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dobu gabu maru

My experience constructing the Tower of Hanoi (Boom)

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Awesome job Dobu! I love your work with puzzles and boom mechanics; it's a huge inspiration to see stuff like this come together. <3

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@dobu gabu maru I absolutely love these insane voodoo doll/switch/conveyor logic engines! Other than the spped issues you mentioned, do you think you've nailed the logic in each case? (I haven't checked it out yet).

 

I think I would have cheated, and make the switches into silent teleporters, and just teleported the player to a complete copy of the puzzle, pre-arranged for each combination, which would have been a very inelegant solution. Your solution is much more interesting!

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8 minutes ago, kb1 said:

Other than the spped issues you mentioned, do you think you've nailed the logic in each case? (I haven't checked it out yet).

 

I think the logic in each case is pretty solid—though deleting the tertiary system and implementing another door for Large White is like, a huge leap towards simplifying the redundancy I have in place with Problem #3. What's neat about this is that the methodology can be easily expanded upon if the player wanted to add more blocks—just add another secondary column for a new color for Problem #1, attach another door to it for Problem #3, and give every the secondary conveyors 2 linedefs for the new primary doors for Problem #2. Simple and easy to replicate—I might make a 5 block tower just to prove it can be done.

 

The silent teles are a clever way around trying to make the puzzle work mechanically, but in the map that I'm making it for, everything is in the same room—so it'd require me to copy & paste the map several times over, especially since each zone can hold 8 separate tower configurations. That kind of thing just isn't tenable beyond 3 blocks, so it's easier to just work out the puzzle mechanics.

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This is awesome, but further confirms a theory I've had about doom modders. This kind-of stuff is one of the few places that it makes far more sense to use WadC (or something similar) to handle the labour, because you can scale up logical constructions so easily. (I re-implemented fraggle's binary ripple counter in wadc as an example).

 

So the theory goes: no matter how much more sense it would make to script, the frontier of insane-doom-not-acs "scripting" will always be expanded by maniacs who do it all by hand in a traditional editor.

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You are insane dobu, and thats why i like you <3

Experiments and discoveries like this just makes the limitations seemingly vanish, and a very helpful wall of text you wrote there, should be a ton of use for any aspiring voodoo scripting wizard. This is so-awe inspiring i had to comment!

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10 hours ago, Jon said:

This is awesome, but further confirms a theory I've had about doom modders. This kind-of stuff is one of the few places that it makes far more sense to use WadC (or something similar) to handle the labour, because you can scale up logical constructions so easily.

 

I just want to clarify that me doing this wasn't just to simply prove that it could be done in Boom, but an exercise in puzzle solving for myself via the editor. I also have no experience with programming, and learn things best by working through it myself.

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Posted (edited)

I thought you were more mature than this Dobu.

 

Spoiler

heh

 

cc07b84f7568284847ecd7fc3161089b.png

 

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2 hours ago, dobu gabu maru said:

 

I just want to clarify that me doing this wasn't just to simply prove that it could be done in Boom, but an exercise in puzzle solving for myself via the editor. I also have no experience with programming, and learn things best by working through it myself.

Well, like it or not - this *is* programming. Maybe not in a traditional sense, but it has all the same elements: variables, logic, state management, and probably a few more I can't think of. Good stuff!

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^ Oh yeah I totally recognize that, I just mean in the sense that Jon was suggesting that WadC would be better suited to handling labor, which—while true—doesn't help me in my case since I don't even understand how to use WadC on a basic level.

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13 hours ago, dobu gabu maru said:

 

I just want to clarify that me doing this wasn't just to simply prove that it could be done in Boom, but an exercise in puzzle solving for myself via the editor. I also have no experience with programming, and learn things best by working through it myself.

 

I apologise for my tone. I don't want to detract from your awesome achievement. Not using WadC isn't a bad thing, you're in very good company :>

 

10 hours ago, kb1 said:

Well, like it or not - this *is* programming. Maybe not in a traditional sense, but it has all the same elements: variables, logic, state management, and probably a few more I can't think of. Good stuff!

 

True.

 

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wrt WadC vs manual cl9 stuff: I think sometimes it's more time-efficient to do something the inefficient/brute-force way than it is to sit down and work out the most efficient way.

 

WadC would be a great way of doing stuff like this if I could actually get my head around using it :/ All the stuff I've done with WadC in the past has been learning how to do one fairly simple thing and then basically spamming it.

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4 hours ago, Grain of Salt said:

wrt WadC vs manual cl9 stuff: I think sometimes it's more time-efficient to do something the inefficient/brute-force way than it is to sit down and work out the most efficient way.

 

WadC would be a great way of doing stuff like this if I could actually get my head around using it :/ All the stuff I've done with WadC in the past has been learning how to do one fairly simple thing and then basically spamming it.

 

I think something I've failed to really appreciate properly is how steep the learning curve is. I forget that I've been using it, on and off, for nearly 15 years, and even so, the map I started in 2006 I still haven't finished (although I did finish one real actual map in the mean time, and several tech demos. Still, not many!)

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9 hours ago, Jon said:

 

I think something I've failed to really appreciate properly is how steep the learning curve is. I forget that I've been using it, on and off, for nearly 15 years, and even so, the map I started in 2006 I still haven't finished (although I did finish one real actual map in the mean time, and several tech demos. Still, not many!)

I think it's a right-brain vs. left-brain thing. Mapping can be an artistic thing, but to get there in WadC, some thoughts on the geometry is required. I've been wondering how to bridge that gap, like with some automation, maybe. You have an awesome, powerful thing there, yet it's so far removed from drawing lines with the mouse - it's even difficult to describe. I am bummed that I haven't been able to devote serious time towards figuring it out. It's on the list, you know?

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