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Touchdown

DOOM Eternal Gameplay Reveal Impressions

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On 8/12/2018 at 5:50 PM, DoomMan777 said:

So, Doom Slayer became so Badass because his Previous Incarnation was Mistaken by Fans to be The Badass Incarnate, which was not the Actual Main Point of the Character? Neat.

This text hurts my eyes and my feelings.

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23 hours ago, elarmadillo3 said:

This text hurts my eyes and my feelings.

Where am I wrong?

 

Doom Guy is meant to be a Survivor, Someone who overcomes the Colossal Odds stacked up against him.

 

Doom Slayer is meant to be an Unstoppable Force of Nature, he IS the Colossal Odds against them, Demons, who cannot overcome them/him.

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17 minutes ago, DoomMan777 said:

Where am I wrong?

 

Doom Guy is meant to be a Survivor, Someone who overcomes the Colossal Odds stacked up against him.

 

Doom Slayer is meant to be an Unstoppable Force of Nature, he IS the Colossal Odds against them, Demons, who cannot overcome them/him.

You don't have to capitalize so many words.

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Literally my only complaint right now is the tone. I keep recalling PSX/N64 Doom, Doom 3, and the scrapped concept art from Doom '16. Along with some of the elements of the classics, the franchise has repeatedly shown itself to be compatible with horror elements. 

 

"Doom Eternal" eschews the creeping, explicit horror of Ridley Scott ("Alien") and favors the action-oriented spectacle of James Cameron ("Aliens,") who uses horror more for aesthetic than for tapping into a primal emotion. It's important to have humor in a Doom game, but it's gotten a bit too silly lately.

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^ Yeah, I agree. But since Eternal doesn't seem to add many horror elements either I suppose this is just how the tone should be in their vision, and I'll accept that.

 

After all, if we want something more horror oriented there's always going to be PSX Doom, Doom 3, and of course Doom 64, on top of various megawads and mods.

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2 hours ago, igg said:

I still believe Satan himself uses Hayden as dark priest to rise his hellish empire. He does so against other powers in hell. Maybe we're witnessing the transformation of hell from an empire of chaos (after the titans age) to a kingdom of Satan.

Hoping we won't get a boss fight with Samuel.

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9 minutes ago, MTF Sergeant said:

Hoping we won't get a boss fight with Samuel.

 

Kinda doubt that. After all, in the gameplay reveal Doomguy has the Crucible, so perhaps at that point the confrontation or something with Hayden already took place.

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Sadly, it seems the cartoonish visual aesthetic and goofy tone of the game is a deliberate design choice on part of the team. 

 

Hugo Martin:

 

"...the goal is that it looks like a AAA version of the 1993 Doom. That’s what I’m so proud of with that footage. If you were to modernise Doom in a AAA game from 1993, that’s what it would look like.

 

There are a lot of little things that we do to pull that off. I know some fans who love certain aspects of Doom 3, and totally, I do too. This is a cartoon. This is supposed to be fun. That’s what Doom was in 1993, so we take a lot of the dark shadows out of the world. We bring up the fill light. It kind of flattens the world a little bit, but it creates all of this visual detail and it does give it this cartoonish effect, which ultimately kind of balances out the ridiculous amount of violence in the game.

 

The gore is handled in a cartoonish way, which is totally consistent with the original Doom games. And if it wasn’t done that way, you’re blowing off all of this flesh on this guy’s arm and he’s coming at you. We’ve had internal devs comment: “How is this guy still standing? He just has a femur on his leg holding him up.” It’s just a cartoon…"

 

https://www.trustedreviews.com/news/gaming/doom-eternal-id-softwares-evil-dead-ii-3528907#Y3AwRTLq3Al5VB2x.99

 

Sigh. Growing up, I never thought of Doom as just a cartoon. To me it was a more serious gaming experience, a game about survival and overcoming overwhelming odds. Nonetheless, I still enjoyed Doom 2016 and will still probably enjoy Doom Eternal, but it just isn't my vision of what Doom is.

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Just now, Agent6 said:

 

Kinda doubt that. After all, in the gameplay reveal Doomguy has the Crucible, so perhaps at that point the confrontation or something with Hayden already took place.

After all, he teleported the Slayer to an "unknown location" at the end of D16.

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14 minutes ago, MTF Sergeant said:

After all, he teleported the Slayer to an "unknown location" at the end of D16.

 

Yes. What do you want to say?

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2 minutes ago, Agent6 said:

 

Yes. What do you want to say?

About Hayden. For what reason would he go fight Doomslayer in Eternal? Just because he got all Argent Energy out of the facility or something?

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22 minutes ago, doom_is_great said:

Sigh. Growing up, I never thought of Doom as just a cartoon. To me it was a more serious gaming experience, a game about survival and overcoming overwhelming odds. Nonetheless, I still enjoyed Doom 2016 and will still probably enjoy Doom Eternal, but it just isn't my vision of what Doom is.

#NotMyDoom

Doom was a serious gaming experience for me when I started playing, it wasn't cartoonish. It has its weirdo funny moments, but it's fairly serious. Brutal Doom is cartoonish. I can't speak to Project Brutality, but I suspect it probably is, as well.

Doom 2016 is enjoyable, but not like classic is. I still go back to classic to play some of my favorite maps, like Pandemonium, The Living End, and Impossible Mission, because they're just that much fun for me.

Am I going to get Doom Eternal? Probably. Will I like it? Remains to be seen. My expectations for Eternal are higher now, but it's unlikely to ever be my favorite.

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53 minutes ago, Agent6 said:

 

Kinda doubt that. After all, in the gameplay reveal Doomguy has the Crucible, so perhaps at that point the confrontation or something with Hayden already took place.

No. When asked about that (I think it was Matt) said the weapon shown in the gameplay trailer is 'a Crucible', not 'the Crucible'.

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Same, Doom was a serious game with tongue in cheek humour for me, and still is. However I accept that times are different now and id has its own, different vision.

 

And I very much enjoy having different games with very different takes and tones. I wouldn't have liked to like in a world where the Doom games were done strictly in the style of the classics, PSX Doom, or Doom 64. It's best to enjoy them for what they are.

 

31 minutes ago, MTF Sergeant said:

About Hayden. For what reason would he go fight Doomslayer in Eternal? Just because he got all Argent Energy out of the facility or something?

 

No idea, we'll have to see that for ourselves when the time comes, that was just my assumption. Though, now that I think about it, considering there's an invasion going on it would probably be a dumb idea for Hayden to oppose Doomguy.

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53 minutes ago, Aquila Chrysaetos said:

#NotMyDoom

Doom was a serious gaming experience for me when I started playing, it wasn't cartoonish. It has its weirdo funny moments, but it's fairly serious. Brutal Doom is cartoonish. I can't speak to Project Brutality, but I suspect it probably is, as well.

Doom 2016 is enjoyable, but not like classic is. I still go back to classic to play some of my favorite maps, like Pandemonium, The Living End, and Impossible Mission, because they're just that much fun for me.

Am I going to get Doom Eternal? Probably. Will I like it? Remains to be seen. My expectations for Eternal are higher now, but it's unlikely to ever be my favorite.

My sentiments exactly. It's like no one remembers playing maps like Halls of the Damned or The Waste Tunnels. Those maps were dark, shadowy, had creepy music and a foreboding atmosphere. No, all anyone remembers is bright, flashy colors, lots of lighting, and heavy metal.

 

Brutal Doom can provide a more serious gaming experience if done right. Some of my favorite custom Doom experiences included Brutal Doom J by Johnny combined with Knee Deep in Zdoom and the Doomambience pack. One of the best Doom experiences ever for me.  

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I feel like id has intentionally put aside the horror elements and I really don't know why that is. Maybe for the modern team, they don't resonate with those sobering, quieter, darker moments of exploration, or that feeling of disempowered, where the situation feels hopeless, rather than simply challenging. That's a very morose mood that I suppose gets in the way of the fun, but for me it made the Doom experience far deeper and more engaging, because it was the perfect blend of horror and action.

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It's strange because the gameplay trailer for Doom 2016, while agressive AF, was a bit darker than the actual game I think, and it does end with the player getting ripped in half by a baron in a rather gruesome fashion, with some suspenseful music in the background. And what about the E3 teaser for Doom Eternal? It was pretty moody.

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53 minutes ago, GoatLord said:

I feel like id has intentionally put aside the horror elements and I really don't know why that is. Maybe for the modern team, they don't resonate with those sobering, quieter, darker moments of exploration, or that feeling of disempowered, where the situation feels hopeless, rather than simply challenging. That's a very morose mood that I suppose gets in the way of the fun, but for me it made the Doom experience far deeper and more engaging, because it was the perfect blend of horror and action.

 

Because there are plenty of super serious horror sci-fi games out there. Alien: Isolation, SOMA, Dead Space, System Shock, Prey. I could go on.

 

Besides, Doom was serious when it came out because the graphics were super realistic for the time. But as people kept playing it, they realized just how cartoony and silly it really is. Even more, it was modeled after goofy 80s heavy metal (which is a good thing). You also see this in modding trends besides Brutal Doom. A lot of really good WADs use upbeat and sometimes silly music. Of course, there are plenty of serious maps too. I've made a few of those for example. So even if the game was genuinely scary when it came out, the perception drastically changed and this was way before Brutal Doom. 

 

To be fair, I also love Doom's more serious tone and even 2016 has plenty of such moments and yes, even classic Doom had serious moments but I think the musical choices had a lot to do with that. For every four tracks like E1M1 or E1M4, there needs to be the occasional E2M4. Doom 3 and Doom 64 are still amazing Doom experiences, they just chose to amplify other aspects of Doom, just like 2016 made its own choices.  For every action-packed combat area, there need to be areas where you can just wander around the level. I think that balance is actually very important. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Agent6 said:

 

Kinda doubt that. After all, in the gameplay reveal Doomguy has the Crucible, so perhaps at that point the confrontation or something with Hayden already took place.

Hugo Martin said it wasn't The Crucible in the gameplay at the end. It was a crucible but not the crucible, so that means there's more than one.

 

Meaning...sword battle with Samuel! ...Probably

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5 minutes ago, Shanoa said:

Hugo Martin said it wasn't The Crucible in the gameplay at the end.

 

Yeah, I missed that part, oops.

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2 hours ago, Eligos said:

This whole tone argument seems a bit ridiculous. Doom is so ambiguous when it comes to its content you can essentially glean whatever you want from it, especially if you played it when you were a kid. You can essentially make an argument for the game being both serious and silly at the same time.

 

For instance, you can acquire a chainsaw on Mars, when you acquire said chainsaw it says "A Chainsaw! Find some meat!" and in Doom 2 you're avenging the death of your dead rabbit. As you defeat hordes of demons with a heavy metal soundtrack blazing in your ears, also the fact the game has a weapon called the Big Fucking Gun 9000. With a descriptor like that, you can imagine why some people perceive Doom as being "cartoony."

 

As for the opposite argument. You're the last surviving Marine on the base, you see dead bodies scattered throughout the levels, you hear groaning sounds from monsters and former humans echoing throughout the hallways. As you become more hurt and wounded the face at the bottom of your screen becomes more bloodied and beaten, as you listen to haunting songs such as Suspense and Waltz of the Demons adding to the overall atmosphere of the game, making it come across as you being lost and alone on a base far away from Earth against impossible odds.

 

These arguments may vary depending on which Doom you played first, but I think a lot of people are contributing to tone that can be easily explained by throwing themes and ideas at the wall and seeing what sticks. Let me make one thing perfectly clear I am not saying Romero or Carmack or anyone on the original id team are idiots by no means. What I am saying is they were a bunch of early 20-year-olds Who Loved horror movies like Evil Dead 2 and Aliens and loved to play D&D and wanted to make a game that Amalgamated all of that together and that was Doom. And what came out of it was mixed results depending on the person.

 

One person perceives Doom as being somewhat serious with some cheese thrown in. Another person sees a horror game with heavy emphasis on atmosphere and tone. But others perceived Doom as a heavy metal inspired action game with you running through levels destroying demons and being the badass Marine surviving Hells Onslaught on the world.

 

(And I guess that's all I have to say on this topic. My apologies for the wall of text)

This.

 

I mentioned sonewhere Doom was a mix of ideas that ended up working well together. Eligos explained it well.

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The only time I ever felt disempowered during Doom was when I first played it (not counting thy flesh consumed, which was pretty silly by the way).

 

I challenge anyone to actually play through Doom E1 through E3 and tell me that they, as a player, felt scared, hopeless, and disempowered.

 

Even the so called "scary" Doom titles are just classic Doom gameplay with a darker theme on it. Doom 3 tried to be a survival horror game with 8 guns.

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18 minutes ago, Averagewalrus23.9 said:

I noticed that there was a distinct lack of hell razers, I liked their design in DOOM 2016 but they were easy to avoid, I'm hoping that we'll see them again but tweaked to make them more formidable. Also I'm questioning their decision of "spoiling" two of the bosses (showing concept art for them) both of which are new.

 

In one of the interviews, one of Marty or Hugo made it sound like basically everything in the game has been tweaked or redesigned in some fashion. My guess is that the Hell Razer is gone and now it will be the guy on the left of the image here.

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Doom always seemed like a silly, over-the-top but inherently fun game to me. But perhaps that's because I was a twenty year old at the time and never played the console ports which seem to have quite a different tone both in terms of music and visuals.

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Doom was a truly authentic work of art. It was sub-cultural, counter-cultural, cyberpunk, the product of adolescent misfit minds that never fit into the dominant culture. It was a raw expression of anger and frustration and took perverse pleasure in subverting religion, morality, and conformity.

 

I'm not saying that Romero, Carmack et al. did this intentionally. It was rather because there was no filter between themselves and the work they made. They controlled the whole process and no one was telling them how to make it or what it should be about. And so the game, like all good works of art, ended up expressing what was latent in the minds of its creators. That was something authentic to the time and that is why the game was such a powerful force. When Carmack, totally defying the infinite greed of the corporate world, released the source code to the public, it was like the final brushstroke that brought it all together. 

 

Doom 2016 and "Eternal" are utterly disconnected from that kind of creative environment. These are games (read: corporate products) that are focus tested to the umpteenth degree to ensure that no one experiences anything while playing them other than a bland sense that time has passed. Yes, some people here will get something out of the lore and what not, but for the vast majority it is an utterly disposable experience. And that, believe it or not, is the actual aim of its creators. Their main goal is for you to quickly finish the game and then start pining after the next installment so they can sell you that too. Which is exactly what happened here.

 

It amazes me that people actually thought they would provide modding tools for this game. Why do you think they called it Doom? Because they actually wanted it to supplant the real Doom in people's minds. Why? Because the real Doom doesn't make them any money. When people can make their own levels and stories they get to entertain themselves and friends purely out of a desire to create and share. That doesn't provide much profit for Bethesda's stockholders, however, and in fact, threatens them because people learn that they don't need them to play great games. Solution: replace the real Doom with the new profitable Doom. Thankfully, people here didn't let that happen.

 

But they're trying again. Doom "Eternal:" as in, the Doom that will be remembered and played forever. Give me a break! I will call it Doom 2016 2.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, TheGamePhilosophe said:

Doom was a truly authentic work of art. It was sub-cultural, counter-cultural, cyberpunk, the product of adolescent misfit minds that never fit into the dominant culture. It was a raw expression of anger and frustration and took perverse pleasure in subverting religion, morality, and conformity.

 

I'm not saying that Romero, Carmack et al. did this intentionally. It was rather because there was no filter between themselves and the work they made. They controlled the whole process and no one was telling them how to make it or what it should be about. And so the game, like all good works of art, ended up expressing what was latent in the minds of its creators. That was something authentic to the time and that is why the game was such a powerful force. When Carmack, totally defying the infinite greed of the corporate world, released the source code to the public, it was like the final brushstroke that brought it all together. 

 

Doom 2016 and "Eternal" are utterly disconnected from that kind of creative environment. These are games (read: corporate products) that are focus tested to the umpteenth degree to ensure that no one experiences anything while playing them other than a bland sense that time has passed. Yes, some people here will get something out of the lore and what not, but for the vast majority it is an utterly disposable experience. And that, believe it or not, is the actual aim of its creators. Their main goal is for you to quickly finish the game and then start pining after the next installment so they can sell you that too. Which is exactly what happened here.

 

It amazes me that people actually thought they would provide modding tools for this game. Why do you think they called it Doom? Because they actually wanted it to supplant the real Doom in people's minds. Why? Because the real Doom doesn't make them any money. When people can make their own levels and stories they get to entertain themselves and friends purely out of a desire to create and share. That doesn't provide much profit for Bethesda's stockholders, however, and in fact, threatens them because people learn that they don't need them to play great games. Solution: replace the real Doom with the new profitable Doom. Thankfully, people here didn't let that happen.

 

But they're trying again. Doom "Eternal:" as in, the Doom that will be remembered and played forever. Give me a break! I will call it Doom 2016 2.

 

 

 

 

 

 

https://media.giphy.com/media/1PgPvWLfXGkCY/giphy.gif

 

"People here didn't let that happen?" You mean the few dozen people who fucking post here while Doom 2016 has gone down as a cult classic? What a fucking joke. You sound like one of those Rick and Morty fans.

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