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ellmo

Didn't obstacles stop projectiles at some point in time?

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I'm ashamed.
Been playing Doom for 17 years and I can't recall if projectiles like rockets, plasma bolts and all types of fireballs used to explode upon hitting an obstacle thing (tree, tech column, pillars, torches and so on)

I'm running chocolate and prboom with complevel 2, and they both let projectiles pass trhough obstacles. Has it always been like that?

Crapalicious, was meant to post it in General section

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Yes. It's the other idTech1 games (don't care about Chex Quest) that fully block projectiles. Also note that the stubs of Doom obstacles are also fully solid, explaining why in Hell Revealed MAP24 your plasma hits the bases of those torches near the start.

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I usually play in GZDoom or Skulltag and obstacles stop projectiles but let Tracers through. It's been a long time since I've played the original EXE's and I haven't played Chocolate enough to check.

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I'd love it if future versions of ZDoom would switch the default setting in Doom to Doom mode regarding projectiles vs obstacles.

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ZDoom, because it allows actors to pass over or under each other, gives heights to scenery, so that projectiles now hit obstacles. But there is a recent compatibility option giving the vanilla passthrough height back, restoring the behavior, which I always have turned on. Many ZDoom maps may depend on the ZDoom solid behavior though.

Which ports first allowed over/under movement? Was it Boom? I know Heretic, Hexen, and Strife had it. Did ZDoom have the first set of actor heights for Doom decorations?


EDIT: 3 new posts? I need to type faster

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Uch, too much information.

So the answer is yes, trees, stalagmites, torches, pillars and so on ALWAYS let projectiles through, or what?

I know in vanilla doom actors were infinitely tall, that's why I thought obstacles always blocked things from flying through it. They block Lost Souls and they're basically projectiles.

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In vanilla Doom, these objects are 16-unit tall. But you can't cross them because there's infinite collision. Only projectiles are checked for height. So if a fireball passes above you, it doesn't damage you.

Since the "actual" height of these obstacles is below their apparent height, projectiles can pass through them most of the time. Only if they fly close to the floor will they be blocked.


And technically, lost souls are not projectiles. They don't have the MISSILE flag.

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@Gez - Thank you very much, now I understand.

Gez said:

And technically, lost souls are not projectiles. They don't have the MISSILE flag.

Kinda always assumed they were.

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The vanilla Doom clipping behavior intrigues me. It's interesting how some types of things are restricted and others not from various clipping types. Here's what I'm seeing in Doom:

- Thing collision outside their height range -> so being a projectile is the only way to have z-clipping in Doom?
- Impassable linedef collision -> which objects are exempted? MISSILE+NOBLOCKMAP?
- Blockmonsters linedef collision -> I assume that all non-players and non-projectiles are monsters in Doom?
- NOBLOCKMAP inertia -> Stationary flares and blood won't ever be moved up and down by lifts, but will fall when spawned.
- 3dmidtex collision -> Is it really impossible to make projectiles go through them like it is possible through objects or impassable lines?
- MBF Torque falling -> Which objects are deemed sentient by MBF anyway?
- ZCajun bot slimophobia (ZDoom 1.22) -> Are they physically blocked from slime or are just squeamish?

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printz said:

- Thing collision outside their height range -> so being a projectile is the only way to have z-clipping in Doom?

It should be fairly obvious why this is the case.

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ellmo said:

I'm running chocolate and prboom with complevel 2, and they both let projectiles pass through obstacles. Has it always been like that?

Given that both these aim to keep demo compatibility with vanilla (successfully in almost all cases), they would fail pretty badly if they didn't emulate it correctly in a fundamental aspect like this.

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