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MTF Sergeant

What if Classic Doom had permadeath?

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Played through the new Doom's Ultra Nightmare difficulty for a while. Then this question suddenly popped out?

 

If Id had included a permadeath difficulty from Doom 1 onwards, I'd guess it will be even more fun to play.

 

When it comes to Doom 1, then I might consider you have to play the entire episode again. But Doom 2, Plutonia, TNT and Doom 3 players would be just unlucky.

I'm pretty sure it would be more fun this way. Any ideas?

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This comes down to personal preference above all, but if id had included such a thing, I'd have avoided it. It's more exciting, but what that excitement would be for me would be more stress.

That said, I wouldn't be against the idea of them including it, because there's lots of people who'd play it, just because I wouldn't. No need to exclude a potential feature just because a few people don't like it and can choose to not play it.

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If they had it in Doom 1 and wanted to keep it in Doom 2, I'd imagine the text screens would act like checkpoints, where instead of losing your progress entirely, you'd just be forced to restart the level after the last text screen with a pistol start.

 

I mean, the text screens are seemingly there for the same reason they were included in Doom 1, just with the added benefit of being able to continue directly after one instead of having to go the New Game and select the next episode. More importantly, though, as you hinted at going from 8-9 map permadeath sessions to a 30 map one would just be such an extreme change in what the mode would mean, so giving more meaning to the "episodes" of Doom 2 for this purpose would make a lot of sense to prevent the whole mode from being overwhelming.

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4 minutes ago, Arctangent said:

If they had it in Doom 1 and wanted to keep it in Doom 2, I'd imagine the text screens would act like checkpoints, where instead of losing your progress entirely, you'd just be forced to restart the level after the last text screen with a pistol start.

That's a good idea. Without some kind of checkpoints it would be unbearable.

 

I'm still not convinced that permadeath works for games with a static enemy/item/geometry layout… but it's easy to play any game as if it had permadeath, so I'm not sure that it's worth the effort to implement it in the game.

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There's the dw ironman leauge, which puts it to practice. Its good for competition and challenge i guess, but would make doom way less relaxing. Also there's the static monsters/things/... placement.

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5 hours ago, Manuel-K said:

That's a good idea. Without some kind of checkpoints it would be unbearable.

 

I'm still not convinced that permadeath works for games with a static enemy/item/geometry layout… but it's easy to play any game as if it had permadeath, so I'm not sure that it's worth the effort to implement it in the game.

I would say that there would be good reasons to implement a Permadeath difficulty setting. Since it was initially invented (as a separate game mechanic), it could be used to prevent people from repeatedly loading from a saved game by wiping the contents of the saved game slot when it was loaded. That would allow you to play across multiple sessions, so long as you didn't try to repeatedly reload your game (which you wouldn't be able to). This mechanic could be the same regardless of the Doom. You could even implement it for any of the individual difficulty levels if you wanted to.

 

(Ultra I'm Too Young to Die)   :-)

 

I imagine there would have been players that would have enjoyed that type of difficulty setting. Personally, I doubt I would have played that difficulty setting, but to each his own.

 

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They should have Doom feature permadeath in the sense that once you die in the game (for whatever reason) you'll never be able to play the game again because you died. And they could mock you with this whenever you try to start a new game.

 

 

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Doom already has something more punishing. If you don't save you are forced to restart the map with shit gear. Not good enough to pistol start the map? Tough luck time to get destroyed or restart!

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In single-player (or survival coop mode with 1 life), you do not respawn. That's permadeath. By permadeath, do you mean not being able to save the game? That is a strange way of saying it. That would be a really bad idea. I would not be still playing Doom now if I could not save the game, and surely I would not be the only one. I think that would have killed the game. There would be no Doom 2016, no Doom 3, and maybe even no Doom 2.

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That sounds like the console versions lol (especially in the Doom SNES version, which you must clear ALL maps without dying once <again, if you die, you'll start in the map that you die and respawn with pistol> in order to clear it)

The idea of permadeath seems doable if the game has a sort of life count system that doesn't relies on password or saves at all....

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Play oblige maps on ironman to experience Rogue-_like Doom 😉

 

You don't really a mode for that,just do handicap runs 😄

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Oblige can create some remarkably brutal maps with low level enemies if you're not careful in configuration, so that sounds about right.

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Save exists... it would be quarter the length.

3 hours ago, SOSU said:

Play oblige maps on ironman to experience Rogue-_like Doom 😉

 

You don't really a mode for that,just do handicap runs 😄

Oh I do. Nearly every day. I do cheat a bit with what I feel are unfair, early deaths like a sniper at the start point, then I just idclev my way to the next map and take my chances. Other than that, when I die once I tend to be done. That's the beauty of Oblige, I don't feel an obligation to go through all 32 levels.

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Posted (edited)

This would effect continuous playthroughs in a way like old NES games do (as well as older games in general that didn't have a save feature or passwords to pick back up). I think the original console PS1 version forced that on the player since it had passwords for the levels. 

 

I like how the original game forces a pistol start upon death. Pretty much every level of the original Doom and Doom 2 are designed in ways that they can be finished from a pistol start (Never tried this with Final Doom, tatsurdcacocaco finished Plutonia on UV with all pistol starts, so it has to be possible). 

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13 hours ago, Ex Oblivione said:

They should have Doom feature permadeath in the sense that once you die in the game (for whatever reason) you'll never be able to play the game again because you died. And they could mock you with this whenever you try to start a new game.

 

Uh, not related to Doom but try this.

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