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Raquelas

it's just my theory, but the demons in the classic doom was more like nomadic tribes?

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Hi I've played doom and doom2 and beat it several times. Although at that time I didn't mind it that much, but looking back Doom's hell is quite bizarre in its own sense actually.

 

Uh, I thought the hell is supposed to be the home of demons. The reason why they're trying to invade earth is meant for expanding their territory.

 

However in Doom2, unlike doom1, you can actually reach to the hell, where the demons are came from, or they're supposed to be living there. But as you also know it doesn't actually feel like "city of demons" but rather more like ruins of catastrophic civil war.

 

And even more, where Icon of Sin was creating demons(I think that's the only place where demons are newly reinforced), that place is supposed to be the heart land of hell itself, should be guarded with enough force. But there are no giant walls, and no such darkmagic-or-whatever complicated defense system is protecting its capital.

 

I'm actually wondering, if they're trying to campaign on the earth, then why wouldn't demons carefully plan for defending their own cities as well?

 

Or maybe demons are just trying to sack, killing, taking everything wherever they're going, and that's just all? Like, they're abandoned flaming wasteland from the very beginning? Maybe the hell itself doesn't have that much value for demons?

 

It's just my theory but more and more I'm thinking of it, it's quite intriguing. And also it gives simmilar impressions of ancient barbarians.

Edited by Raquelas

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On 3/28/2019 at 3:05 PM, Raquelas said:

Hi I've played doom and doom2 and beat it several times. Although at that time I didn't mind it that much, but looking back Doom's hell is quite bizarre in its own sense actually.

 

Uh, I thought the hell is supposed to be the home of demons. The reason why they're trying to invade earth is meant for expanding their territory.

 

However in Doom2, unlike doom1, you can actually reach to the hell, where the demons are came from, or they're supposed to be living there. But as you also know it doesn't actually feel like "city of demons" but rather more like ruins of catastrophic civil war.

 

And even more, where Icon of Sin was creating demons(I think that's the only place where demons are newly reinforced), that place is supposed to be the heart land of hell itself, should be guarded with enough force. But there are no giant walls, and no such darkmagic-or-whatever complicated defense system is protecting its capital.

 

I'm actually wondering, if they're trying to campaign on the earth, then why wouldn't demons carefully plan for defending their own cities as well?

 

Or maybe demons are just trying to sack, killing, taking everything wherever they're going, and that's just all? Like, they're abandoned flaming wasteland from the very beginning? Maybe the hell itself doesn't have that much value for demons?

 

It's just my theory but more and more I'm thinking of it, it's quite intriguing. And also it gives simmilar impressions of ancient barbarians.

It depends on how demons define "living". All they seem to do is kill and make weird modern art pieces out of humans. I figured they ate each other if needed, slept wherever and waited for a stronger demon to give them orders. But fair point.

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It's really common to belittle your enemies and call them primitive monsters like in Doom.

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Kind of with @DooM_RO here. To quote Doom 2016: 

"They are rage, brutal, without mercy..."

Which is to say; they are malice incarnate. They are not "conquering for territory" in the sense that people take territory. Hell doesn't "need" the mortal realm. It wants it for no other reason than to despoil it. 


Also; Hell didn't -need- strategy, or defense. Doomguy was a bit of a wild card in that he somehow managed to just BARGE INTO HELL. This is -not- something that normally happens. It is, in fact, unprecedented in the Doom universe. Heck, this is the guy who Hell actually spat back out in the first game because he was too tough to contain. And then who promptly decided to keep sitting in hell after the Mother Demon fiasco... 

 

In other words; Hell didn't have more defenses than it had because until Doomguy, they simply did not need it. 

 

With all that said... I don't know, Hell seemed pretty well defended in Doom 2 and Doom 64, with it's labrynthian passages, shitton of forces (augmented by hell forged cybernetics!), traps, and just terrible hazards in general (acidic mud, acid rivers, lava rivers, tiny walkways, etc). 

 

There is an element of truth to the whole tribal thing though. I mean, they do in-fight if they see one of their buddies being shot up by a rival fiend... 

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I kind of agree. Doom is my favorite game off all time, but some of the levels are a bit of a disappointment. Especially Dis. Now when I picture the name Dis, I envision the City of Dis from Dante's inferno, not a wall shaped as a star. The lack of structures make the demons look like primitive barbarians, not some advanced species with interdimensional travel.

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1 minute ago, Doomguy-1993 said:

I kind of agree. Doom is my favorite game off all time, but some of the levels are a bit of a disappointment. Especially Dis. Now when I picture the name Dis, I envision the City of Dis from Dante's inferno, not a wall shaped as a star. The lack of structures make the demons look like primitive barbarians, not some advanced species with interdimensional travel.

 

But are the demons even  a life form? They're of the spirit world, and very much the incarnation of all that is cruel, hateful and destructive. They're not really the same thing as E.T by definition. Part of the charm of the Doom universe (for me at least) has always been the UAC's uphill battle to try and "science/ reason" the demons, while struggling to accept the fact that Hell and its denizens supersede all their logic.

... well, until they invent the BFG. Then Hell's arguments are all invalid. SCIENCE B****s!!!!

 

Ekhm...anyhow... demons in general don't really neccessarily have the same 'needs' as people. They don't need to sleep, it's questionable if they need to eat to survive, or if they simply do it as a matter of enjoyment/ malice, they don't need comfy chairs, and up until Doom 2016, almost never directly talked to anyone. They are unknowable in that sense, which makes them a wonderful foe. 

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6 hours ago, Taurus Daggerknight said:

Which is to say; they are malice incarnate. They are not "conquering for territory" in the sense that people take territory. Hell doesn't "need" the mortal realm. It wants it for no other reason than to despoil it. 

As I said, we're just excusing ourselves by using absolute words to demonize (get it?) our nomadic enemies. Pretty sure this has been a really common war tactic, bordering on absolute racism.

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I think it was Masters of Doom that said something along the lines on how a D&D session at the Id offices ending in demons overrunning the world was a sort of eureka moment for the idea that would eventually result in Doom. Combining that with how much love and effort the old Id team had put into playing and making their campaign makes it easy to see the massive parallels between the Demons of Doom's Hell, and the chaotic evil creatures in D&D.

 

To be more specific, I always felt that Doom's demons are a pretty classical embodiment of chaotic evil; Left to their own devices they fight and kill each other en masse because that is just their nature. This would normally be a benign issue on its own, but ends up spiraling to apocalyptic levels primarily for two reasons:

 

1. Outside powers, humanity in this case, stumble upon Hell accidentally and just can't leave well enough alone. The demons see unspoiled lands and souls and decide to spill onto them, drowning poor humanity in a sea of death and destruction.

 

2. A bigger, badder demon gets ambitious or bored with the monotony of Hell and set their eyes elsewhere. These demon lords mastermind (heh) invading other worlds/realms/what have you, and manage to marshal the demons of hell into a sort-of cohesive invasion force. I say sort-of cohesive due to the simple fact that many of these demons will quickly turn on each other if given an excuse, like friendly fire for example.

 

With how vague the actual story of Doom is though, most of this is ultimately left to player speculation so feel free to disregard and/or accept whatever you think makes the most sense.

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