it should also be made with old software... even old graphics editing utilities (like paint shop 2.x or 3.x, dmgraph, and whatnot.)

Kaiser said:
can we use deth?

DETH is super advanced for this kind of thing; but if you can manage with DETH, DEU 5.21 shouldn't be a problem (except maybe to the system?)

I think the "apps made in '94" rule is the way to go.

DoomCAD has one of the worst node builders I know.
I still have that editor Waded 1.83B. It is designed for DOS and it doesn't recognize the fourth episode of the Ultimate Doom so is that crappy enough?

If it's allowed, I'm in.

DETH is still my favourite editor, but if it's not allowed, i think i can manage with DEU too. But does DEU run on XP? Guess i'll have to try...

Count me in for now, i'll see if i have time to come up with something.

I still use ZethWin. Am I oldschool enough? :P

Old school editors? SURE! Give me windows 95/98 computer and I'll join.

*gives smart ass look*

DarkFoxSoldier20 said:

Old school editors? SURE! Give me windows 95/98 computer and I'll join.

*gives smart ass look*

Not old enough my young padawan.

myk said:

I'd suggest a wad on E2 though, and maybe E3 also if enough people join, since E1 wads weren't encoraged back then: between that and using at least a few E2-3 resources they made sure the wads were not compatible with the shareware, as requested by id (back then the engine didn't have a block on -file for the shareware version.)

Point taken. If I don't get enough submissions to replace all three episodes, I'll settle with E2/E3.

Also, what about resources? If anything else were allowed or changed (the title screen, map names, etc.), it should also be made with old software... even old graphics editing utilities (like paint shop 2.x or 3.x, dmgraph, and whatnot.)

There won't be any resources modified in the WAD. People are entitled to make their own resource WAD, but I don't prefer to replace resources. Who knows, that might change if I can think of a valid reason to do so.

I think the "apps made in '94" rule is the way to go.

Good idea. I'll edit the first post.

Azriel said:

I still have that editor Waded 1.83B. It is designed for DOS and it doesn't recognize the fourth episode of the Ultimate Doom so is that crappy enough?

If it's dated before January 1st 1995, sure.

As a matter of fact, I'll check two of my magazine cover CDs (which have a boatload of various Doom junk and are dated December 1994 and April 1995 respectively) for any editors dated 1994.

Now how come when I did this everyone said the idea sucked? :( :( :( :(

In any case, I'll sign on. I haven't got a whole lot of shit going on right now :P

Waded 1.83 is from early 1995 and I don't wanna spend time learning an older editor so I'm out. Too bad though cause I'm quite good at making original Doom-style levels.

And besides, the editors made by regular people dated from 1994 aren't that great. The original editor used by ID must have been alot better so why can't we use a bit better material and still maintain the original Doom feeling?

Ok, Waded 1.83 IS from 1995 but I have to work under DOS for crying out loud. Those are the same conditions ID had worked under.

Waded has a better node builder, that means no HOM effects and crappy see-trough walls like the worthless nodebuilder from DoomCAD.

Ofcourse it's your choice if you let me join or not.

Also, I don't really get the idea. In your first post you say: ...2005 talent mix up with 1994 technology.
(No offence but your first level doesn't actually have 2005 talent)
And a little further you say little detail but great gameplay.
2005 talent designes levels with alot of detail.

I think you should say: Make what you want (detailed or not) with 1994 technology OR Make Doom styled levels (using 1994-1996 technology or something)

deathz0r said:

I've noticed nowadays that people enjoy their lovely newbie-friendly editors like Doom Builder, Deepsea and so on, but what about the people who were stuck with editors such as DEU?

User friendly? Fucking up all my sectors so I need to get back to ZETH (after a week of work with DB) and check the whole damn map for about an hour because I still got "not closed sectors". No-No, too much fineness, too litle precision.

DEU editors all the way.

Since nobody has asked this before I'll do:

How do you intend to check whether the maps were made with a genuine 1994 editor. What's keeping people from using DoomBuilder and then just pretend they used DEU?

Graf Zahl said:

Since nobody has asked this before I'll do:

How do you intend to check whether the maps were made with a genuine 1994 editor. What's keeping people from using DoomBuilder and then just pretend they used DEU?

Would those older editors like a map made with DooM builder? I imagine it uses some more advanced methods for whatever.

Wadauther dosent like doombuilder maps, so i guess Deu would not open them...

Liberation said:

Wadauther dosent like doombuilder maps, so i guess Deu would not open them...

ZETH opens DB maps, and vice-versa. Full compatibility.

Liberation said:

Wadauther dosent like doombuilder maps, so i guess Deu would not open them...

Then WadAuthor is a piece of crap. DoomBuilder's maps are perfectly valid in every conceivable way. The only reason why older editors may not open newer maps are memory limits or something like that. A real-mode DOS editor won't be able to load much. But then, DEU521GCC is perfectly valid for this, isn't it?

On the other hand, WadAuthor's maps are easily recognizable because the 'impassible' flag.

Well it was just from expirence, and i wouldnt go as far calling it a piece of crap Graf...

Liberation said:

Wadauther dosent like doombuilder maps

How doesn't it like them?

Graf Zahl said:

Then WadAuthor is a piece of crap. DoomBuilder's maps are perfectly valid in every conceivable way.

I wouldn't say so, I've opened quite a few DB maps with WadAuthor. No problems at all, since those maps are perfectly valid in every conceivable way.

Well when i was helping out Dark shadow with Fatal disaster i could never load up his maps, i just assumed it was coz he used Doombuilder..

Thinking about this project, i would like to help but i dont really want to learn a dos editor, where there any wadauther versions before 1995??