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Royal_Sir

3dm: 3 Deathmatch Maps

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I enjoy mapmaking, but abhor things placement and designing carefully orchestrated battles, so I figured I should map for multiplayer matches, so I could avoid that.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9qowh759iagkk8p/3dm.wad?dl=0

 

3 small maps, ideal for 4 players but can handle at least 8.

Boom compatability... not that it really matters.

Screenshot_Doom_20180425_042835.png.cb9cb87e1287da5379d63194d3283576.pngScreenshot_Doom_20180425_043058.png.88e5024845751f29e6bca50d709579b2.pngScreenshot_Doom_20180425_043121.png.ef29efaaa887f088eefdd9ee1dd83fe8.png

...as made by a guy who's never once played a multiplayer match :P

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12 hours ago, Royal_Sir said:

I enjoy mapmaking, but abhor things placement and designing carefully orchestrated battles, so I figured I should map for multiplayer matches, so I could avoid that.

 

as made by a guy who's never once played a multiplayer match :P

It shows. A sloppy assortment of things spread across the maps with no rhyme or reason. Spawns haphazardly tossed in with absolutely no thought given to game play. Dead ends, quasi teleports, no definitive areas of battle, cramped spaces and bumpy floors. And that's just map01. Nice theme though.

 

Nice error messages of missing textures.

 

map02 looking gr8. Other than being nauseating to walk around in, the map is more of a maze and hoping to stumble upon your enemy than having any direction on where to go with visibility. If you've never played DM, why bother making DM maps? You clearly have no clue what's going on, you wasted your time making these, and wasted our time playing them only to say in the end "damn that sucked."

 

map03 got a nice frozen waterfall. map03 layout wise wouldn't actually be that bad if it was touched up, those god awful bars removed, and an actual player who knew how to do thing placement for balanced game play. No dm experience = not having a clue how to balance a map, and this is a prime example with a super easy access bfg with tons of ammo mere moments away and a goddamn invisibility sphere. Maybe you should actually take a moment and "carefully orchestrate" the thing placement and you might end up with a decent map.

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did this dude shit in your breakfast or what, decay?

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15 hours ago, Tango said:

did this dude shit in your breakfast or what, decay?

@Decay takes his deathmatch level design and gameplay seriously. He's actually been pretty consistent with his commenting on various DM-related projects when he thinks the level design/gameplay is subpar (for whatever reason).

 

And I have to admit, I had some similar thoughts when I read the OP's statement that he never played multiplayer. I put deathmatch starts and items in maps when I design them (except for the Hell Knight CP map), but I do so fully cognizant of the fact that I'm not a deathmatch player and that's not the gameplay mode I'm targeting when I design a map, so it may or may not pan out as I expect.

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I enjoy mapmaking, but abhor things placement and designing carefully orchestrated battles, so I figured I should map for multiplayer matches, so I could avoid that.

 

Decay's post is the solution to this thread, not the problem. You can't just decide "I'm not in the mood for effort today, I'll shit out a low-effort arena and those DM morons will eat it up" I have no interest in playing a DM map made with this mentality when I could play any of the others with actual effort and thought put into them. It's unfortunate that this mentality exists in the first place: I'd suggest anyone who wants to make a DM map consider that there is already a metric ton of DM maps which are poor either because they had no thought put in or did not age well, we already have enough garbage DM maps to sift through without more lazily tossed into the mix.

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gotta agree with Decay here - yeah he's blunt about it but he's not sugarcoating anything, he knows what he's talking about with DM

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I'm not arguing that any of the criticisms are invalid - but there is a difference to me between providing some warranted criticism and being a dick. especially if your goal is to foster inclusiveness in the multiplayer scene, I don't know why you would litter your criticisms with implications like "maybe someone with half a brain could salvage this with better thing placement" and "if you put some effort into this, maybe you could make something decent"

 

5 hours ago, Marcaek said:

 

Decay's post is the solution to this thread, not the problem. You can't just decide "I'm not in the mood for effort today, I'll shit out a low-effort arena and those DM morons will eat it up" I have no interest in playing a DM map made with this mentality when I could play any of the others with actual effort and thought put into them. It's unfortunate that this mentality exists in the first place: I'd suggest anyone who wants to make a DM map consider that there is already a metric ton of DM maps which are poor either because they had no thought put in or did not age well, we already have enough garbage DM maps to sift through without more lazily tossed into the mix.

 

I understand the sentiment but ultimately I don't see this as that big an issue I guess. if someone wants to make low effort content and post it, I don't think anyone should stop them. or, at least, I don't think what's been posted here comes anywhere near crossing that line, even if they happen to be wildly unsuited for dm. you could make the same argument about single player maps given the volume of relative-beginner maps that get posted here all the time, and I don't think the point would be any more valid there. I also think that it's a little to dishonest to make the assumption that these were made with the intent of "fooling some dumb DM morons" or anything along those lines. it seems to me like OP just made some shit, thought it was cool, and decided to post them

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I was hardly being a dick, honestly. Maybe a little rude at best. Not of the criticisms are invalid (otherwise I would not have posted them), and of course if someone comes in with the attitude of "I don't want to put in effort" I'm going to be a bit crass in my remarks. Put out low effort stuff, get low effort feedback. Please point out where I said "maybe someone with half a brain could salvage this with better thing placement" because while it definitely sounds exactly like something I'd say, I'd likely only say that to someone I've known for a long time. Saying "if you knew what you were doing (aka being a dm player) the map could be salvaged with better thing placement" is 100% valid. Take it at face value (hey if you played dm you would know how to do this better) instead of digging deeper to find insults that aren't there (lol d00d you're a fucking idiot, a monkey could salvage this with better placement).

 

I don't think these were made to "fool some dumb DM morons" but acknowledging being lazy about such crucial aspects of DM mapping is just bad. If a regular DM player, known in the pvp community, made subpar maps, there would be an endless barrage of memes, insults, trolling, etc, with absolutely no real feedback within it. Valid criticisms with some sarcasm is not a big deal, and if it is, don't get into pvp because you'll either rage out or end up as a puddle of tears on the floor. If the recipient of such critique chooses to get offended over THAT post, Weenie Hut General is around the corner.

 

"if you put some effort into this, maybe you could make something decent" I guess this is specifically referring to my last line here "Maybe you should actually take a moment and "carefully orchestrate" the thing placement and you might end up with a decent map."

 

I say "might end up with a decent map" because I don't know for sure. It's very easy to tell when a map will play poorly, but can be very difficult to see if a map will play well based on first glances and suggestions. It could take several revisions to make good, or it might never be good because the structural layout is intuitively bad. I don't know. So I say might/maybe instead of "it will be better."

 

I'd be perfectly happy for OP to disagree with any of the criticisms, so long as the reasons are valid (which could be as wide ranging of "I don't intend for serious play so this unbalance is fine by me" or "I will completely restructure this map for balance reasons x,y,z"), or if there are questions regarding the criticism I'd be happy to answer.

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Posted (edited)

Decay said this in 99999 more words but placement of spawns and weapons makes or breaks a map. Even a kinda shitty layout can be okay if the spawns and weapons are well placed.

 

EDIT: Other than the glitched spots, these have a really nice visual style.

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