SIGIL v1.21 - New Romero megawad [released!]

[EANB]

I'm thinking there might be slight overuse of METAL details and trimmings (that you can often get caught on) but I'm digging most of the aesthetic. Truly hellish.

[Nevander]

So I'm still sorta avoiding reading every post fully or watching serious gameplay but I can't believe some people. So many seem to be forgetting that all the modern WADs and maps we have these days ARE NOT classic Doom content. Expecting Sigil to be like that is beyond stupid. These people are spoiled hard by modern WADs and have no respect left for the classic design. Makes me very disppointed with that part of the community as a whole.

 

That is all.

[Beezle]

4 minutes ago, Nevander said:

So I'm still sorta avoiding reading every post fully or watching serious gameplay but I can't believe some people. So many seem to be forgetting that all the modern WADs and maps we have these days ARE NOT classic Doom content. Expecting Sigil to be like that is beyond stupid. These people are spoiled hard by modern WADs and have no respect left for the classic design. Makes me very disppointed with that part of the community as a whole.

 

Same here, I couldn't watch more than 45 secs of gameplay or reviews. I think those who are disappointed with Sigil were expecting Eviternity or Ancient Aliens type of wad like someone, sorry I forget who, said earlier in the thread when he clearly said it was gonna be a classic episode in a similar vein as Thy Flesh Consumed.I'm sure its not perfect, but from what little I saw, I know it won't disappoint. 

[Curunir]

I'm not disappointed because it doesn't look like Eviternity, I'm disappointed because Romero appears to think that the pinnacle of Doom gameplay consists of funneling the player through 64-96 unit wide tunnels and ledges while constantly blocking the already narrow path with enemies.

 

The new levels are disappointing, at best.

[elden4]

still didn't play it , but I expect some gameplay similar to e1m4b or e1m8b so like the recent maps he just made, is it?

[xvertigox]

Here's a playthrough of all the DM maps. Interestingly, E5M4 is based in MAP01.

 

Spoiler

 

 

[ImpieEyez95]

12 hours ago, elden4 said:

still didn't play it , but I expect some gameplay similar to e1m4b or e1m8b so like the recent maps he just made, is it?

 

Somewhat similar. I'm not the biggest fan of some of the texture aesthetic (notably the Skull textures as walkways... don't like them myself - but that's just me being picky and not ever really liking those textures since seeing E4M(can't remember the map slot..) as well as the overuse of the Marble theme... could've used WALL49(1,2,3,4) (the red variant of Marble wall) much more I think... along with some maps looking like Slough of Despair in terms of mountain/rock textures (too much usage of WALL63_1 whereas WALL64_2 and its other variants would've worked much better... that was a bit much I thought..., along with possibly having some more Blood fall/blood type stuff, BFALL and its variants weren't used much, if at all i don't think) , even though I do appreciate his choice of creating a hell-themed wad, in which case he's only ever really done Tech-base types.   It really feels (to me anyway) like he did a mashup of Techbase-like Hell levels, even though I know that this is set within Hell itself. I particularly enjoy the first map and how it just screams "You're in HELL now. Time to WIN!" when i first booted it up. 

 

I feel he really nailed the Hell theme especially, on the secret level. It really had that Romero level  charm. 

 

I'd state that the secret level, then the starting level e5m1, were some of the better maps of the bunch in terms of Hell-themed design. 

 

Bug issues aside (which hopefully will be addressed by official release time), it definitely stands up against E1M4b/e1m8b, although I personally enjoy some of the maps in SIGIL more so than others. I like the challenge they're presenting, and it's damn hard, but it's also damn good. While i'm playing on UV and it seems like there's a shortage of ammo, that could be me not finding all the secrets in particular levels, so it's okay. It makes me just play the game some more until I master it. I do enjoy going from E1 - E3 (when played in COMPAT version) and it really feels GREAT as it really feels like a true episode a la E3 (even though, we know it as an unofficial 5th Episode..). 

I do wonder if he was creating some of these maps in darkly lit rooms and took a note from the Doom64 developers lol, a la Tim Heydelaar ( @Hyde )   and his thread/comment, as some of the maps are very dark, even in Software rendering mode on GZDoom.... 

 

With this all said, I strongly hope that Romero would create an Episode 2-styled Map replacement... that would also be superbly interesting (Since all of those Episode 2 maps were created by Sandy and/or first conceived by Tom Hall. [ @Romero This is good to think about ;) I'd love to see your take on that.]

 

TL:DR - Great gameplay, some pretty great level design. I'm not particularly fond of some of the textures, but that's just me - as he really only did have a limited palette to work with texture-wise. Hope he some day does an E2-style replacement as well. 

Edit: Has anyone in the community thought of designing an INTERPIC for this later on down the line yet?

Edited May 27, 2019 by ImpieEyez95

[Steve D]

5 hours ago, Okgo5555 said:

Also, I've been lurking here since 2000 . . .

 

Wow, a 19-year lurk, that must be a record!  Thanks for coming out of the shadows and joining the party. :)

[Doom64hunter]

15 hours ago, andrewdowell said:

Can anyone that currently has the wad upload a youtube video that shows off all the deathmatch levels?

 

Not mine, but somebody just did it:

 

[braders1986]

Really looking forward to this. Original Doom level design is exactly what I want from this.

 

Also wondering if there will be any way of removing the new title screens and intro midi as I want Sigil to add nicely on-to Ultimate Doom wad as the fifth episode. Gzdoom will most likely support this, but I only really use that for mods. I play vanilla Doom on Crispy.

[Ferk]

We already knew it was meant to be a classic map, using mainly the bundled textures, compatible with limit-removing ports with no special features and that it was meant to be hard (it's the last episode after all).

 

Anyone complaining about those things which have been public knowledge for months was simply misinformed. If they wanted to complain about that they should have started months ago.

[NightFright]

Got my full version after sending order confirmation for the Beast Box to info@romerogames.com (thanks for the hint).

After expressing my hopes to Romero (who personally handled the email) that he wouldn't be done with Doom yet after this, his reply was:

 

Quote

Done with DOOM after this? Depends on the general feedback about SIGIL. ;)

 

[cambreaKer]

1 hour ago, braders1986 said:

Also wondering if there will be any way of removing the new title screens and intro midi as I want Sigil to add nicely on-to Ultimate Doom wad as the fifth episode. Gzdoom will most likely support this, but I only really use that for mods. I play vanilla Doom on Crispy.

You can open sigil's wad file (don't know what it's called) with SLADE or any wad editing software and delete "TITLEPIC" and "D_INTRO" lumps

[Phobus]

I parted company with the £5.86 (€6.66) to get the version with the MP3s and have just given it a run-through on UV. I guess the value of the Buckethead soundtrack will vary based on your music tastes, but I enjoyed it - particularly the shift from fast-paced guitars to a more horror/ambient feel in the middle levels.

 

I found the puzzle-y nature of the maps very old-school and was glad that I'd read somebody saying about shooting the Evil Eyes for progression, as that comes up a lot. The secret hunting is pretty variable, although there are very few simple "press on a different bit of wall" item closets, with most involving platforming or noticing hidden switches and exploring the edges. E5M4 was a low point for me, as the area with the crushers was a massive test of patience, whilst I found E5M7 to be a great exploration level featuring a clever sequence where you revisit previous arenas. Item balance on UV felt reasonably generous for ammo as long as you were on top of secrets and ready to use the rocket launcher, whilst health often felt at a premium, with lots of damaging floors, crushers and tight quarters keeping me on edge and encouraging using the save feature to not lose too much progress as the levels got longer. The surprisingly frequent cyberdemons also were a major factor in keeping my health low.

 

I stumbled into the secret exit as I was groping about trying to clear up secrets and kills. E5M9 is a pretty nice extra map, although it arguably doesn't really differentiate itself much from the rest of the map set, following a similar texture scheme to the others and not being a massive step up in either danger or reward.

 

The idiosyncrasies make this map set feel different from a lot of what I've played - particularly the map entrances and exits (although I didn't realise the latter until I dodged into it, missing killing the last two enemies in M1). The cracks from E1M4b and E1M8b are back, with plenty of pentagrams, high-detail damaged areas and other visual flair to set this apart from the older Doom, but it does feel like a continuation of the original game. Very comparable to No Rest for the Living for Doom II, in that way, I think. Definitely worth a play anyway. I'm sure Jimmy's MIDIs are superb if you don't fancy paying, and the 31st isn't so long away now.

[Vermil]

I'll probably get my standard box and not open it. Then I'll download the free version and play that.

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

Don't forget, you'll be able to sell it for a couple hundred dollars on eBay in 20 years.

[dybbuk81]

1 hour ago, TheUltimateDoomer666 said:

Don't forget, you'll be able to sell it for a couple hundred dollars on eBay in 20 years.

and I'll probably be the one to buy it since I couldn't in December...

 

 

I wonder if Sigil will grace the /newstuff chronicles this time.

[Welfare Prodigy]

15 hours ago, Epyo said:

 

Ahhhh I thought about it, and I see what we're confused about now, it's not broken actually.  Hiding my explanation with spoiler tag just out of politeness:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

This is E5M4 we're talking about btw.

 

Each switch is marked with a color, but the color does not represent which key you need; the color represents what the switch does--which colored bars get opened up by the switch.  

 

The level is not broken, because, you need to go down all three pathways of the level, to get all three switches to appear!  But as soon as you see each switch, you can go ahead and hit it, and open up its bars.

 

Now that I think about it, classic doom probably doesn't even let you make key-restricted switches anyway, does it...

 

 

 

Check this out, the first (and only) path I started was the left (which reveals the red switch) Watch what happens after I jump up on the platform. I think it may be a bug. Your logic does make sense tho, you should have to travel each path to reveal each colored switch. And now that I think about it, one of the later levels has a set of red skull bars and you can only open them after having the red skull key. Let me know what you think.

[Kira]

@Welfare Prodigy I don't think you are supposed to use jump with this wad. You'll find that kind of problem with any vanilla-minded map. Since Romero had GZDoom in mind for the "main version" he might have wanted to keep this feature in mind, but as such it isn't anymore an issue than any sequence break you can do on the IWADs.

[funduke]

This replaces the Titlepic, Credit-pic and intermission-screen with a high-res-picture, that i found on John Romeros Twitter-page.

sigiltitle.zip

[Welfare Prodigy]

15 minutes ago, Kira said:

@Welfare Prodigy

That makes sense, I have only gone thru SIGIL so far with Brutal DooM. I'm so used to it, it's like second nature to use it. After getting the yellow skull key and waiting for the door to open to that area you would trip the line to reveal that switch.  

[LadyVader1138]

7 hours ago, Nevander said:

So I'm still sorta avoiding reading every post fully or watching serious gameplay but I can't believe some people. So many seem to be forgetting that all the modern WADs and maps we have these days ARE NOT classic Doom content. Expecting Sigil to be like that is beyond stupid. These people are spoiled hard by modern WADs and have no respect left for the classic design. Makes me very disppointed with that part of the community as a whole.

 

That is all.

I know! Like I said earlier, I've been itching to find really good maps that echo the original Doom level designs and I'm so happy to be getting some made by Romero.

[NightFright]

My review (hopefully avoiding spoilers):

PRO:

+ Visually impressive, even with stock textures

+ Great gameflow (basically impossible to get stuck anywhere, weapon arsenal progress satisfying etc)

+ Also optimized for lower difficulties to satisfy players with rather average skills (no slaughter gameplay)

+ Fantastic soundtrack

+ Atmospheric (often dark, but in a creepy way; many lava caverns that give "hellish" feeling)

+ Satisfying secrets

+ Secret level not too difficult to find (after you figured out how this mission pack works)

CON:

- First four levels actually rather short (approx. 10min playtime)

- Occasionally tight spaces (but still managable)

- Skybox not so pretty

- Some unprecise texture placement here and there

- Episode ending rather anti-climactic (no new boss etc)

- No custom music for episode ending text (just D_VICTOR MIDI music)

VERDICT:

I was afraid this might be another "Thy Flesh Consumed", but I was positively surprised. In ITYTD/HNTR, this is quite possible to beat for me as an average Doom player. I had hoped the episode lasted longer, but for that I guess I would have needed to choose a higher difficulty. In general, it feels exactly the way Romero advertised it: You are in a "deeper pocket" of hell, having to maneuver through dark caverns with the famous lava cracks and big lava lakes. This is a MUCH more enjoyable approach to the hell theme as offered in ep.3 and 4 IMHO. There are not many wide open areas, but I think that also wouldn't be fitting the general theme of the episode. I had a great time with this and will definitely replay the whole thing quite a bit. If Romero is willing to deliver more of this for Doom II, I won't say no.

[pulkmees]

E5M4 and onwards gets tough on UV, that's for sure.

EDIT: Might have been a mistake to do only pistol starts as well.

Edited May 27, 2019 by pulkmees

[unerxai]

On 5/26/2019 at 11:35 AM, Dwaze said:

Cool the mp3's seem to work in Crispy Doom 5.5.2, didn't know that crispy had mp3 support.

I loaded it with -iwad doom.wad -file SIGIL_COMPAT.wad SIGIL_SHREDS_COMPAT.wad

Gonna play it right now.

I'm using the same parameter and I don't get any music on the latest Crispy. Am I missing something?

[Dwaze]

4 minutes ago, UNERXAi said:

I'm using the same parameter and I don't get any music on the latest Crispy. Am I missing something?

Maybe you need to set it to native midi in crispy doom setup. I don't know really

[unerxai]

2 minutes ago, Dwaze said:

Maybe you need to set it to native midi in crispy doom setup. I don't know really

That actually did it

[bioshockfan90]

1 hour ago, pulkmees said:

E5M4 and onwards get tough on UV, that's for sure.

EDIT: Might have been a mistake to do only pistol starts as well.

 

I agree, I'm doing UV pistolstarts and E5M3 alone has kicked my ass so many times. was even 1 monster away from beating it one time before a baron shot me. Oh well, it's entertaining to keep going at it anyway, these maps are pretty damn nice!

[cybdmn]

After forwarding my order, i got my download really fast. Thanks to Romero for that fast reaction, even though i have sent my mail in the very late evening, it must have been after midnight in Ireland.

 

Now i have played the first three maps, on ITYTD for getting a feel for that mapset. I am not the best doom plyer in the world, though not unexperienced for playing it now since more than two decades. On ITYTD these three maps wasn't any challenge, so if anybody have the feeling this mapset ist too hard, he should play on lower dificulty levels. This is far from what Thy Flesh Consumed is on the first maps, regarding difficulty.

 

I like it so far.

[Beezle]

If anyone is in the US and thinking of getting the Soundtrack/Wad, the final price is $7.47 US. I'd highly recommend getting it cuz the soundtrack goes so well with maps in my opinion. But its going to free in a couple days, the wad that is, so just letting anyone who's curious as to actual price know:)