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MsKaye

SIGIL v1.21 - New Romero megawad [released!]

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(Last screen spoiler)

Spoiler

image.png.ed19cddfa0c9ac8ad7a1cfe92be04e19.png

Oh man, what a ride. I liked the puzzle elements, and it was pretty tough, even though I played casually on HMP. Favorite map was probably E3M5. Least favorite was E3M4, that crusher part is the bane of my existence.

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5 hours ago, Fonze said:

 

Mouselook really wasn't a thing like it is in modern ports; there was always the ability to turn left and right with it but vanilla required an extra file (novert) to be able to not move forward and backward with the mouse.

 

That's true, but that movement never bothered me much at the time anyway. I wasn't even aware you could disable it in vanilla.

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Where are people getting the WAD? I thought that it was not released yet, do the backers get it first? Can somebody provide a link please if Romero already uploaded it? I cant find anything in teh site except that it will be available on the 31

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The free release is coming May 31st, but you can pay €6.66 to get it a few days early. The Buckethead backing music WAD is also included with the paid version.

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If I wasn't broke, I would have this by now. I still want to show my support somehow when I do have $$$ but unfortunately I don't think it's going to happen until someone sells on ebay. Even then I won't be directly supporting anyone except someone who bought it.

 

Maybe I'll check out gunman taco truck or whatever it is called.

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So I emailed Brenda Romero about the waiting list for Sigil boxes, and this was the reply:

 

Spoiler

There is a long list on both sides. I suspect that people will end up putting them on eBay at some point, but anything remotely related to id tends to go high. 

 

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7 hours ago, ImpieEyez95 said:

Is anyone looking into creating an animated INTERPIC for this release? @Gifty perhaps... :)? (I think you created the E4 one correct?)

 

I think you're thinking of Skunk, who hasn't been super active in a while (as far as I know), but thanks for thinking of me!

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PRIMUS!!!!!

 

Well, it's midnight here so 3 more days for the rest of us cheapskates!

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John's tweet is actually a bit incorrect, because you can't jump at all in SIGIL. The MAPINFO disables it.

6463878eb55ff062d003e609172561dc.png

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11 minutes ago, dybbuk said:

PRIMUS!!!!!

 

Primus? Like, the band?

 

Since Buckethead did the soundtrack to Sigil, I should probably mention that he was in a supergroup with Les Claypool from Primus (and a couple others) called Colonel Claypool's Bucket of Bernie Brains. Their album The Big Eyeball in the Sky is phenomenal.

 

That is all.

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It's strange to me to see so many people mentioning how tough the mapset is. I pistol started every map on UV and I thought it was pretty tame compared to some of the stuff the community has put out. I died, what, 10 times? I've died double that amount in a single room in some community maps on HMP :P

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1 minute ago, KVELLER said:

It's strange to me to see so many people mentioning how tough the mapset is. I pistol started every map on UV and I thought it was pretty tame compared to some of the stuff the community has put out. I died, what, 10 times? I've died double that amount in a single room in some community maps on HMP :P

At least it doesn't have Hell Beneath.

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Can people really not play Doom without free-look anymore? I mean, i guess it's understandable due to every modern game using it (hell Quake had a way to enable it in '96) but to me free-look just makes Doom even easier, not to mention that it breaks the balance in a lot of older maps since they weren't designed with it in mind. Since i prefer to use the Software renderer i can't stand the Y-shearing effect that happens when looking up/down so i usually always play without free-look enabled and use horizontal look only/auto-aim at the stock 35 unless a map otherwise states the need for it.

 

Now keyboard controls are something that i just cannot do. I've tried haha! I give total props to people who still play Doom like that.

 

Now, although i do believe that a map should be played the way a mapper intended it to be played, i also believe that everyone should have fun and play Doom the way they want to, so i am really contradicting myself here in a way ;)

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1 hour ago, JayKayFour said:

John's tweet is actually a bit incorrect, because you can't jump at all in SIGIL. The MAPINFO disables it.

6463878eb55ff062d003e609172561dc.png

Isn't there an option to force jumping to be allowed in GZDoom?

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it should be even easier: just use compat wad. it should replace E3, and i think that it doesn't have any mapinfo.

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Alright so I picked up the digital download of SIGIL yesterday and finally gave it run and uh... I didn't like it. Like at all.

I love that SIGIL is an Ultimate Doom wad with vanilla textures (we need more of those) but man I found that there were too many instances of plinking away at caco hordes and barons with the pump shotgun on top of hilariously narrow ledges. I get that restricting movement and resources are valid ways of challenging the player (No End in Sight and Nihility do this and I love those wads), but I found SIGIL to be so stingy and cramped that it made me want to tear my hair out. And with so little resources, I found myself using the pistol to kill cacos and barons. All the while Buckethead's completely out of place soundtrack grated my ears and annoyed the shit out of me.

 

Also in my eyes SIGIL doesn't look all that great. There's an oddly substantial number of boring right angles, kinda bland architecture, and sometimes a lack of texture variety on large walls. I don't mean to say it's ugly (I did like the room where the cacos rose out of the hellcrack), but it's not especially pretty or memorable and I never really found myself ever taking in the atmosphere or architecture. And if SIGIL is going for that old school Doom look, wads like the aforementioned NEIS and Nihility do it better while being vanilla compatible.

 

If there's anything I'll concede about SIGIL, I'm glad the levels were on the smaller side and that they never had more than about 150 monsters. Which means that most of the levels were only unenjoyable and not unenjoyable slogs.

 

If you guys want to say I have bad taste or something go ahead but I really wanted to like SIGIL. I'm glad I got to support Romero and send him a few bucks, he's done a lot for the community post-Doom II but man I couldn't help but dislike it. Maybe I'm just a shitty idiotic Doomer who should've lowered the difficulty and I'll admit that but man I wish I could've enjoyed the wad as much as most of the rest of you guys did.

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SIGIL is John Romero's tribute to The Chasm and if y'all can't appreciate such a genuine show of respect then I dunno what to tell you

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43 minutes ago, chowbar said:

Alright so I picked up the digital download of SIGIL yesterday and finally gave it run and uh... I didn't like it. Like at all.

I love that SIGIL is an Ultimate Doom wad with vanilla textures (we need more of those) but man I found that there were too many instances of plinking away at caco hordes and barons with the pump shotgun on top of hilariously narrow ledges. I get that restricting movement and resources are valid ways of challenging the player (No End in Sight and Nihility do this and I love those wads), but I found SIGIL to be so stingy and cramped that it made me want to tear my hair out. And with so little resources, I found myself using the pistol to kill cacos and barons. All the while Buckethead's completely out of place soundtrack grated my ears and annoyed the shit out of me.

 

Also in my eyes SIGIL doesn't look all that great. There's an oddly substantial number of boring right angles, kinda bland architecture, and sometimes a lack of texture variety on large walls. I don't mean to say it's ugly (I did like the room where the cacos rose out of the hellcrack), but it's not especially pretty or memorable and I never really found myself ever taking in the atmosphere or architecture. And if SIGIL is going for that old school Doom look, wads like the aforementioned NEIS and Nihility do it better while being vanilla compatible.

 

If there's anything I'll concede about SIGIL, I'm glad the levels were on the smaller side and that they never had more than about 150 monsters. Which means that most of the levels were only unenjoyable and not unenjoyable slogs.

 

If you guys want to say I have bad taste or something go ahead but I really wanted to like SIGIL. I'm glad I got to support Romero and send him a few bucks, he's done a lot for the community post-Doom II but man I couldn't help but dislike it. Maybe I'm just a shitty idiotic Doomer who should've lowered the difficulty and I'll admit that but man I wish I could've enjoyed the wad as much as most of the rest of you guys did.

 

Well, i do agree most of your points.

 

The level design is quite decent even though those cramped space can be frustrating at times. It is still managable.

 

I swear to god. The amount ammunition in this game is going to be the end of me. Even with secret areas, those Barons and Caco demons are eating my shells and bullets like it was Taco tuesday. Maybe i'm bad at managing resources or just plain bad at aiming.

 

The music... Is kinda okay, i guess? I mean, it's not too bad but not that good either.

 

That be done and said.

SIGIL is quite decent. Nothing much to say about it.

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6 minutes ago, Raito said:

I swear to god. The amount ammunition in this game is going to be the end of me. Even with secret areas, those Barons and Caco demons are eating my shells and bullets like it was Taco tuesday. Maybe i'm bad at managing resources or just plain bad at aiming.

The harder UDoom levels tend to incentivize infight or crowd management to make the most out of your rockets. Maybe it's the same here.

 

Curious what I will think once I get my hands on it. I'm more of a run'n gun kind of player though I enjoy Chord-style gameplay once in a while.

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1 hour ago, chowbar said:

Alright so I picked up the digital download of SIGIL yesterday and finally gave it run and uh... I didn't like it. Like at all.

I love that SIGIL is an Ultimate Doom wad with vanilla textures (we need more of those) but man I found that there were too many instances of plinking away at caco hordes and barons with the pump shotgun on top of hilariously narrow ledges

Only the first Baron encounter requires scavenging for ammo (or save up Chaingun ammoz), after that you get Rox and then Chainsaw. All my encounters after the first I busted out the Rox for Barons then once I got the Chainsaw I could conserve ammo by killing the occasional Caco and Pinky with it. Those secret stashes of ammo help of course.

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2 minutes ago, Kira said:

The harder UDoom levels tend to incentivize infight or crowd management to make the most out of your rockets. Maybe it's the same here.

 

Curious what I will think once I get my hands on it. I'm more of a run'n gun kind of player though I enjoy Chord-style gameplay once in a while.

 

Speaking of Run n' Gun tactic. I tried that tactic before. Due to how the levels are designed, using this tactic are quite hard to pull off.

 

You can try at least. See where it takes you.

 

Good luck.

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I couldn't resist and bought a digital copy today and completed first 4 maps already on UV. Here's my impressions so far:

 

-A lot of tight spaces and I like it because it is pretty much the antithesis of Doom 2016.

-Many situations where it is much better to run than try to kill every monster, could teach something new for some less experienced players.

-Very limited ammo but I like it because it makes you focus on managing the monsters, not slaughtering every single one of them.

-Some spectre and lost based soul trolling going on here and there, I hate both of them but I think they have been used very well so far, atleast there won't be any pain elementals around.

-Seems to designed around the things that make classic vanilla Doom unique, will be probably horrible to play with Brutal Doom or other mods like that, very positive thing I feel.

 

As for the mouselookgate, I can see why some people like it. When I first got back to Doom by discovering Doom Legacy so many years ago, it was pretty amazing to play Doom like it was modern first person shooter. But couple of years ago I decided to give the classic doom aiming mechanics another chance and fell in love with them. They just feel more unique and different from any more modern shooter and the original engine and the gameplay was designed for and around that mechanic. I personally can use both depending on the situation and I think every serious Doom player should be able to switch easily between these two styles based on what mods or maps they are playing.

 

Also certain people should learn some respect, so shameful pirating something that can be bought for almost nothing right now and will be free to download just in few days. Why no respect for Romero?

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Interesting one.  I enjoyed it.   Other than a sliiiight overuse of barons, I found the gameplay excellent.  The encounter setups and constrained space kept up the sense of danger despite Doom 1's tame cast. For anyone complaining about the tight play areas, consider for a moment that in Doom1, in a medium sized room, in a non-slaughter context, the shotgun guy is the most dangerous non-boss enemy for a player that can strafe.  The ammo/health balance was vice-tight for me on UV, near-perfect.

 

Except that I imagine it'd be bloody annoying from pistol start. By a few levels in on continuous I always had enough rockets to pre-chew the Barons, I think it'd have been much less fun without that luxury. 

 

The signature Romero abstraction of the levels extended from the architecture itself to the high-contrast lighting and sort of impressionistic style. It's about the overall rather than details such as alignment or realistic light. I personally really liked it. That said, given my diet of mostly modern-ish wads the amount of misalignment and places you could get stuck were surprising -- a bit more polish would not have gone amiss.

 

Spoiler

- Fuck the crusher maze on 4th level. The one gameplay experiment that was an out-and-out failure for me  The first part is OK (look at the light on the floor), the second part is OK (go between the safe zones, they're all close to eachother), but the bloody last part with a patchwork of ceilings moving at different speeds, such a drag.

- I thought the use of Cyberdemons was brilliant.  All of the danger but with none of the grind or potential ammo glut.

- The last map was a massive letdown. We need an E3M8b!

 

Initial favourite maps were E3M2/E3M5. E3M2 had an interesting layout and a great mechanic with the teleports. E3M5 was so gloomy and atmospheric, and you really feel the pressure with the damaging floor and those cybers.

 

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I'm probably the only stubborn ~~purist~~ here, but I tried playing this with Chocolate Doom and even with John's instructions in the readme (loading Sigil_compat.wad) I get a visplane limit crash in the first room.

 

Time to open up the old gzDoom I suppose.

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6 minutes ago, MrSkeltal said:

I'm probably the only stubborn ~~purist~~ here, but I tried playing this with Chocolate Doom and even with John's instructions in the readme (loading Sigil_compat.wad) I get a visplane limit crash in the first room. 

Well yes, it's limit-removing.

 

It should work just fine in Crispy Doom, which is basically the limit-removing version of Choco, so you could try that.

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