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Tango

MegaWad Ideas?

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I had a few ideas that I thought were kinda cool, so I figured I'd share them here and see what you guys thought.

2 Texture/Flat - Mappers would only be allowed to use a limited amount of textures and flats. Something like 2 would be good IMO.

1 Weapon - Still thinking about this idea, but maybe something where only a rocket launcher could be used might be interesting.

Thoughts?

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I like your ideas. I see lots of great potential in this project. Heres to hoping it gets finished some day.

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Tango said:

2 Texture/Flat - Mappers would only be allowed to use a limited amount of textures and flats. Something like 2 would be good IMO.


I do this anyway. Much more fun.

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I've found that limitations can encourage creativity and be great fun. Try it out.

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Gah, all this (plus 10 Sectors, Congestion 1024) look like the frenchy* literature group OuLiPo. I call this OuDoomPo.

* But not only

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2 Texture/Flat
1 Weapon


I've had similar thoughts to both of these before, whenever there's a megawad-with-constraints announced.

If this were to be a community-built megawad, I'd like to see the participants pick their textures/flats ahead of time and stick to their choices. Combinations that one thinks would go well together may or may not once you actually see them in the level...

A rocket launcher-only map with small rooms/corridors could be interesting or annoying. Probably both...

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1. 10 sectors (sector count)
2. 1024 (area dimesions)
3. 2 sectors (sector count)
4. 1 monster (thing type)
5. speedmapping (time restriction)
6. themed (texture/setting restriction: e.g. tech)

i contributed to #2 and have maps in the works for #4 and the 1024 competition too.

also there was the advent calendar, no restrictions per-se but somehow feels like it's in the same boat

restricting texture/flat might not work (but by all means try) ... one such restriction could be doom ep 1 tex only, for example.

will think of some ideas and post them here if i can

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CODOR said:

A rocket launcher-only map with small rooms/corridors could be interesting or annoying. Probably both...

Definitely annoying, if Andy's Wad map 11 is anything to go by

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Foofoo said:

yay pointlessly limiting yourself. :(

My words! Latest sourceports are capable of amazing things, and still, persons get ideas like creating an "one monster wad", speedmapping sessions and other things like that! Don't limit yourself!

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Tormentor667 said:
My words! Latest sourceports are capable of amazing things, and still, persons get ideas like creating an "one monster wad", speedmapping sessions and other things like that! Don't limit yourself!

No, now go away.

Want me to go comment in every ZDoom-only/feature-happy wad thread how useless I think they are to me? To each his own. Now fuck off and quit the out-of-place propaganda.

cycloid said:
restricting texture/flat might not work (but by all means try) ... one such restriction could be doom ep 1 tex only, for example.

It would work, and although 1/1 certainly seems too severe, a definite low amount of textures and flats could well be used as a base to test what mappers can come up with; of course each mapper would select the particular graphics used for their map (everyone using the same set would be dull). A E1 set-only wad or contest wouldn't really be very special, since it's been done before (doesn't the whole chretro do that, as well as the E1 contest wad?) and to a good degree E1-like wads are very common (even if they stray in texture usage a bit sometimes.)

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Foofoo said:

yay pointlessly limiting yourself. :(

Yeah, but you can't tell me that 1024 wasn't a fun and interesting wad. I find that limiting yourself can be quite enjoyable sometimes.
As for the rocket launcher idea, it wouldn't necessarily be a lot of small rooms, but being able to only use the rocket launcher would put a twist on the game-play.

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myk said:

It would work, and although 1/1 certainly seems too severe, a definite low amount of textures and flats could well be used as a base to test what mappers can come up with; of course each mapper would select the particular graphics used for their map (everyone using the same set would be dull).


What about restricting the mapper to 6 or 10 textures/flats. IE, they could chose six textures and four flats, or two textures and 8 flats.
..With an extra rules that requires all locked doors, teleports, exits, switches, hurty floors and so on to be clearly marked as such (or unclearly marked, yet marked if they are to be secrets).


Another idea I've been toying with is a project where every participant is given a custom texture wad with textures and flats that are all monochrome. Only these may be used.
The idea is that you will be forced to use nifty architechture, colour schemes and linedef art in order to make your levels look good.
Also the levels will look trippy.

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Tormentor667 said:

My words! Latest sourceports are capable of amazing things, and still, persons get ideas like creating an "one monster wad", speedmapping sessions and other things like that! Don't limit yourself!


I think this is a reaction to the fancy modern sourceports; map creators suddenly have very few technical limitations so they have to bring in artificial limitations to make it a challenge... Although limiting textures and flats would be easier in ZDoom; they're interchangable, so suddenly the number of possible wall/floor/ceiling combinations goes way up.

Another thought: a single-weapon level couldn't use former sergeants or chaingunners, or at least would have to prevent them from dying where the player could get their weapons. Unless the level's weapon is the shotgun or chaingun, of course...

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CODOR said:
or at least would have to prevent them from dying where the player could get their weapons.

And they are pretty appropriate for placing in cages, ledges or alcoves the Player can't reach, from where they pelt the Player.

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Tormentor667 said:

speedmapping sessions


Speedmapping looks fun and thats reason enough to take part.

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I have a megawad idea that has legions of monsters from not only Doom/II but from Heretic, and Hexen (This has been done before with udderdude's HOC and ROC and why do the same thing with Doom?) Hell Revealed style, and have the maxium amount of detail that ZDoom can hadle.

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myk said:

No, now go away.
Want me to go comment in every ZDoom-only/feature-happy wad thread how useless I think they are to me? To each his own. Now fuck off and quit the out-of-place propaganda.

Thx for this very kind comment, I absolutely don't know where's the problem.I don't advertise ZDoom, GZDoom or anything else, I just don't understand the sense in limiting a map/megawad by just using 2 textures or just one single monster per map?! Feel free to explain!

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Really some of these limitations are just silly. Its all good until you go to an extreme. Take 10sector/2sector for instance; 10sector is a great wad, lots of fun to be had, and precious few crappy maps, 2sector is...tedious at best. I don't think it was because 2sector didnt have enough mappers that were good enough, I think it was because 2 sectors does not a good megawad make. Same with extremely low texture, weapon, or monster limits. Limits are good, but they can get out of hand just like feature happy wads.

This is not to say I dont enjoy limited wads. As I stated above I enjoyed 10sector quite a bit. I'm also mapping for the 1024 wad (assuming it didnt die), and I wouldnt mind seeing some good wads with well exercised limits.

My 2p.

EDIT: And any "1 weapon wad" wouldn't be 1 weapon. I dont think you can remove all player weapons with deh even.

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HobbsTiger1 said:
I don't think it was because 2sector didnt have enough mappers that were good enough, I think it was because 2 sectors does not a good megawad make.

The concept both moved authors to make maps without much stress or concern, and produced maps that produced good games (i.e., demos, showing they were worthy for play.) I liked that one; sure it wasn't 10sectors, but that was "the first" and also pretty much an official site competition with prizes and all, back when more mappers were active.

If you ask me, 2sectors was more noteworthy than many other projects. Plus why the hell not make a wad with the "minimum possible elements"? Sounds very healthy to me, particularly if a game is good, like DOOM is. Just the type of thing community projects should go for; projects with a simple technical premise. Particularized teams and individuals can take care of the more complex and individual projects, that tend to be distracting for competitions and "quick specials".

Note also how people openly discuss the possibilities of these simpler projects, and produce stuff pretty quickly, compared to the more sluggish and obscure standard or feature-oriented efforts.

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In my defense I didnt mean to bash 2sector in paticular. There are good maps there. Just not 32 of them :P

And theres something appealing about the barest minimum sure, but I find the appeal can more often be from the technical (creators) standpoint than that of the audience.

Its just my opinion (which in retrospect came out because I dont know how to properly shut up); should some wad be born from this thread (and I hope so) I would judge it the same as I would any other.

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IMHO it is a pretty silly project! =P Why should you limit yourself?! I can't imagine a good level with just 1 texture, 1 flat, 1 monster and 1 weapon... this is just ridiculous!

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HobbsTiger1 said:

In my defense I didnt mean to bash 2sector in paticular. There are good maps there. Just not 32 of them :P

Undeniably true, given that the wad contained only 16 maps (plus an alternate version of one of them). I would also suggest that the fact that it contained some very interesting maps shows that the concept itself was fine. It surely also has a far lower "development time to playing time" ratio than most projects, which can't be a bad thing.

Having said that, I must say I'm sceptical of the 1-monster project. But we'll see.

RjY: I wouldn't judge the "one weapon" concept on the basis of one level in a wad that was as a whole designed to annoy as much as possible.

Ismaele said:

Why should you limit yourself?!

Because when people have limited themselves, the result has often been very fun and playable maps that didn't take a lifetime to create, perhaps? Doesn't mean you should always limit yourself, but the fact that the results have been good in the past is a reason to consider doing it again, and why it certainly isn't at all ridiculous.

CODOR said:

Another thought: a single-weapon level couldn't use former sergeants or chaingunners, or at least would have to prevent them from dying where the player could get their weapons.

If this is considered a problem, you could use dehacked to stop them dropping weapons. Of course, that would apply to every map in such a wad, so they would need to be designed with that taken into account.

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Grazza said:

Undeniably true, given that the wad contained only 16 maps (plus an alternate version of one of them).


oshi heh. My mistake :\

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Little Faith said:

project where every participant is given a custom texture wad with textures and flats that are all monochrome. Only these may be used.
The idea is that you will be forced to use nifty architechture, colour schemes and linedef art in order to make your levels look good.
Also the levels will look trippy.


If I understand this idea, it's awesome. Sort of like 8-bit dm but the textures don't flash, and you don't go for random colors all over.

Pwnage, I feel like doing my own wad like this.

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Tango said:

2 Texture/Flat - Mappers would only be allowed to use a limited amount of textures and flats. Something like 2 would be good IMO.

1 Weapon - Still thinking about this idea, but maybe something where only a rocket launcher could be used might be interesting.

One weapon sounds extremely boring....
The 2 Texture/Flat idea though, is pretty interesting. This would force the mappers to make full use of the exsisting Doom textures, kind of like Toke does.

Foofoo said:

yay pointlessly limiting yourself. :(

Hey, you're the one who refuses to use DeHaCkeD and advanced source ports, is that not also limiting yourself?

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Epyo said:

If I understand this idea, it's awesome. Sort of like 8-bit dm but the textures don't flash, and you don't go for random colors all over.

Indeed, except you are free to make as much detail as you want.

There should be a texture and flat for each colour in the Doom palette and a few animated textures that would oscillate between for example light and dark green for nukage or whatever. Also probably some switches in red/green white/black and so forth. Still solid-colour though.

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Maybe only being alowed to use two types of monsters two types of textures/flats and two sectors to work with.
And maybe make all this inside the 1024 X 1024 square but maybe thats too much of an limitation.
But maybe it will be fun to try out its an interesting idea.

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