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Duke of Pathoris

Enemies you don't want to return

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14 hours ago, dsm said:

I always thought the Wraith would be a lot better if it had a more subtle phase effect (and not as loud) and if it would actually try to flank the Player instead of running in a straight, predictable line.

I agree, and if included into Doom Eternal I would like to see it teleport flank but with the Summoner effect so it can be tracked. I would imagine it a poor experience if you just see it vanish and you take random hits.

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On 7/22/2018 at 10:03 AM, chemo said:

I like the Summoners because they are very credible threats without being downright frustrating.

I agree. Summoners are much more enjoyable to fight than Doom II Archviles. Eternal might handle them better.

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17 hours ago, Chezza said:

I agree, and if included into Doom Eternal I would like to see it teleport flank but with the Summoner effect so it can be tracked. I would imagine it a poor experience if you just see it vanish and you take random hits.

The idea I had years ago for an improved Wraith was that it could not maintain its invisibility if it got close to you, so it would phase back into reality just before meleeing you.

I had the idea that whenever it phases, you hear a low, ghostly sound that'd sound a bit like thousands of people screaming in terror and agony far away (to signify that the Wraith phases between Hell and the Mars/Earth reality); the sound would start louder, then fade out when the wraith phases into invisibility and when it phases back into visibility, the sound fades in.

That would make it a really creepy sound that would make you go "oh shit!" if you hear it right next to you and it'd make you spin around frantically trying to locate the Wraith before it lashes out at you.

 

Your idea would work better for a game like Doom Eternal though, since my idea was built more with Doom 3 and its horror atmosphere in mind. Wouldn't work so well with loud, angry music playing during combat and it would probably be more annoying with the kind of intense combat like Doom 2016's.

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On 7/21/2018 at 11:34 PM, Quasar said:

Personally I wouldn't mind if a few Doom 3 enemies came back in new forms, but one the more I think about was just pointless was the wraith. His teleport was so badly designed that it makes getting hit by one just shameful in most circumstances given you can just cheese them with a point blank shotgun blast before they can even regain movement.

 

Considering how monsters spawned in, the same could pretty much be said of pretty much any lower-tier monster that spawned in. Seriously, every time an Imp or Maggot spawned in, you can just instagib them with a point-blank shotgun range while they're stuck in their roaring animation.

That being said, the Wraith gets extra dumb points for not only using that spawning system as an offense mechanic, they don't even teleport. They just phase into a state of invisibility while still being "there" physically, meaning it's actually possible to nail them while they're "incorporeal."

It's likely that if some of the Doom 3 cast does make a return, I'm sure they'll be able to incorporate a unique offensive mechanic for each monster.

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On 6/22/2018 at 12:24 PM, Agent6 said:

Maybe the Summoner, considering the Arch-Vile is making a comeback I don't know how they'll manage to use both of them effectively.

It would be pretty sweet if there was a quick introduction cutscene of Archie ripping off a Summoners head or something. I'm really interested in how id will pull off the Arch-Vile because he is one of my favs.

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7 hours ago, Enforcer said:

It would be pretty sweet if there was a quick introduction cutscene of Archie ripping off a Summoners head or something. I'm really interested in how id will pull off the Arch-Vile because he is one of my favs.

I think a better introduction scene would be the end of an intense battle against a Baron when he comes and resurrects the Baron.

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Keep both summoner and arch-vile. Will be very good for mappers to create pressure on the player.

 

Edit : Please no icon of sin, the worst monster in the entire series.

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It’s likely that the Arch-Vile will be an out-and-out replacement for the Summoner, namely because we have disappearing corpses again (and this time, some bodies actually fade away before they even hit the ground).

However, it’s interesting to note that gibs tend to stay around a little longer this time. 

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1 minute ago, Man of Doom said:

It’s likely that the Arch-Vile will be an out-and-out replacement for the Summoner, namely because we have disappearing corpses again (and this time, some bodies actually fade away before they even hit the ground).

However, it’s interesting to note that gibs tend to stay around a little longer this time. 

They said they would double the demon types, so maybe this is part of what they are talking about. Also, looks like the Archie will be a boss monster.

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2 minutes ago, Duke of Pathoris said:

They said they would double the demon types, so maybe this is part of what they are talking about. Also, looks like the Archie will be a boss monster.

That's the sort of thing I'm worried about when they say that. Take for example the zombieman, they've shown both a version in light armor and one wearing a heavy jetpack vest, both of which appear to have very similar AI (the only time the jet trooper uses his is to vault up to a new surface). If that's what they're calling doubled demon variety then we'll end up with a roster very similar in appreciable variety to Doom 2016.

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The summoner and arch-vile don't have to compete with each other for a slot in the bestiary. The only thing they share is being the dark mage type demon (unless we are comparing the summoner to the SHITTY arch-vile wannabe super imp in doom 3). Having a high threat flying monster is just very versatile to throw away from the game for no reason. Also while at it give it a better name than the summoner, the most boring name in the entire freaking game -that's an achievement when it has to compete with imps and zombies for bad names-. 

 

Now for a monster they hopefully should never bring back.. The fucking trites. Extremely high damage, Tiny, Fits through spaces even smaller than them, can jump 10 meters forward, hides on ceilings, STUNLOCKS + DISORIENTS YOU SOMEHOW ON HIT.. Please no.

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Since the Hellknight in Doom Eternal and Doom 2016 is obviously heavily inspired by the Doom 3 version, I won't discount the possibility of them revising any enemy from Doom 3. 

 

With that being said, I could do without the Ticks and Trites. They're much more in line with the disturbing horror aspect of Doom 3 that isn't really the aim of the modern installments. Same with the Cherubs. I diverge from what seems to be the popular opinion here in that I don't mind them in Doom 3, but again, they are more of a horror game enemy, and don't fit in here. I could also do without the Summoner. Not because I disliked it, but the Arch-Vile takes that role very well, and is a cooler enemy, imo. The Arch also doesn't do those annoying teleport maneuvers, unless they've added that in this game (please no.)

 

I'm glad that they're doing more of a Classic Doom/Doom 3 approach with the possessed soldiers. Marty and Hugo mentioned in a panel that they have their own language they use to communicate with each other, which is very reminiscent of the Z-Sec chatter in Doom 3. The possessed in Doom 2016 were way too stupid and brutelike, didn't really do any evasive maneuvers or tactical moves in general, which was a departure from the tactical intelligence of the Z-Secs, who would duck and roll, take cover behind objects, etc. So hopefully, they pursue that avenue even more with these guys.

 

I could see potential in reviving the Chaingun Commandos, but that raises the complication of them being hitscan enemies, which presents complications in the current incarnation of Doom gameplay. If they were used sparingly and in specific places I could see it working, however. 

 

I could also see potential in reviving the Maggots and Vulgars from Doom 3/ROE. They both have a design and movement pattern that holds potential for a lot of speed and unpredictability. Same with the Wraiths.

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20 hours ago, Glaice said:

Just the normal zombies with holes in their heads.

Too late, they're everywhere in the gameplay trailer. Just that now they have pentagram forehead tattoos and are much more "intact" (naked, but no melted body parts/hole heads).

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12 minutes ago, Rifle Infantry said:

Too late, they're everywhere in the gameplay trailer. Just that now they have pentagram forehead tattoos and are much more "intact" (naked, but no melted body parts/hole heads).


That I can live with, they looked featureless in '16 and dull, outside the variants like the engineer variant.

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I also want the possessed to have more variety this time. They're literally the shells of former humans, they should have some variety in that sense. I've only seen a few variants in DE so far, but Doom 2016 had 2 scientist/worker types, the engineer, the soldiers, the hell version, and that was it. It's not like you need the same type of versatility D3 had with it's zombie cast, but at least portray these guys with *some* variety in physical appearance, especially the soldier types.

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Honestly, I could do without the lost souls. All iterations of them in all games look cool, but I just hate fighting them. It's also why I really hated fighting pain elementals in classic Doom, since they were always spawning them.

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13 hours ago, S_Stryker said:

Honestly, I could do without the lost souls. All iterations of them in all games look cool, but I just hate fighting them. It's also why I really hated fighting pain elementals in classic Doom, since they were always spawning them.

Doom 3 had the worst, then classic doom. 2016 actually did a pretty good job of them.

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10 hours ago, Duke of Pathoris said:

Doom 3 had the worst, then classic doom. 2016 actually did a pretty good job of them.

I didn't like how they just explode when they hit you. You should have to shoot them to kill them like all the other enemies.

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On 8/30/2018 at 8:57 AM, DestroyerNori13 said:

I didn't like how they just explode when they hit you. You should have to shoot them to kill them like all the other enemies.

 

If they were weaker like in Doom 64 they'd be tolerable imo, but the original Lost Souls are just frustrating and unfun no matter how you deal with them since they're so tough.

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9 minutes ago, KVELLER said:

I really must be in the minority of people that don't mind Lost Souls in the slightest.

I like them as well. It will be nice, if iD make their combat AI ramming rather than homing. Just like pinkies, but with less health, without frontal armor and better visual appearance.

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26 minutes ago, KVELLER said:

I really must be in the minority of people that don't mind Lost Souls in the slightest.

 

Yea most of the time I just find them as infight fodder rather than something I'd bother shooting. Only exception is on nightmare where they are murder machines. 

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43 minutes ago, Boilers! said:

I like them as well. 

Agree. They add some diversity to the enemy types.

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