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Impie

Pistol start in ZDoom

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I miss pistol starts, and I've turned the option screens in ZDoom upside-down and inside-out looking for a "pistol start after death" option or a way to disable the between-level autosave function. I even tried messing with the co-op settings hoping it'd have some effect on single player (ever the optimist) with no luck. I'm not generally an idiot about figuring out computer programs, but I'd be lying if I said I didn't have a knack for missing teeny, obvious details. I hoped somebody here could give me a hand (with or without laughing at me).

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Zdoom will always restart from the last save that was made, either an auto-save or a normal one. Zdoom needs this for compatibility with Hexen, Heretic, Stife and the auto save function. If you want, you could always type 'map mapXX' (or 'map eXmX' if your using doom) to restart the map completely.

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Edward850 said:

Zdoom needs this for compatibility with Hexen, Heretic, Stife and the auto save function.

Uh... and why can't it have the regular Doom behavior when you're not playing Hexen, Heretic, or Strife?

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I don't think there's a way to acheive this automatically from level to level. Level warping is probably your only option.

Bring down the console with the "~" key. Type "map <mapnum>" to perform the warp (i.e. "map 12" for E1M2 in Doom1, "map map12" for level 12 in Doom2).

You can also use the built-in Doom cheat "idclev" (i.e. "idclev 12"). This doesn't require the use of the console.

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put "disableautosave 2" in the console. I don't think it helps when you're dead and you're trying to restart that level with the pistol though.

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Yeah, I've been using idclev. I just hoped there was another way to do it. Ah, well. Thanks a bunch for the suggestions, guys.

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Edward850 said:
Zdoom needs this for compatibility with Hexen, Heretic, Stife and the auto save function.

I'm sure Heretic has no such feature, and as far as I remember, neither does Hexen, but I haven't played it in a good while. Not sure about Strife. What's true is that Randy Heit seems to have chosen to nearly always replace older behavior with newer behavior, which in the end makes ZDoom function for the most part like Boom with Hexen oriented features and physics, as opposed to like a Doom engine, even while running Doom levels.

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myk said:

I'm sure Heretic has no such feature, and as far as I remember, neither does Hexen,


Hexen has to. It creates a hidden savegame for restarting after death. Yes, ZDoom restarts the last autosave but so what? If you disable autosaves you get what you want.

What's true is that Randy Heit seems to have chosen to nearly always replace older behavior with newer behavior, which in the end makes ZDoom function for the most part like Boom with Hexen oriented features and physics, as opposed to like a Doom engine, even while running Doom levels. [/B][/quote]
There is no such thing as 'Hexen physics'. The only feature Hexen (pardon: Heretic) added was proper vertical collision detection - and if you detest that - guess what: It can be disabled!

Besides, Doom's physics are such utter crap that there's enough reason for at least one engine that tries to make them more consistent. Even though some hardcore Doomers prefer to keep all the bugs intact many others don't. The way you phrase it it's like it is an absolute negative.

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Graf Zahl said:
There is no such thing as 'Hexen physics'. The only feature Hexen (pardon: Heretic) added was proper vertical collision detection

Okay, but as you can see above I was referring to both features and physics. Also, there are various tweaks in Boom that aren't explained merely by bug fixing, such as monsters pushed off ledges or corpses becoming passable quickly. My point is that the changes were for the most part taken in "as is", rather than with specific testing and consideration (and thus eventually you had to add some compatibilities).

Even though some hardcore Doomers prefer to keep all the bugs intact many others don't.

Don't get me wrong; I don't think ZDoom should really behave much more like Doom (that's what other engines are for), and since such differences exist and come up in discussions (often as part of issues), it's good to sort them out, clarify them, and determine why they are thus and what their benefits or disadvantages are.

there's enough reason for at least one engine that tries to make them more consistent.

Naturally I like Doomsday's approach more, as far as that goes.

The way you phrase it it's like it is an absolute negative.

I believe this post has now clarified how that's not the case.

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myk said:

such as monsters pushed off ledges


I have scratched my head countless times already to find something that both retains compatibility with Boom scrollers and the original but so far haven't found a good solution.


My point is that the changes were for the most part taken in "as is", rather than with specific testing and consideration (and thus eventually you had to add some compatibilities).


Most of the compatibility options come from Boom.
And to be honest, I detest them. If possible I'd prefer solutions that keep the improved behavior but handle it in a way that remains as compatible as possible. But most of the damage was already done before I had the chance to think about it.

Naturally I like Doomsday's approach more, as far as that goes.


I don't. The problem lies elsewhere. It's more a symptom of not thinking things through before changing them.


I believe this post has now clarified how that's not the case.


Sure it has.

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Splatter said:

Just use ZDL with ZDoom and you can pistol-start any map, any wad, anytime.

That's not the issue here. One could easily pistol start any map with a simple IDCLEV, but the OP wanted to set it to do it automatically after death, which ZDL won't help with.

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Yeah, and he got a solution to that several posts ago. But posts like...

Impie said:

I've been using idclev. I just hoped there was another way to do it.


... made it seem he also wanted an alternative to idclev. It's also simpler to just use the frontend to go directly to the map you want to pistol-start, unless you're playing through the whole episode or iwad in one go.

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Splatter said:

It's also simpler to just use the frontend to go directly to the map you want to pistol-start, unless you're playing through the whole episode or iwad in one go.

Yes, but it seems like he wanted to pistol-start after death, which means he'd already be playing the map.

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Restarting from death with a pistol is incredibly annoying and I strongly support this choice of a sensible default. Go ZDoom!

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I use a batch file. So I never need to save or load. I find this the best way.
Back when I still used to save games, I would idclev to map and save right away. So if I die, it would autoload the pistol start.

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