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Linguica

Sandy Petersen interview I had never noticed before

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Really interesting read. Some spicy info in there for sure. Who poisoned American???

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That was really interesting! Thanks for finding and sharing it Linguica. Always crazy to hear new information surface from the old id days.

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19 minutes ago, Linguica said:

I swear in the past I have seen Romero claim that E3M6 was the first map Sandy made for Doom

To be fair, sandy has also mistaken his first map as e3m6 too in another interview
 

Spoiler

 

 

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I have a recollection of Mr Petersen's first map being E2M7 for some reason, but I can't for the life of me remember why I thought that.

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Posted (edited)

Pretty interesting read, particularly the part about Tom Hall. I always wondered why silver was so present in his levels, thought he just liked it or had something very specific in mind. According to Sandy he only had that texture lol. 

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really interesting interview! nice to see so much candid talk about Doom and id, even if it isn't all super flattering. i still get annoyed when i think about how they threw Tom Hall under the bus during the making of D1, but it kinda is not surprising for a bunch of relatively immature guys in their 20's to not be forthright communicators. lol. it's possible that Romero was under the influence of Carmack when he said that designers were bad and they needed more artists and then changed his course and made some amends after leaving id after Quake 1. you can sort of tell that Sandy probably isn't exaggerating anything very much in here because the info is mostly too weirdly specific to lie about. although him saying E3M6 in a video interview was his first level instead of E2M6 in this interview is a little weird. but he also could have easily just said it wrong.

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Considering two people so far have confused E2M6 with E3M6, they could've at some point shuffled the level slots around.

 

And note that Petersen said "level-making engine", he's likely referring to the level editor as the thing he kept breaking.

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16 minutes ago, Jaxxoon R said:

Considering two people so far have confused E2M6 with E3M6, they could've at some point shuffled the level slots around.

 

And note that Petersen said "level-making engine", he's likely referring to the level editor as the thing he kept breaking.

 

Actually, episodes 2 and 3 were switched around before release so this makes sense.

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Just mentioning this for further reference, this interview was originally published on December 4, 2017. I would like to assume they make articles public a year after they're published, but who knows, really.

 

Sandy confirming that he put the torn Baron corpses in E2M8 intentionally to tell the player something big was coming is amazing. He definitely got the reaction he wanted from some players at the time.

 

That bit about him naming all the levels in Doom 2 just further adds fuel to that (yet to be debunked or confirmed) factoid about MAP21.

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29 minutes ago, IMX said:

That bit about him naming all the levels in Doom 2 just further adds fuel to that (yet to be debunked or confirmed) factoid about MAP21.

 

Sandy Petersen didn't know who Trent Reznor or Nine Inch Nails were in 1995, and he thought his coworkers talking about "hash" was about a mixture of chopped meat, potatoes and spices, but you think he intentionally named Map21 "Nirvana" because you start with a SSG sitting in front of you and he was making a weird and very abstract reference to Kurt Cobain committing suicide? Instead of drawing on his well of knowledge about religions and religious iconography? If anything this confirms that weird dumb theory was, in fact, weird and dumb.

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He put the face of Jesus on a floor button as his texture. I went to him and said, "John?" He said, "Yeah, what's up?" I said, "Look, you know I haven't been all [uptight] about 'We can't be satanic, we have to be good,' but this button that you have to press before you lower the bridge?" He said, "Yeah?" I said, "Probably let's not make our players step on the face of Jesus to lower a bridge." And he goes, "Oh! Good call," and we switched it to a demon face.

 

I wonder how the public would've reacted to that.

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Yes. I like to let players know what's in store for them. I telegraph things. I think that's more fun for the player. Also, you get that in E1M8, which is one of the two levels I did for Episode 1. You start off and see the barrels below, with all the demons around, and if you hit the barrels just right, you can [explode] all the demons.

That's the first I've heard of Sandy doing more than one level in E1. E1M4 was a map started by Tom Hall so it would make sense that Sandy would have finished that map as well, even though it's long been credited to Romero for finishing it.

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Yeah, I was constantly breaking their level-making engine. That always made John Carmack mad. He wanted things to be smaller, lighter, easier to handle. He always cared about speed of programming, and I was making these sprawling levels that went all over the place.

 

That sure as hell sounds like John alright. Reading this made me instantly think of Doom 3's design.

 

I like knowing that both Romero and Peterson had an iterative design process. They'd just start making a section of a level, play it, add a section, play it, etc etc and eventually decide "Yeah, thats a good enough length. Onto the next level" I like to plan my levels out ahead of time to let myself think up encounters and areas for a longer period.

 

Thanks for posting this, Ling. It was an enjoyable read!

Edited by wheresthebeef

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15 hours ago, Linguica said:

Sounds similar to what people would say about Steve Jobs...

...

If there is one thing I think we can take away from this, it's that Sandy Petersen does not have hugely fond memories of working at id Software at the time.

 

 

 

Seems pretty understandable to me. I was always under the impression, that inside id always there were always strong tensions, and many ego wars happened. Tom Hall fired, and "kremlined out" of the books, like mentioned by Sandy. A thing also mentioned in these Coop with Bobby Prince videos posted here some time ago here. Bobby said there too, that Tom Halls influence on Doom is underestimated. Look how Romero was kicked out, and Paul Steed fired in retaliation in the Doom 3 internal discussion. And finally the drop out of Adrian Carmack.

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thank you a lot for the find and editing, read through it completely what I seldom do. sandys 01 08 13 and especially 27 are my alltime favorite maps. I was surprised when I first checked who made the levels that my favorite ones were all done by sandy and not romero. fascinating to read about the story telling. one can clearly see in 27 that he liked to lure you in with an item which releases monsters as soon as you get it (in almost all rooms you have it). you find this in 08 and 13 too. Of course other mappers did this too, but I think not to that extend.

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12 hours ago, Jaxxoon R said:

And note that Petersen said "level-making engine", he's likely referring to the level editor as the thing he kept breaking.

Their editor, DoomEd, was created by Romero. But it sounds likely that DoomBSP, that compiled the text-format output of DoomEd into the WAD file was created and/or maintaned by Carmack. That way he could have just added or modified the output to his needs without having to touch the map's source file.

 

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19 hours ago, Linguica said:

"Don't use silver, it's overused." I'd say, "Dude this game isn't even out yet. It's overused because you saw a lot of it in Tom's early levels." They didn't really get that.

 

Yes, good. Use Brown! Much better!

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11 hours ago, Marcaek said:

avoid the 'toid

Forget that - avoid the "fact." It's only a fact when it's proven true.

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Great find. It never ceases to amaze me that we're still finding gems like this after 25 years. Sandy's map designs can be controversial, but when you examine them in context of who he is, his philosophy on design, they have a whole new appeal. If nothing else, he seems like a nice, chill guy. Sometimes, I think he gets a bad rap in how history remembers him, so I'm glad when stuff like this comes to light.

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On 1/3/2019 at 8:06 PM, IMX said:

That's why I said factoid.

A factoid is a trivial or irrelevant fact. The word for the Nirvana story is "bullshit".

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1 hour ago, termrork said:

maybe some also missed this interview: very interesting details about doom2 maps

https://donanimgunlugu.com/efsane-sandy-petersen-ile-roportaj-192559/2

I thought Doom 3 was abysmal and was glad that it led to the demotion of my former co-workers who masterminded it. I have not extensively played Doom 2016, but what little I’ve seen looks pretty great.

 

Damn, Peterson not holding back!

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