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Dragonfly

[FINAL RELEASE] Eviternity

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46 minutes ago, eirc said:

So from what I gather there's no fix for this?

 

There must be something else going on, some obscure scaling option tripping it up, perhaps? Thousands of people have played in gzdoom and this is the first I'm hearing about this error.

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50 minutes ago, ukiro said:

 

There must be something else going on, some obscure scaling option tripping it up, perhaps? Thousands of people have played in gzdoom and this is the first I'm hearing about this error.

 

Yup, was thinking the exact same thing and is why I initially expected to google myself to a fix. I'll try fiddling more with GZDoom settings then.

 

EDIT: It's so freaking weird tho, I get the exact same thing on both a Windows PC AND a Mac laptop. Both with my settings and the gzdoom defaults.

 

EDIT2: Ok I got some progress here, it only happens in the latest 4.5.0 gzdoom. 4.4.2 is fine and in fact the whole endscreen has a lot more give on the bottom there.

 

EDIT3: From gzdoom 4.5.0 release notes at https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?t=70459"Menu and intermission screen now scale to the original Doom.exe's layout by default." probably related?

Edited by eirc

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9 minutes ago, eirc said:

 

Yup, was thinking the exact same thing and is why I initially expected to google myself to a fix. I'll try fiddling more with GZDoom settings then.

 

I've got the exact same thing happening to me. Let me know if you manage to figure it out, because I haven't been able to.

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57 minutes ago, eirc said:

"Menu and intermission screen now scale to the original Doom.exe's layout by default."

 

Welp, that's one to go complain to the GZDoom devvelopment team about. I'm not making changes my end (I did declare the WAD final and I'm sticking to it) - this seems like they have broken their own intermission screens. Does this bad offsetting happen when playing an IWAD? Because this uses the same exact system as that, the only difference being that the map title is actually the entire 320x200 window, which doesn't affect the offsets of any other graphics on that screen...

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Ok I was about to post that I've only seen this in eviternity but then I thought to test a bit more with other wads that would use advanced stuff and boom:

 

Spoiler

aagz.png.639bd76fded683d81a2bf5779932749d.png

 

I also found the gzdoom setting "Classic ZDoom scaling on summary screen". Turning that on I assume basically disables this new feature and fixes the summary screens (it was a bit difficult to find since it won't the change the screen live, you have to get a new one to see it change). Though the text appears a bit too overcorrected with it I think? Not sure.

 

21 hours ago, jmac said:

I've got the exact same thing happening to me. Let me know if you manage to figure it out, because I haven't been able to.

Here you go :)

 

One more small thing to note is that while on AA this appears to fix it fine, on Eviternity this fixes the text but also smushes the background pic a bit. I attach some screenshots just FYI. I'll also link this post to the zdoom forums in case they're interested in fixing it.

 

Eviternity GZDoom new scaling

Spoiler

evgz.png.67fa733061da42c20364fea58a048582.png

 

Eviternity GZDoom classic scaling

Spoiler

evgzcl.png.a851580b5b5f54cf6e69bc49f1255b20.png

 

Eviternity PrBoom reference

Spoiler

evpr.png.69820bd8153fb4a3b7eaed2da1c4a6e8.png

 

Ancient Aliens GZDoom new scaling

Spoiler

aagz.png.639bd76fded683d81a2bf5779932749d.png

 

Ancient Aliens GZDoom classic scaling

Spoiler

aagzcl.png.6e91731b8ab8671fe521d68ec3a1153f.png

 

Ancient Aliens PrBoom reference

Spoiler

aapr.png.ed33d2e05abf5382565379a099370d8e.png

 

EDIT: Opened a bug on zdoom forums but it was a duplicate as this has been reported for Resurgence earlier. Here's a link for reference: https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=70700

Edited by eirc

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Another highly rated pwad. Adds 4 new types of monsters and 1 unique final boss. Consists of 6 episodes, each with it's own style. Wad is poorly compatible with Complex Doom in terms of passability - it's too difficult, so I don't recommend putting it here.

 

Settings and other:

 

* GZDoom.

* Difficulty - "Ultra-Violence".

* I did not collect 100% of secrets.
 

* Quite often at the beginning of one or another level a start with one pistol is forced. On a number of levels, for example #32, this multiplies the difficulty.

* Challenge maps vary with more moderate ones, which gives some variety and respite between tough battles itself.

 

58344130fdbbe1455d43d44661bfc01e.png

 

* On M3 you can pick up a double-barreled gun. To do this you need to shoot a small switch hidden in the wall.

* From the M15 you can get to the secret level 31, from which, in turn, straight to level 32. This requires to do 2 actions.

 

1 - shoot the switch behind the skull image not far from the start, this will open up a dark passage not far from the exit.

2 - get the blue key, closer to the end of the map, to open the passage to the teleport. On the same map, a small epic battle awaits in such a huge winter gazebo (most of about 500 opponents will appear in the vicinity). In the end expect a cyberdemon.

* At the end of M24 4 cyberdemons awaiting for the player, same as several revenants and archfiles.

 

Both secret maps are quite difficult. If you do not consider yourself a hardcore player you should not go to them. There will be two points on the M31 where in a space of 2x2 meters, operating only with a double-barreled gun, you will need to get rid of several pinkies and revenants, in total about 10 opponents of each type.

 

b10e0bd07569eb1b9e4dd0dda8d0d449.png

 

The entire map could not be photographed, while staying at the exit point. That's how big it is.

 

However M31 is "walk in the park" in compare to M32 - a huge complex map, ~ 1408+ enemies, pistol start. At the end of the map, in a small oval location, a battle awaits with several waves of opponents - barons, then revenants and in the final a cyberdemon, to which about 5 archfiles and several simpler teleporting opponents will go to help. The number of secrets is displayed as 13, I've found 9 and for one more I could not open the door. There may be a mistake in the numbering (?).

 

* Not so huge and complex maps, but still quite complex, also include M19 - Dehydration. About 950 opponents, ~ 1 hour versus ~ 1.5 hours in the case of M32 to complete, as well as MAP26 - Transcendence, where you will need to force most of the 490 enemies start to attack each other, although in this case, in the end, you will most likely have to fight with naked fists only.

* At the end of M20 - Convolute a cyberdemon will meet you. He can be killed with a telefrag.

* M28 - Judgment. There are enough missiles in the arsenal to kill 1 of the cyberdemons that stand on the towers. This will make it easier to fight one of the next waves of opponents.

* M29 - Elysium. There is a cave location on the map with small lakes. A group of several dozen revenants and astral cacodemons will meet you there. It makes sense to save a few BFG charges for this moment.

 

e571bef755cc23205d038ca1f67a3640.png d0a6aaf4d89c75686926daf594e9a017.png

 

* M30 - Eternity. The boss has 3 stages. In addition to him about 900+ (depending on how many lost souls will appear) enemies await. On the last one stage it makes sense not so much to attack such as to run around the location and provoke other enemiesto attack him.

 

Pros:

 

56227b7971081a78a3870b4dfbedccf0.png

 

+ New types of enemies fit well into the atmosphere.

+ Music. In particular, on the maps M10, M31.

+ Beautifully designed locations.

+ M5 - Demon. A compact map, 150 opponents and a pillar with a red key in the center, which symbolizes a kind of timer according to which monsters appear.

+ M9 - Decrepitude. A tough map with extremely limited ammo and a strategic approach. At the end of the level you can find a secret with a BFG, which is guarded by 2 archwiles.

 

752e0e8478c3a864b533e684d05cf781.png

 

+ M10 - Wanderer. Atmospheric winter map with melancholic midi melody in the background. Here for the first time, if you take to account a secret location on the M9, astral cacodemons appear, as well as a more dangerous variety of machine gunners.

+ M21 - Imperishable.

 

f08ad1d038606b603f71959a0b98b52e.png

 

+ M25 - Slave. Small arena map. 241 enemies.

+ M27 - Heliopolis. A beautiful map in the greek & abstract style. I really didn't have enough ammo to cope with the mastermind at the end of the level, so I left it alive.

 

Contras:

 

- The general uniformity of maps in episode 6, both in terms of style, same as battles with hordes of enemies on small areas of the map.

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MAP29, area beyond teleportation rings:

mbf_006.png.46a95ad2f050af64ef5f98d7e76748ea.pngmbf_007.png.e4fabb90107e6f6b6014def10ed7d9e3.png

 

Spoiler

Absolute mindfuck. It's like bad LSD trip or snippet from ordinary drug user's day. Especially when you're waiting which linedef or bad node will send executable down and still no SIGSEGV in sight and everything works just fine. Good job. It was planned from Level 1 or it was more like momentary decision?

 

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Posted (edited)

 

disclaimer.png.2f44c732074adf8dac49c5e99cb6ad06.png

  1. I'm aware, this thread isn't suited for DOS related discussion, on the other hand I haven't been able to found better thread to share. So bear with me please. Just for one post.
  2. Since author/creator of this WAD made clear intention not to alter final WAD in any way (or let others to do so), please do not make any unauthorized changes to this WAD or at least don't share them publicly. I intend to comply with author wishes. No PM's needed. Don't bother. Thank you.

 

 

Ever since I've seen this trailer, I've kept wondering. It's possible to run something like this in (MS-)DOS?

 

 

Of course, year or two back I i didn't know anything about Eviternity (most impressive scenes are from Eviternity). But it has changed.

 

From January 3, I've spent entire COVID-quarantine devoted to one task: To be able to run Eviternity in DOS environment more specifically in MBF port.

l1-16.png.1805d751b65e997409938360fa5ad311.png

l17-32.png.e8f5e48092888de2b8c9ed49058d624d.png

 

And guess what? It's more possible than you might think. Every level screenshot is from DOS (or DOSBox to be more precise).

 

First, to clarify (as some had wondered) why even bother? Why try to run modern WAD as Eviternity in obsolete port as MBF (or Boom) and in DOS environment specifically? Madness? No.

 

info.png.a1b49b6264a5acd618941468293b15be.png

  • Because as far as I know, MBF is closest to vanilla experience as possible. AdLib, Sound Blaster, PC Speaker, Low-Detail mode, software renderer in assembler, lighting, etc. You know about other limit removing port (and I mean very far limit removing) even closer to vanilla DOOM which is going to run things like Eviternity? Then please let me know.
  • I don't own legacy hardware anymore. Hardware I do own isn't capable to scale-down CPU as much as needed anymore. On the other hand, DOSBox is perfectly capable to emulate older HW (i80486, Pentium). It's question of few configuration parameters. Even with I/O and MIDI glitches included.
  • Because it should have been done from beginning. I'll explain later.

 

 

In the second place I should probably apologize. There are few special effects (custom monsters, better pistol, long jumps and flying, Invisible floor, I don't know what) and mostly they work (yes, even flying). So obviously WAD isn't optimised solely for new ports (GZDoom-only) but was made with vanilla/Boom features in mind. Good. So where is problem? BSP tree isn't optimized for classical ports (ZDBSP? My guess) and Node/Segs count is very high. First half of WAD is pretty fine just REJECT lumps are missing. Use ZenNode or ZokumBsp. Or better, use them both in tandem (ZkBSP primarly, ZenNode as backup), rebuild tree for each level and it should work.

 

Second half of WAD (winter episode and levels 15 and higher) is tougher. It's in ZDBSP format (XNOD NODES and SEGS and SSECTORS missing/empty) or even compressed (MAP32?). Two ways to fix it:

  1. Implement support for NODES in compressed or uncompressed ZDBSP format or DeePBSP format in MBF2.04. See p_extnodes.c or
  2. Rebuild everthing to normal format and apply commit with support for extended nodes. Levels use more than 32767 map entities and it exceeds DOOM static limits. I went this way and I was able to run almost all levels this way. Last stuborn part was MAP15 – Crynology, MAP29 – Elysium and MAP32. But recently:

crynology.png.2e05399107da535e6aea98db58e7fb65.png

elysium.png.42adaba2245162d57c2789e0b780c0a2.png

 

MAP32 is too big even for ZokumBSP so it stays as last unconquered base. But so far I don't mind it ;-) Everything else works.

It isn't without problems of course. Rebuilding will inevitably lead to unstitched linedefs and lots of slime trails, unreferenced textures, HOM holes but let me put it this way: All keys are where they supposed to be, all doors open and I was able to reach every level exit. BLOCKMAP is fine. Bugs are there but nothing game breaking. Good enough for me.

 

Eviternity is really labour of love so It would be (eternal) pity not to be able enjoy this marvel in MBF/320x200. I especially like elaborate shadow projection and attention to details (far less I like the way such a things are implemented):

map01.jpg.542f1226042cfda5970dd63d2e3e6954.jpg

map15.jpg.e5164216ae18efb31e1f822b3db1c665.jpg

 

and I like possibility to enjoy these unseen things in DOS. So, enjoy too.

Thanks to @fabian for bug fixing and @BlueThunder for pointing me right direction.

 

Yeah and if there are another elaborate WADs/TCs like Eviternity, not yet seen in DOS/MBF please let me know (can be just through PM). I'll try my best.

Edited by AnotherGrunt

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Posted (edited)

That's pretty cool dude! I would love to play Eviternity on DOS.
Not only that, but these are some helpful info for future projects, so thanks a lot for your research.

Edited by Noiser

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Posted (edited)

By way of a review.

 

It is generally been my wont to complain of wads with custom graphics and monsters that they don't feel like the same game that original Doom is, and i've always been firmly in the camp of classic-style visuals and gameplay.  In January i had my first go at this wad, and was initially impressed, but then dismissed the set as gimmicky and its attractiveness as novelty, giving it up for some time, until it was suggested to me (thanks ReaperAA!) less than a week ago here that i give it another go.  So i did.

 

The experience was so overwhelming that it's a little bit difficult to even collect my thoughts so soon after finishing it.  Everyone knows this wad by now so i avoid repeating what's been said a thousand times, but the combination of truly classic gameplay with modern, and sometimes hypermodern, both concrete and abstract, visuals, creates an incredibly faithful to the original yet unique ambience.  Falling off platforms because ice is slippery doesn't feel like a gimmick here, and i'm not experienced enough to pinpoint what makes the actual difference, but it's there.  For me this is the correct direxion Doom should taken, after Ultimate Doom. 

 

The levels are expansive and non-linear for the sake of realizing their full potential and being immersive, and not not to prolong the gameplay artificially, while the new graphics transport the player to authentic Doom-experience in a realm that is more varied and expansive than the original, not merely novel for its own sake or because the creator had a creative or funny idea (not dismissing such levels or their quality in any way, they are popular for good reason, they are just not my cup of tea.)  Even the custom monsters i enjoyed, and in such surroundings they didn't feel out of place, and added quite a punch to the battles, without being unfair, being balanced well - well, except for the Cyberboi (haha, i don't know his real name).  Of the graphics i'll only say that whilst i'm totally in love with the classic hell designs of the original, even the somewhat abstract Chapter in hell with (what i would call) hypermodern design found its way to my heart - it's just a gorgeous and foreboding Chapter, and whilst being completely different doesn't even lose to Si666il.

(i regret now i didn't play this on GZDoom, since my old saves were on PrBoom+, and i think i missed out on quite a lot of visual enhancements, but that's just all the more reason to play it again.)

 

Only two points of criticism.  The severely increased angle of the difficulty curve towards the end of Episode 4, which forced me to go down from HMP to HNTR as i wanted to enjoy the game instead of it becoming a savescumming fest to waddle through, was perhaps justified, but i'm not entirely sure it was necessary.  Secondly, the last chapter for my liking had too much of slaughter, which is also a shame because of the fantastic visual designs that would've deserved maps more focused on exploration.

Mind you, there are a few slaughterish scenes before, particularly in end of Chapter levels, but they were always manageable, with enough room to maneuver, keeping mobile being always the winning strategy.  Also, throughout the wad there are quite a few nasty ambushes, yet on HMP (later on HNTR), they never felt unfair, and that being probably my weakest skill-area, i often managed them on first try (doesn't mean that they'd be easy, only that in the last weeks i've had a lot of practice with them...)  Overall, the careful implementation of skill levels was nice to note - as having earlier watched some videos played on UV, that's one thing i was worried about.

As a detail regarding enemy placement, i particularly noticed in many maps the excellent use of Pinkies, and their new cousins, Tealies.  Seldom have they been so effectivelly used in groups of different sizes to act as disruptors, as they demanded attention while in midfight with some deadlier foes.  In design similarly there's also no shortage of unique details, but i'll mention as one of the most striking the transparent bloodfall curtain surrounding the starting position in map22.  It isn't the only unique feature in that level, however - the whole area is a thing of beauty, and of all, possibly my favourite level in the set.

 

To my experience a unique set of levels, and sincerely my new favourite.  Funny,  that as a classicist my three favourite wads have all been made in latter half of 2010s...  Oh there is another complaint, this wad should have been doubled in length!  There would be a lot of mileage in these designs, it seems that five levels in each style is far too little, so i hope there will be a continuation, or something.  And that Dragonfly & co. would make a continuation to this :P  So thanks to Dragonfly and all the mappers and participants.

 

(i'm just posting this here because i don't really know where else to.)

Edited by dei_eldren : slaughter+ambushes, pinkies, map22

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Hey, I'm having trouble with the final boss of this PWAD. He doesn't play the audio file and as soon as he goes to stand up, he disappears. I'm playing on the latest version of PrBoom+/UMAPINFO. Any thoughts?

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5 minutes ago, nobleflame said:

Hey, I'm having trouble with the final boss of this PWAD. He doesn't play the audio file and as soon as he goes to stand up, he disappears. I'm playing on the latest version of PrBoom+/UMAPINFO. Any thoughts?

 

Please check your compatibility. Eviternity is a MBF wad, and it should be run with -complevel 11

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4 minutes ago, antares031 said:

 

Please check your compatibility. Eviternity is a MBF wad, and it should be run with -complevel 11

That fixed it, thank you! Weird thing is that I used -complevel 11 in my .bat file but it wasn't updating in the options menu... I had to change it manually. Any idea why this happens and where I'm going wrong with my .bat? 

 

e.g. prboom-plus.exe -file D2SPFX19.WAD Eviternity.wad -deh D2DEHFIX.DEH -complevel 11

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On 2/7/2020 at 9:57 PM, TheOldKing1998 said:

When I launch Eternity with GZdoom 4.3.3 I get this error

"R_InstallSprite: Sprite BSPI frame A is missing rotations"

Any Ideas on how to fix this?

 

On 2/9/2020 at 12:01 AM, Xaser said:

@TheOldKing1998 That error happens when GZDoom tries to load Eviternity with doom.wad instead of doom2.wad -- make sure it's loading the latter, and all oughta be well.

 

On 2/10/2020 at 12:15 AM, adamadam said:

strange, gzdoom doesn't give me the option to load with doom or doom2, it skips past the iwad selection menu altogether

 

On 2/10/2020 at 1:32 AM, TheNoob_Gamer said:

Probably because you are using a launcher / frontend.

 

On 2/10/2020 at 1:34 AM, ReaperAA said:

Well yeah if you drag Eviternity into the GZdoom.exe, it automatically loads the wad using Doom2.wad as the iwad.

 

If it is not working, then try putting Doom2.wad and Eviternity.wad in the GZdoom folder, then create a .bat file with the following line


gzdoom.exe -iwad Doom2.wad -file Eviternity.wad

And then run the .bat file

 

On 2/10/2020 at 7:07 AM, Gez said:

ZDoom has a feature (GAMEINFO lump) that allows mods to tell it which IWAD they need. When you load a file, ZDoom starts by looking if there's a GAMEINFO lump, and if so parse it. Then it does the rest of the initialization, including showing the IWAD selector if needed.

 

Hey everyone.


Google brought me here because I'm having this same issue of being unable to launch pwads with GZDoom and a launcher (using ZDL).  I currently have Eviternity, Sunlust, Valiant, and B2SX.  When I try to launch Eviternity, Sunlust, or Valiant through ZDL, it skips that iWAD selection startup window, and loads the wrong iwad, which doesn't work obviously.  Manually dragging and dropping the pwads onto the gzdoom.exe file loads the iwad selection startup window, but doens't let me load other mods with it; and while the .bat file method does work, i have other mods and stuff that i use and switch around, and i don't want to have to edit a .bat file every time i want to change up mods.

 

So is there a way to force GZDoom to load the iwad selection startup window when launched through ZDL? i don't know anything about the gameinfo lump, nor do i see anything with that filename anywhere.

 

Oh, and for whatever reason, both B2SX episodes do launch from ZDL properly.  For whatever reason the iwad selection startup menu does load when i launch them through ZDL, and i have no idea why it's different.


Thanks so much.  BTW eviternity is amazing lol.

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if you're doing it manually you can just drag eviternity aswell as whatever mod you have want with it.

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hey thanks for the quick reply

 

the problem with manually dragging & dropping wads with multiple mods is that i've never understood how you were supposed to get the mods to load in the correct order.  i really want to figure out how to get this to work with ZDL if possible.


for the record i had also tried DoomLauncher but it's a huge pile of shit lol

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Just now, BabySkinCondom said:

hey thanks for the quick reply

 

the problem with manually dragging & dropping wads with multiple mods is that i've never understood how you were supposed to get the mods to load in the correct order.  i really want to figure out how to get this to work with ZDL if possible.


for the record i had also tried DoomLauncher but it's a huge pile of shit lol

I find that load order doesn't really matter that much unless your trying to load something that probably won't go too well.

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Load order is very important, actually. This is a more general support question and not relevant to Eviternity specifically, so I'd advise creating a thread specifically for your question(s) in the Doom General section.

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Doesn't ZDL have a way to select the IWAD? At worst you could type -iwad doom2 in the "additional parameters" box that I remember is there. (I haven't used ZDL for years.)

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Posted (edited)

yeah so it turns out that you need to have the pwads in the 'external files' with all your mods and other files, and not in the iwads section

 

that's why b2sx was working- you need to load both .wad files together or it wont work, so i had already figured out you needed to put both a and b wad files in the external files section.

 

i feel like an idiot.  anyway sorry for wasting your time and thanks for all the quick replies.

 

btw playing eviternity with project brutality is a riot lol

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The thread title using the words [FINAL RELEASE] is not for show - I intend to make no updates to this.

 

Fortunately, if a UMAPINFO lump is something you want, the post above has got you covered. :)

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6 hours ago, Dragonfly said:

The thread title using the words [FINAL RELEASE] is not for show - I intend to make no updates to this.

 

Ok, we got this. And just out of curiosity – why so?

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Dragonfly said:

I have a life.

 

To elaborate, I, like most other people, have got a limited amount of spare time - I have a full time job, I compose music, I make maps, I play games, I maintain a social life, I maintain my fitness, I enjoy exploring new areas, I play instruments and hell, I'm even in the process of moving home. As you can see, many, many other things take priority versus the option of endlessly making minor adjustments to a mapset for a niche game to an even smaller niche crowd who would bother to play the updated version. It's a product of it's time and I'm keeping it that way - my art, my rules.

 

It's like asking a painter why they don't keep adding layers upon layers of paint to a painting they made 2-3 years ago. I imagine they would tell you that they're happy enough with what they made, or that it serves as a good marker of their talents at that point in time, or that they would rather make new paintings, or perhaps have new ways to spend their time that they're more interested in.

 

You are doing too many things to improve your life. Please eliminate three. I am not a crackpot.

 

CA425KBWQAAH7Cu.jpg

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Well, I did finish the wad like a year ago and I had a blast.

Well now Im doing it again! With Coop monsters enable now, and wow its quite the difference in some levels. Special mention goes to Map07's beginning. Map17, that fight on the Arena where you get the Plasma gun is so much harder thanks to that one archvile. It really makes you appreciate just how GOOD the Annihilators are at killing each other in Map23.

However I did find one bug with Coop monsters enabled, this is in GZdoom btw, I'll check in Prboom+ if it happens as well. But in Map05, a good chunk of monsters don't enter the arena, they remain dormant in a separate room, which as soon as you get in with noclip, they wake up and walk into the teleporters which send them to the arena as it should happen.

Apart from that tho. I absolutely recommend activating coop monsters if you want a different and much harder experience.

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