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Sergeant_Mark_IV

What improvements over Doom 2016 are you expecting?

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On 6/13/2018 at 7:54 PM, VertigoOne said:
  • Upgrades. Just ditch them. Ditch them entirely. I want my set of abilities to be consistent and pure, only to be expanded when I find some new gear over the linear course of the game. When I pick up a new weapon, I want the game to be balanced around the weapon as it is rather than how it might be. I want both alternative fire modes on the new weapons from the get go, and I want to be able to use them simultaneously without any mod switching, and I want to be able to combine alternative fire modes for more possibilities. There's three buttons on my mouse, and each one can be assigned to one fire mode. Hell, with tap/hold inputs you can even crank up the possible attack input methods with the mouse to five, even more if you combine hold inputs on one button and tap inputs on the other.

 

 

Dude

 

 

Not everyone plays via mouse, and all four triggers are taken up on controllers

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11 hours ago, Rifle Infantry said:

But that's the exact job description of a Hell Razer.

 

Hitscan enemies are not at all incompatible with push-forward fighting, with low damage/health (just like classic zombies) they can be quite interesting and fun enemies.

Hell Razers are inaccurate and have a low rate of fire, they don't shoot at you but everywhere around you in a predictable way (he even turns a laser light to show you when and where he's going to shoot), not a true hitscanner. But yeah they could introduce hitscanners with low damage and accuracy, although better than the possessed I still think they would either be useless or interrupt the flow because when you are really low (and no health packs around), you can't risk coming close, you have to hide. New Doom encourages fighting over hiding even when low on hp.

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9 hours ago, Der Oberscuetze said:

I want Doom II's chaingunners back. Those guys were amazing to fight. Maybe if it's only as minibosses at some point, just give my chaingun wielding, red armor UAC commandos

 

I am pretty confident we will see the classic zombie bads in Doom Eternal.  Story wise the game can't really use possessed SEC and Scientists unless we go to UAC Headquarters or travel off planet to a moon base.

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Make the bossfights less of a blank arena level with a cutscene that commences the fight, make it more like an actual level where you have to FIND the boss, kind of like the Cyberdemon boss fight in the original doom. Hearing the 'ka-thunk-ka-thunk-ka-thunk' of it walking around scared the crap out of me as a kid. If the new Doom had something like this it would be awesome. Rather than just throwing you in a blank room/arena going 'Ok here's the boss. Bye.'

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16 hours ago, Der Oberscuetze said:

Not everyone plays via mouse, and all four triggers are taken up on controllers

That's true, it would screw console compatibility.

I actually liked the weapons mods, they added more variety to the arsenal.

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On 7/5/2018 at 12:30 AM, D88M said:

-Redundant, but not so much rely on jumping and vertical level design

But Doom was all about vertical level design, even despite being built on a 2D grid.

Look at Downtown, for example, it's built almost entirely around the vertical.

And the only level in Doom (2016) that was really vertical was the Argent Tower, everything else was relatively flat.

Foundry was a good mix of flat and tall, so you don't want anything else like that?

I don't think I'm understanding you here.

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Yeah I actually enjoyed the jumping/verticallity and plaforming in the new Doom. I'd like to see more Foundry-style maps (like a ton of others here) but bigger and better, real key hunts, maybe some more elevator lifts and a few maps of good switch puzzles. And NO MORE LOCKDOWNS PLEEAASSEE

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9 hours ago, Aquila Chrysaetos said:

But Doom was all about vertical level design, even despite being built on a 2D grid.

Look at Downtown, for example, it's built almost entirely around the vertical.

And the only level in Doom (2016) that was really vertical was the Argent Tower, everything else was relatively flat.

Foundry was a good mix of flat and tall, so you don't want anything else like that?

I don't think I'm understanding you here.

Okay, maybe the phrase should be "not so much platforming", when i think of it actually i am thinking specifically about that part in hell where you have abyss under you, you have to jump between rock pillars, and some damn Lost Souls come rushing at you with that tension inducing scream and consequent explosion, i remember being irritated by that, i think is past half the game. Maybe i am remembering worse than it was, movement itself in the game was very nicely done.

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22 hours ago, MrDeAD1313 said:

more Foundry-style

I think this is a wide desire across many fans. most cited level for preferable layout design.

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A'ight, here's my Doom: Eternal Wishlist.

 

  • SP Co-Op: My most wanted feature. My wife & I love playing co-op shooters together and as such we squeezed more fun out of Snapmap than I think most others did but we still really, really wanted the ability to blast through the campaign levels together. Want this bad enough I'll gladly fork out for two copies on launch, which I almost never do due to us having to budget for a family.
  • Difficulty: While it seems people more used to modern shooters didn't have an issue with this, I kinda found Doom '16 to be a tad on the easy side. Ironically, I felt Nightmare was a bit unbalanced even if it was closer to what I expected from UV. I hope D:E is tougher (While being a bit more balanced than '16 on Nightmare) and that UV is unlocked from the gate.
  • Some set-pieces: I don't want tons of these, since admittedly part of what made Doom '16 so special is how... pure it was. And I wouldn't want any that take control from the player. But I'd like to see a few levels who have some form of light-scripting that change the dynamic of the level a bit. 
  • More Hell, and more Twisted: Simple enough. I want to see more hell, and I want it to be more fucked up than it was before. Mess with the player! In fact Hell is probably the best place for the aforementioned rare set pieces. Add some mindfuckery. :D Similarly, since in the lore it is revealed that Hell's M.O. is consuming alien worlds it comes in contact with and we've already seen the corrupted Argent D'nur, why not show us some other alien worlds that have been consumed by hell? 
  • Demon weapons: I'm pretty sure we're getting at least one of these in the form of the Crucible but I'd love to see one or two more as well. They could really have fun with the idea of a Demon Weapon. Hell, maybe they'll even bring back the Unmaker.
  • Full Level Editor: I know this is suuuuper unlikely due to the way IDTech 6 works but a woman can dream. Besides, despite its limitations the customgeo in Snapmap proved that it isn't impossible.
  • Unique secret levels: I was kinda sad that the closest we got to secret levels in '16 were the classic maps (Which TBH didn't play great with the modern style.) and would love to see some unique secret levels in Eternal. On that note...
  • Unmarked secrets/pushwalls: I disliked how easy it was to find '16's secrets and I'd like to see some unmarked secrets in the form of pushwalls returning. Just a classic feature I'd like to see.

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22 hours ago, dewmguy said:

id tech 7 babyyyyy

I'm hoping this enables more enemies on screen at a time which is supposedly why they went to the lockdowns in the first place if I remember correctly. If they really ramp up the power of the engine and include this, I really think this will be closer to Doom than '16 was. Again, it wasn't a bad game at all. It just wasn't 'Doom' enough for my tastes. Just my 2 cents :)

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The enemies in the original games were extremely simple - they just walk towards you and attack when they see you. That's why you can have a horde of dozens or hundreds of monsters. DOOM4 is infinitely more advanced in that regard. Each enemy has tons of animations, movement patterns and attacks. There are multiple variations of every actions. That gives enemies more personality but also means you cannot have an insane amount of them. Even in DOOM4 they had to limit the amount of 'active' enemies because otherwise it'd be blatanly unfair and unfun with the new AI and modern animations. And honestly I don't see how anyone can have a problem with the number of enemies in DOOM4, considering how hectic the combat is in this game. Having more enemies at the time would mean making them much, much dumber and primitive.

 

On the subject of improvements, I'd like to see better gore. In DOOM4, aside from executions, gore and dismemberment was not particularly good. Imps and Zombies just fall apart like dolls. And an option to make corpses stay longer. You can't really 'appreciate' the carnage if everything just disappears before your eyes. Some of us are not playing on consoles, you know? We have enough horse power to handle it.

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It's not the number of enemies I guess, it's the lockdowns that I disliked. I'm not looking for slaughter map style gameplay because I don't really care for that either. I just wish there was a way to do away with the lockdowns is all. It's definitely hectic and very fun, just wasn't a fan of lockdowns is all I mean to say

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moar demons! like the arachnotron, archvile, pain elemental and mabie some more original ones :3 and mabie a more doom 1/2 like desighn for the cyberdemon and spider mastermind

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On 7/5/2018 at 1:30 AM, D88M said:

-No linear levels with arenas, or at least not be the only kind of level, more open levels with exploration and rewards for exploring, and secrets.

-Varied and colorful level design, you know, mazes and shit.

-Gore, blood, corpses and Satanic images everywhere, more hellish design into everything and not some random generic futuristic alien fsp style of levels and enemies.

-Redundant, but enemies that actually look like demons would be nice, give us fucked up shit.

-No weapon upgrades, make them cool right from the start.

-No Runes that you can only use two at the time or whatever.

-No taking you out of the level while you are playing it with some excuse like the Rune trials or classic Doom levels, it just kills the mood/flow.

-Bassicaly nothing where you have to pause the game to do it like the examples above it, except maybe the weapon wheel.

-More atmospheric, put some horror ambient and music once in a while, put some dark places with suspense, no just non-stop action.

-No glory kills at the front of the gameplay, the idea was well executed in D16 though, and no magic items popping out of enemies giving you health and ammo (????) What i mean is keep it, but dont make it as essential.

-Staying corpses.

-No "wait until the story scene is over to move or use weapons" modern mainstream games bullshit.

-No GOD DAMNED enemies with shields or enemies that just stop the fun of the game dead on its tracks.

-Platforming at minimum please, this is not an adventure game, is an action game.

-Redundant, but not so much rely on jumping and vertical level design.

-Gameplay based on improvised yet tactical and strategic movements and gun fighting, no "throw yourself into battle without thinking, the more reckless you are the more chances of winning you have" style of gameplay, this is exactly the opposite of what the original Dooms were.

-Way less influence of Doom 3, Brutal Doom, and the Doom comic book in every aspect of the game. Play the old games and see why they are still good, dont just try to copy what you think it is on the surface.

-Less repetitive gameplay (the level design helps A LOT in this matter) with actual replay value once i finish the game.

 

I think that covers it all so far, i will edit it if i come out with something else.

Why don't you add this:

 

-No human interaction, let the game only be about shooting everything in sight

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On 7/7/2018 at 2:54 PM, curtiscat2001 said:

moar demons! like the arachnotron, archvile, pain elemental and mabie some more original ones :3 and mabie a more doom 1/2 like desighn for the cyberdemon and spider mastermind

 

Well, you'll be happy to know that they've already confirmed the Arachnotron, Archvile, and Pain Elemental lol. Don't know if they're re-re-designing the Cybie & Mastermind, not sure if they're even going to have them since they were treated as bosses in '16. Guess we'll see.

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Gameplay similar to e4m1 would be bad as to see at some point or place.

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On 7/7/2018 at 4:13 PM, MsKaye said:

 

  • More Hell, and more Twisted: Simple enough. I want to see more hell, and I want it to be more fucked up than it was before. Mess with the player! In fact Hell is probably the best place for the aforementioned rare set pieces. Add some mindfuckery. :D Similarly, since in the lore it is revealed that Hell's M.O. is consuming alien worlds it comes in contact with and we've already seen the corrupted Argent D'nur, why not show us some other alien worlds that have been consumed by hell? 

I agree, more Hell and more hellish Hell. Like have more mutilated corpses, blood dripping hanging bodies, impaled victims still twitching and grunting in pain, not just bones and skeletons (don't know if this is too much or if they are allowed to do stuff like this). More variety in Hell environments, like a dead cold green/gray level from new Doom rune trial levels.

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@Hofmann I would say they can make it rather disturbing if they wanted to. The latest Mortal Kombat got by with edgy gore.

 

It's actually good fuel for Doom Slayer to maintain his anger, ever so motivated to rip and tear as he is constantly surrounded by the victims of the entities he hates all so much.

 

What the player sees as disturbing, the Doom Slayer is very familiar with and will give no mercy.

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Thats an interesting thought/conversation. I think it comes down to the artistic direction mentally between Hugo and Adrian carmack. If you look at Hugo's portfolio you can see everything is playfull to an extent, and as him being the art director thats going to have an impact on the rest of the game. It's definetly a different tone than Adrian's morbid, and what seems to be more anger and morbid driven art style. They have similarities, but there are many little differences in the nuances atmospherically.

 

I like Hugo's art feel, but agree there could be a bit more veriety in hell levels. Some people complained about the hell levels aesthetically, But I liked them, it was this weird mesh of a classical hell, kinda reminded me of good fantasy oil paintings. I don't think they should focus on being edgy, but they should definetly keep it interesting. something to aesthetically seperate the levels more.

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The DLC multiplayer Hell levels though I think have some of the best art direction for Hell in the entire series. Boneyard in particular is fucking awesome.

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On 7/10/2018 at 5:12 AM, Hofmann said:

I agree, more Hell and more hellish Hell. Like have more mutilated corpses, blood dripping hanging bodies, impaled victims still twitching and grunting in pain, not just bones and skeletons (don't know if this is too much or if they are allowed to do stuff like this). More variety in Hell environments, like a dead cold green/gray level from new Doom rune trial levels.

I do agree to a point, though ramping up the gore isn't really the main thing I want. That should be a part of it, but I also want to just see more madness and surreality. I'd prefer Hell to sort of be this really, really unknowable thing that messes with the player and shows them stuff beyond their imagination.

 

I feel like they should just look to the paintings of the man they already claimed inspired their hell, Beksiński. He was apparently the primary influence on their vision of Hell, and I certainly can see his influence there but I feel like they should of ran with his influence more. Some of the images he created are just so delightfully nightmarish & surreal... and it does at least appear he's still having an influence, while not one of his more notable paintings it's hard not to see this painting when looking at the dissolving buildings in Eternal's trailer. Here's a good collection of his paintings, give them a look.

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On 7/5/2018 at 1:33 PM, Zemini said:

 

I am pretty confident we will see the classic zombie bads in Doom Eternal.  Story wise the game can't really use possessed SEC and Scientists unless we go to UAC Headquarters or travel off planet to a moon base.

In their place, we'll see possessed citizens and police officers.

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6 minutes ago, ATP2555 said:

In their place, we'll see possessed citizens and police officers.

I'd rather expect possessed military staff. Much more dangerous than cops. In addition possessed cops would remind many people of DNF.

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Upgrades for the SSG would be nice, alongside another weapon.

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Posted (edited)

Serious Sam is the only game you'll see anything even close to that for a fps, and their ai is dead simple. We'll never see that in doom.

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12 hours ago, MsKaye said:

I do agree to a point, though ramping up the gore isn't really the main thing I want. That should be a part of it, but I also want to just see more madness and surreality. I'd prefer Hell to sort of be this really, really unknowable thing that messes with the player and shows them stuff beyond their imagination.

 

I feel like they should just look to the paintings of the man they already claimed inspired their hell, Beksiński. He was apparently the primary influence on their vision of Hell, and I certainly can see his influence there but I feel like they should of ran with his influence more. Some of the images he created are just so delightfully nightmarish & surreal... and it does at least appear he's still having an influence, while not one of his more notable paintings it's hard not to see this painting when looking at the dissolving buildings in Eternal's trailer. Here's a good collection of his paintings, give them a look.

 

Wayne Barlowe is someone else whose art style they should lean hard into.

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On 7/5/2018 at 5:45 PM, Grimosaur said:

Make the bossfights less of a blank arena level with a cutscene that commences the fight, make it more like an actual level where you have to FIND the boss, kind of like the Cyberdemon boss fight in the original doom. Hearing the 'ka-thunk-ka-thunk-ka-thunk' of it walking around scared the crap out of me as a kid. If the new Doom had something like this it would be awesome. Rather than just throwing you in a blank room/arena going 'Ok here's the boss. Bye.'

 

On 7/7/2018 at 10:13 AM, MsKaye said:

Some set-pieces: I don't want tons of these, since admittedly part of what made Doom '16 so special is how... pure it was. And I wouldn't want any that take control from the player. But I'd like to see a few levels who have some form of light-scripting that change the dynamic of the level a bit. 

 

That gives me an idea:
If Doom Eternal is going to have setpieces, why not center them around boss fights to give them more of a dynamic challenge both in terms of visuals and gameplay?

For example, imagine fighting some sort of demon lord in a dilapidated metropolis. As the fight gets more and more intense, buildings start to collapse, the ground starts to split open revealing rivers of lava, and the sky starts to redden even further. By the time the boss fight is nearly over, everything is a smoldering wreck and now you have to be more careful with your platforming skills, as one misstep could leave you careening to your death.

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