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Man of Doom

If Doom 3 were to be completely remade...

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So in light of the RE2 remake and how well it's been received, it actually gave me something of a hypothetical idea:

What if Doom 3 got remade? I don't mean the BFG Edition, I mean a remake that's pretty much built from the ground up with updated gameplay, additional content, and spanking new visuals in id Tech 7/8.

 

Ok, I already know what you're thinking: but we already have Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal, plus Doom 3 is the red-headed stepchild of the Doom franchise, so why the hell would Doom 3 ever be remade?
Just give me a minute to hear me out.

 

Namely, there really isn't going to be another game that is quite going to have the fusion of science fiction and Lovecraftian horror of Doom 3, especially with its art direction. While it more or less strived to be a more realistic and grounded take on "demons have invaded a research facility on Mars," it's art direction seems to have taken quite a lot of influence from cyberpunk works and possibly even anime (ranging from the Pistol's design which was obviously meant to evoke Deckard's blaster from Blade Runner to the designs of the marines' body armor which actually look like something you'd expect to see in GitS).

Plus, we have "The Making of Doom 3" which implied that there was actually a metric ton of interesting ideas for the game that were ultimately left on the cutting room floor (such as having to assemble the Soulcube which originally came in pieces, plus each piece would send the player flashbacks to the Martian civilization), as well as a ton of concept art that featured some very interesting ideas for demons (which ranged from humans being fused to robots in grotesque fashions to demonic swordsmen to the Mancubus having genitalia).

 

If Doom 3 were to get remade, not only would there be the opportunity to expand upon those unused concepts, there could actually be a chance to improve upon what already exists in the game and turn a perfectly solid horror shooter into a potentially excellent entry in the Doom series. Besides, with an opportunity for a remake, it could very well become its own game instead of trying to compete in the shadow of the times (like trying to compete with Half-Life 2). Plus, OG Doom was originally (but debatably) a horror-action game in its own right, and John Carmack believed that Doom was less of a guns-blazing action fest and more of a subdued horror-action hybrid akin to something like RE4. Thus, Doom 3 was a "reimagining" of what was interpreted as a sort of horror game.

 

In fact, part of what made the RE2 remake so successful was that it not only kept true to its survival horror roots, it did so in ways that felt surprisingly fresh (such as actually making zombies threats). Additionally, the storytelling managed to feel much more natural and the changes made felt suitable (ranging from characterization to how events flowed). If RE2 were to be remade that way, why not Doom 3?

That being said, there would be some major caveats to go with this:

- If Doom 3 were to be remade, it should probably be handled by another Bethesda developer such as Machinegames. id Software is already back to making magic with the likes of D2016 and DE, so why interrupt the flow?

- In terms of story, while there would be more reasonable characterizations, it would most likely be a hell of a lot darker (even darker than what was already in the original game). Think @Impie's The Plutonia Experiment novella series, which has way more of an emphasis on the psychological and visceral horror as well as a virtually nihilistic tone. For example, think of trying to get to a scientist on the other side of a door who has a key card only for the door to suddenly malfunction as you're trying to pry it open, or finding out that the last surviving member of Bravo Team had decided to eat the business end of his shotgun because an Imp has descended upon him and he's lost too much blood.

-In terms of visuals, it would likely be much more varied in terms of both color scheme and locales (both on Mars and Hell). For example, Mars City would be far closer to an actual "city" much like the leaked 2002 E3 alpha, and while Hell would be mostly unchanged, it would be how the visuals are presented that would be a major difference. Due to the graphical updates, just about everything is going to look more visceral and that much more horrifying (instead of having "KILL" and "DIE" etched all over the walls, there could be etchings in an unknown alien language).

-In terms of gameplay, it would probably be closer to something like a hybrid between D3: Phobos and the Machinegames Wolf titles, with faster gameplay, albeit with less ammunition to go around and the enemies being far more dangerous.

 

If I were in charge of what to change, here are some things that would be good to change:
-Definitely give a more satisfying sense of gunplay to each of the weapons, and visual redesigning would be nice. For example, the shotgun would no longer be a glorified melee weapon and probably wouldn't look like somebody's D- art project.

-Add in the possibility of melee takedowns to deal with the lack of ammo, mostly for cannon fodder such as zombies.

-In the Doom 3 novels, it was mentioned that as time progressed, zombies would not only be faster and stronger, but gain claws, jaws, and other demonic appendages (akin to Crimson Heads); it'd be nice to face these zombies as the game progressed.

-As an example of characterization, instead of having Betruger going "MUAHAHAHAHA" every five seconds, it would probably be more reasonable for him to be this overworked head of research who has been nothing but driven to the teleportation experiments while developing a sense of resentment against the UAC's top brass, only for him to be driven to sheer insanity by the time all hell breaks loose. He could be like an Expy of Dr. Weir from Event Horizon, I guess. "Hell is just a word. The reality is much worse."

-I would most definitely include the versions of the classic monsters that never made it into the final cut such as the Arachnotron, Pain Elemental, and possibly even the Spider Mastermind.

-Have these gruesome death animations that would apply to the player that ensures that he's careful with what he's doing, as one false move can lead to a Pinky feasting on his intestines, an Imp ripping out his throat with its teeth, or his face getting smashed in with a Commando's boot heel after giving him a compound fracture on one of his arms.

-Update the appearances of the demons so that they no longer look like these grey Xenomorph ripoffs. For example, the Imp should regain its spikes, and possibly even give horns to monsters such as the Cacodemon; additionally, update or even change the behavior so that for example, the Revenant will run to the player and try to punch and scratch him, or that the Maggot would be an acid-spewing demon.

 

Again, I know that a remake of Doom 3 would be something that almost nobody asked for, but I just thought it might've been a nice idea to think about. I just thought that had it really came into its own with more original ideas instead of competing with what is considered to be one of the best games ever made, then it probably wouldn't have been this hotly contested entry in the franchise. Anyway, what would others think of the possibility of a hypothetical remake?

 

EDIT:

Forgot a couple of things to add in this remake:

-Teleporting enemies would just be scrapped completely. There’s plenty of vents and crevices that demons could just crawl out of, and there’s nothing more anticlimactic than an Imp spawning in only to be slapped in the face with a shotgun blast. 

-IMPROVE THE GORE. While not quite to the borderline cartoonish levels of D2016 or DE, perhaps something more realistic like The New Colossus? It shouldn’t be limited to the zombies either; I’d like to see an Imp’s rib cage bursting open after a well-placed shotgun blast. 

-As a potential replacement to disintegrating corpses, perhaps have more unique death animations for particular enemies (the Cacodemon exploding in a flash of lightning and gore, the Maggot dissolving in its own acid, the Mancubus’s/Bruiser’s flamethrowers malfunctioning only for its body to explode akin to the 2016 Mancubus, the Cherub melting away after dying leaving behind a bloody pile of bone and guts, the Arch-Vile burning itself into a charred corpse, you get the idea).

Edited by Man of Doom

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1 hour ago, Man of Doom said:

Namely, there really isn't going to be another game that is quite going to have the fusion of science fiction and Lovecraftian horror of Doom 3, especially with its art direction.

Quake still already did that better, also adding in the "ridiculously ancient civilizations" and "incomprehensible alien entities" part that Doom 3 eschewed for a more generic Quake 2 sci-fi monster route. All Doom 3 was, was a virtual haunted house attraction with a Quake 4 theme.

 

That said, my biggest complaints outside of that, were the shit arsenal, and the shit story. The idea of being transferred to mars as a glorified mall cop, only to find yourself in the middle of a demonic holocaust is very cool. When Doom 3 added the megalomaniacal scientist stereotype, it sucked the coolness right out of it. When I wrote my books, I went out of my way to avoid that in favor of more interesting human villain ideas, like the overly religious security captain oppressing a colony of survivors, or the friend who was a puppet of the demons the whole time so she could keep the remaining survivors separated, or the UAC mailing human and tech sacrifices to the demons in exchange for a monopoly on supernatural wonders. Mad scientist bent on galactic domination is as boring and cliche as it gets.

 

Basically Doom 4 really is what Doom 3 should have been in the first place. If it were me, I'd probably use a story similar to what I already wrote, as mentioned above. In this case, I'd probably use one I haven't written in detail yet: a handful of military characters holed up in a sorority house on demon occupied earth, making their way to an evacuation point while contemplating cannibalism as their supplies dwindle. Would you rather have that or yet another world dominating/destroying scientist?

 

I'd also chuck half the fucking arsenal, and make sure whatever was left was worth a shit. Better-looking shotgun that isn't unnecessarily space-age in design, for one. Firearms are a "matured technology", meaning any firearms we develop in the far future will still greatly resemble what we have now. The space-age looking shit would be reserved for the unconventional arms. In Doom 3's case, I'd also remove the pistol and machine gun, make the rocket launcher more like an RPG-7 and give it a lot more punch, and spruce up the BFG so it doesn't feel so nerfed. Oh, and that pump shotgun wouldn't be able to miss the target at POINT BLANK RANGE. In other words, no need for more than one machine gun, nor any weapon that's out-performed by a fucking flashlight.

 

Also the level aesthetic would be overhauled so every section doesn't look exactly the same, and would allow for more nonlinear exploration like classic doom. Even if there couldn't be nearly as many enemies onscreen at once, at least the maps would be fun to move around in and explore, and not be the space station equivalent to a fucking office building. Also, WAY more excursions on the martian surface -- as in, entire maps dedicated to it. You'd even get to drive mars rovers in a few areas. The map design overall would balance creeping dread atmosphere and sudden bursts of lead-spewing panic.

 

The System Shock gimmick of picking up PDA's to further the story, I'd be torn about. I'd be half-tempted to tell the story with whatever you witness in the level itself.

 

EDIT: Oh yeah, monsters would be overhauled too, so they aren't useless or redundant. Same treatment as the guns. And they wouldn't have a fifty-phase spawn sequence giving you days to prepare yourself for a fight that ends execution style while the monster is still doing its intro animation.

Edited by Impie

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Make it like Doom 64 with more modern mechanics and better story, basically.

 

EDIT: Also, better gunplay. Doom 3's gunplay is terrible.

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37 minutes ago, hardcore_gamer said:

Make it like Doom 64 with more modern mechanics and better story, basically.

 

EDIT: Also, better gunplay. Doom 3's gunplay is terrible.

Or this. In fact, I'd like to change my answer.

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You can only have a masterpiece once. I would love to see another game like Doom 3 out there, but Doom now it's about "yeah, brutal, yeah, fatality, awesome, f*ck yeah" so that would be impossible.

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1 hour ago, Doommarine_maxi said:

You can only have a masterpiece once. I would love to see another game like Doom 3 out there, but Doom now it's about "yeah, brutal, yeah, fatality, awesome, f*ck yeah" so that would be impossible.

Doom literally was only a "shoot everything" mechanically wise, I'm not gonna waste my text since people have made threads about it in the past, but the point is: Doom was always a action with horror game (or horror with action, which ever floats your boat) and you only have to see how Romero was toting about the game back in 1993 about how dark (the levels were), and edgy it was.

In terms of overhauling Doom 3, I believe that everyone making giant attention posts about what they would do (which wouldn't matter anyway) are completely missing the point of Doom 3: It's another John Carmack Tech Demo.

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On 2/8/2019 at 12:15 AM, XLightningStormL said:

In terms of overhauling Doom 3, I believe that everyone making giant attention posts about what they would do (which wouldn't matter anyway) are completely missing the point of Doom 3: It's another John Carmack Tech Demo.

I believe you're missing the point of the thread by calling the people who contribute to it attention whores, but whatever.

 

Being meant as a tech demo doesn't excuse a game from criticism. Shadow of the Beast was mainly meant as a tech demo on the Amiga. As a game it was utter shit, and it deserves whatever criticism it gets so people learn not to release a half-baked game just to show off their code.

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Posted (edited)
On 2/8/2019 at 2:15 AM, XLightningStormL said:

In terms of overhauling Doom 3, I believe that everyone making giant attention posts about what they would do (which wouldn't matter anyway) are completely missing the point of Doom 3: It's another John Carmack Tech Demo.

By that definition, pretty much every main id Tech game has been "another John Carmack Tech Demo" up until he left during id Tech 6's development (for Doom 2016; Doom Eternal/id Tech 7 will be the first one totally Carmack-less).

 

It just so happens that Doom 3/id Tech 4 was the first one where what the tech's strengths were, weren't the sort of gameplay associated with that brand. Nothing was wrong with the tech - it was actually quite good for its time, and it basically ended a whole generation of non-DX9-compliant GPUs (save for one or two like the GeForce 4 MX, which got reluctantly supported by Carmack).

 

Their mistake wasn't in making a scary game, their mistake was in using Doom for that, because Doom had horror as a secondary focus to getting demons the hot bullets of shotgun to die.

 

It's why I said, if they would've called it something different and tweaked some things, the game could've actually done really well. But making it a DOOM game was a big mistake. People expected something other than what they got, and id got a bloodied nose that, along with a large-scale push from Epic (via their upcoming Unreal Engine 3 a few years later), id never recovered from.

Edited by Dark Pulse

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4 hours ago, Dark Pulse said:

Stuff

Doom mainline games, spin-offs are fine to go in horror, or whatever.

Wouldn't say that Doom has horror and atmosphere last to mechanical gameplay, but I would say it's intertwined enough, otherwise we'd have 192-bright rooms of nothing but monsters, pickups, and barrels. Doom being "just muh violence" was a meme put forth by edgy 14 year olds, casuals, non-observers, 90s soccer mothers, people with poor memory and a Brazilian modder that loved the horrendous Doom comic too much. That, and the weak computer systems at the time, and iD's philosophy on putting DooM on as much hardware and software as possible.

 

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5 hours ago, XLightningStormL said:

Doom mainline games, spin-offs are fine to go in horror, or whatever.

Wouldn't say that Doom has horror and atmosphere last to mechanical gameplay, but I would say it's intertwined enough, otherwise we'd have 192-bright rooms of nothing but monsters, pickups, and barrels. Doom being "just muh violence" was a meme put forth by edgy 14 year olds, casuals, non-observers, 90s soccer mothers, people with poor memory and a Brazilian modder that loved the horrendous Doom comic too much. That, and the weak computer systems at the time, and iD's philosophy on putting DooM on as much hardware and software as possible.

 

The horror definitely is secondary though, as evidenced by getting rid of "slower" stuff that was in Tom Hall's vision/the Doom Bible. Like, it was definitely made for atmosphere and to make you dread stuff quite a bit (also helped that it allowed the new shininess of Carmack's engine to shine), but it was never quite to the level Doom 3 emphasized it, and it was definitely more adrenaline horror than outright horror.

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