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crazyflyingdonut

If Doom was more popular in the 90's than it was in the real world

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Let's just say that there was an alternate universe or something where Doom and Doom 2 became bigger successes than they did in this world, and thus more fan-made projects were being licensed and published by id software, a la Final Doom. I mean, Doom was a pretty big success in this world in the 90's and made the creators into millionaires, but sometimes like to wonder if Doom was even bigger back in the 1990's, would more content made by fans be sold in stores?

 

And yes, I do believe in alternate universes. Don't make fun of me for it, okay? This world sucks and sometimes I like to use my imagination. At least I'm not religious.

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1 hour ago, crazyflyingdonut said:

At least I'm not religious.

As if that's a positive trait...

There was a time when people had to pray in secret, for fear of persecution. Now, people are embarrassed by religion?

What if God was more popular?

 

Anyway, there were supposedly more installations of Doom than Windows at that time. How much more popular could it have been?

 

 

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Popularity was not the limiting factor.  Lacking the appropriate technological infrastructure to readily design, manufacture and distribute content was.

 

Today, it's easy to churn out content for a game and endlessly release DLC.  Heck that's Paradox's entire business model.  In 1993/94, that simply wasn't the case.

 

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I guess back then Cyberpunk 2020(in ue1 battles might look like ut99 for instance if this indie game could be developed in 2000 like first installment of Deus Ex) as pc game could be powered by Ken Silverman's game engine Build in early 90's or Epic Games's game engine Unreal Engine 1 just like Deus Ex.This couldn't be just RPG board game from late 80's 1988 to be precise.We could have female striptiz club just like in the Duke Nukem 3D oue enemies could be androids you know illusion of 3d pixelated graphics including tight corridors speaking of technical limitation of Build engine.CD Projekt or Metropolis Software might help Mike Pondsmith's science-fiction board game genre I mean one of these two big companies back then could publish Cyberpunk 2020 after success of Deus Ex 1.It could be more possibilities,but still with some major hardware limitations at least this could be access to first 3d graphics first person shooter in late 90's.I guess if Doom and Wolfenstein 3D could be more popular in the era in which child friendly side-scrolling platformers dominated game market back then speaking of early 90's of course Unreal Engine 1 prototype from 1995 could be more developed that Epic Games could name it Unreal Engine 1 so after Cliff Bleszinski left Epic Games in 2012 Epic Games could be working on Unreal Engine 5 known today as Unreal Engine 4.Shame that in 1995 Epic Games didn't make any indie game back then just like Lucas Arts,3D Realms and Id Software.If Doom was more popular in 1993 then Epic Games new teenage employees wouldn't be focused mainly on endless random level  maps designs for Unreal Marketplace just making next gen shareware/demo indie games.

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15 hours ago, kb1 said:

As if that's a positive trait...

There was a time when people had to pray in secret, for fear of persecution.

 

Those times aren't completely gone though. Belong to a non-mainstream religion and chances are... oh you know what.

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6 hours ago, luke11685 said:

I guess back then Cyberpunk 2020(in ue1 battles might look like ut99 for instance if this indie game could be developed in 2000 like first installment of Deus Ex) as pc game could be powered by Ken Silverman's game engine Build in early 90's or Epic Games's game engine Unreal Engine 1 just like Deus Ex.This couldn't be just RPG board game from late 80's 1988 to be precise.We could have female striptiz club just like in the Duke Nukem 3D oue enemies could be androids you know illusion of 3d pixelated graphics including tight corridors speaking of technical limitation of Build engine.CD Projekt or Metropolis Software might help Mike Pondsmith's science-fiction board game genre I mean one of these two big companies back then could publish Cyberpunk 2020 after success of Deus Ex 1.It could be more possibilities,but still with some major hardware limitations at least this could be access to first 3d graphics first person shooter in late 90's.I guess if Doom and Wolfenstein 3D could be more popular in the era in which child friendly side-scrolling platformers dominated game market back then speaking of early 90's of course Unreal Engine 1 prototype from 1995 could be more developed that Epic Games could name it Unreal Engine 1 so after Cliff Bleszinski left Epic Games in 2012 Epic Games could be working on Unreal Engine 5 known today as Unreal Engine 4.Shame that in 1995 Epic Games didn't make any indie game back then just like Lucas Arts,3D Realms and Id Software.If Doom was more popular in 1993 then Epic Games new teenage employees wouldn't be focused mainly on endless random level  maps designs for Unreal Marketplace just making next gen shareware/demo indie games.

 

Uh...? I have no idea what you are trying to tell me.

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Well Unreal 1 as pc game could be made in 1995 so much earlier than in 1998.And Unreal Tournament 1999 could be also more popular just like Fortnite Battle Royale nowadays.

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Just now, luke11685 said:

Well Unreal 1 as pc game could be made in 1995 so much earlier than in 1998.And Unreal Tournament 1999 could be also more popular just like Fortnite Battle Royale nowadays.

But... that does not have anything to do with my question on what if Doom was more popular in the 1990's than it was.

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Doom had more purchases and players than those that bought Windows 95; I don't think the game's popularity is the reason there weren't more licensed spinoff games.

 

John Carmack himself stated he didn't really want to license out and support his engines and let Epic do that instead, so it seems more like just bad business decisions/behind the scenes drama which were fairly prevalent to id Software.

 

IIRC, Romero was the reason Raven Software got id tech for Heretic and Hexen because he liked those guys and had previous experience with them OR it was because he wanted to work with them, that part escapes me. He has a history of this like when he got Humanhead the Unreal Engine license to work on Daikatana 2, but when the first came out and bombed, he let them keep the license to make whatever they want, which turned into Rune.

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On 9/12/2018 at 6:54 AM, crazyflyingdonut said:

Don't make fun of me for it, okay? This world sucks and sometimes I like to use my imagination. At least I'm not religious.

Keep those opinions to yourself.

 

As for the question, I think gaming had to be much more popular during the 90s. If it were then yeah, Doom would of possibly had a earlier movie, possible t.v. series, an expanded universe with novels and eventually different genre games based on the universe.

 

However Doom may have gotten some law suits by groups like Metallica and the creative direction of the game may have changed considerably for better or worse.

 

 

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5 hours ago, Chezza said:

an expanded universe with novels

 

Hm, I wonder about that. Doom didn't have much lore to it (or so it seemed) since it wasn't the focus of the first games, so I'm curious how would've that turned out.

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If was more popular, maybe Id goes full greddy and launch more  Doom games but with less source code to work with it.

U know, like the expansions packs but without mods

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I'm not sure what to think of this thread. Doom was HUGELY popular in the 90's in "our universe" (as you stated). So i really see no reason to think of an "alternate universe" where it became even more successful and where more commercial add-ons were sold (especially fan made ones).

 

Ever hear of TNT: Evilution? When that was sold as a commercial product (instead of being released for free as was originally intended) it caused quite the stir in the Doom community (from what i've read anyways). No one needs to go through that mess again right?

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1 hour ago, CyberDreams said:

I'm not sure what to think of this thread. Doom was HUGELY popular in the 90's in "our universe" (as you stated). So i really see no reason to think of an "alternate universe" where it became even more successful and where more commercial add-ons were sold (especially fan made ones).

 

Ever hear of TNT: Evilution? When that was sold as a commercial product (instead of being released for free as was originally intended) it caused quite the stir in the Doom community (from what i've read anyways). No one needs to go through that mess again right?

I'm curious as to why people were so angry about Plutonia and TNT being sold instead of being a mod. I was not born yet when that happened.

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5 hours ago, crazyflyingdonut said:

I'm curious as to why people were so angry about Plutonia and TNT being sold instead of being a mod. I was not born yet when that happened.


So doom is popular, there is a group of people working on they own maps (The casilli Brothers and the evilution team) they have some impact on the internet because they will release for the fans, iD see this, and with help of money and people on suits, help those mappers, giving them money to release the map for them, in a map-pack called the Final Doom i pressume, some fans (almost all following the TNT (THE NEW TECHNOLOGY) team ) was upset, because now they will need to pay to play thoses maps, instead of free sharing. Those start a hate-waggon on those team calling them betreyers or cash-grabbers, but anyway, the maps come out and almost everyone praise Plutonia and hate TNT (on the 90)

If that was more popular, maybe that "FINAL DOOM" was not the last one, remeber the master maps, so they try more and more of that, maybe Doom 64 instead of console come to PC as a new 32 wad, or the same Nintendo 64 port, but with less modding posibilities, etc.

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I imagine, if it was more popular, it would have just lead to id Software aggressively milking it more, as in making even more games in the franchise than they already have. No matter how popular it gets, it won't make the original 1993 have an infinite shelf life because technology presses forward. You'd have to eliminate human progress and chasing after the latest thing for that to be a reality.

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12 hours ago, crazyflyingdonut said:

I'm curious as to why people were so angry about Plutonia and TNT being sold instead of being a mod. I was not born yet when that happened.

 

Don't worry. I was only a little kid then. I only know of what happened from reading about it. I didn't really get to experience it first hand.

 

7 hours ago, jamondemarnatural said:


So doom is popular, there is a group of people working on they own maps (The casilli Brothers and the evilution team) they have some impact on the internet because they will release for the fans, iD see this, and with help of money and people on suits, help those mappers, giving them money to release the map for them, in a map-pack called the Final Doom i pressume, some fans (almost all following the TNT (THE NEW TECHNOLOGY) team ) was upset, because now they will need to pay to play thoses maps, instead of free sharing. Those start a hate-waggon on those team calling them betreyers or cash-grabbers, but anyway, the maps come out and almost everyone praise Plutonia and hate TNT (on the 90)

 

^Pretty much.

 

Also at crazyflyingdonut, if i came off as a prick i apologize. I didn't mean too. I just re-read what i first posted and it sounded kinda harsh. I guess i was just in a bad mood the other day. I like to read up a lot on Doom's history (the doomwiki is great for that as it has a lot of links to references) so i was just kind of dumbfounded that you could think that Doom could be even more popular than it already was. BUT if you DO want to use your imagination and think of an alternate universe where anything goes, then don't let me stop you ;)

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2 minutes ago, CyberDreams said:

 

Don't worry. I was only a little kid then. I only know of what happened from reading about it. I didn't really get to experience it first hand.

 

 

^Pretty much.

 

Also at crazyflyingdonut, if i came off as a prick i apologize. I didn't mean too. I just re-read what i first posted and it sounded kinda harsh. I guess i was just in a bad mood the other day. I like to read up a lot on Doom's history (the doomwiki is great for that as it has a lot of links to references) so i was just kind of dumbfounded that you could think that Doom could be even more popular than it already was. BUT if you DO want to use your imagination and think of an alternate universe where anything goes, then don't let me stop you ;)

 

It's fine. A lot of the things I say get people angry, I'm used to it. As for what you said, maybe it's my autism, but I barely noticed you were angry. As for what I said, I like to hear about Doom's history too.

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Then the whole planet would probably explode. As said before, Doom was already extremely popular back in the 90's. If it got any more popular then we likely would've had a gaming machine entirely made to play Doom related stuff only (which sounds awsome tbh).

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It would have it's own brand of cereal. Rip and tear breakfast until it is DONE.

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8 minutes ago, Ex Oblivione said:

It would have it's own brand of cereal. Rip and tear breakfast until it is DONE.

Lets go further a little bit.

 

What if Doom had its own school where people do nothing but learn the history of the game and play it every week on their computers? Or learn to make their own maps and see who has the best one?

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1 hour ago, TakenStew22 said:

Lets go further a little bit.

 

What if Doom had its own school where people do nothing but learn the history of the game and play it every week on their computers? Or learn to make their own maps and see who has the best one?

So, basically Yu-Gi-Oh! GX, but with Doom. Doom Academy, Doom Disks, holographic Doom monsters, and a secret basement level where the Serpent Riders are stored in suspended animation. Sounds good to me.

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20 hours ago, crazyflyingdonut said:

I'm curious as to why people were so angry about Plutonia and TNT being sold instead of being a mod. I was not born yet when that happened.

If I am not mistaken, TNT was originally announced as a free addon and the announcement telling people that it was paid was out the day before it was actually released. Thus pissing people off because they had it flipped last minute.

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Doom was already a huge success, the thing i would change in an alternate world would the ID team not falling appart during Quake development so they could keep up the pace

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7 hours ago, GhoulDesecrator said:

the thing i would change in an alternate world would the ID team not falling apart during Quake development so they could keep up the pace

I agree with you. I think that it fell apart because John Romero became so addicted to Doom deathmatch that it pissed everyone off at id software.

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Another aspect I didn't think of before: Gaming was very different in '93 than it is now. Not long before that, video games were in the mall, and at convenience stores, and they cost you a quarter to play for only a few minutes.

 

Or, if you were lucky enough, you had a crappy game console like the Atari 2600 plugged into a TV, and you could play simplistic, very ugly games on it (Atari 2600 was awesome, actually).

 

Or, third option: You had an 8-bit home computer with simple games and simple graphics.

 

Doom arrived a bit later, in the BBS and shareware era. Again, very different from the modern scene. You have to take all of this into account when thinking about popularity and the effects thereof. Doom really couldn't have been more popular, in '93, like a game can be nowadays, with the ability to instantly download it and play it against anyone in the world. Totally different scene back then.

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Wasn't Doom already the #1 cause of lost productivity in the world in its heyday?  Or was that just a humorous boast not meant to be taken seriously?

 

  It boggles the mind trying to imagine Doom as being even more popular than it was.

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