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Doom: Annihilation update

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Posted (edited)

I describe it as totally inoffensive. The name drop references were fun but nothing else stood out at all except the aforementioned box art shot. Ironically I actually prefer the first adaption to this.

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i had a blast with this one guys. It helps that it was almost exactly what I was expecting and hoping for it to be, which you can read about in my previous posts on this thread if you have the curiosity

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Saw it. Was mostly pretty stupid, with embarrassing production values. But the constant on the nose video game and Doom lore references were bit of a hoot. As it was written by its director, I think it may be fair to say that Tony Giglio is in fact a fan of Doom and was trying to put together something fun and in the style of the games. He's not a great director, but I feel that if he had a bigger budget he may have tried to do even more, and given the cliff hangar ending, maybe he's hoping to churn out sequels like the Death Race movies. We got BFG killing stuff, chainsaws, colored key cards, the hilariously named Captain Savage carrying an antique, exposed hammer 12 Ga. double barrel, characters named John Carmack, William Blaskowicz, and Sandy Peterson, etc.... I know the first movie had some similar references, but the Dr. Carmack and the Dr. Willits in that didn't feel quite as on the nose as these, probably because they had different first names. 

 

None of the characters really stood out in any way save for like a defining quirk, save for maybe Dr. Betruger, with actor Dominic Mafham having a pretty decent performance. The characters from the first Doom movie may have been cardboard cutouts of your Aliens-style grunts, but I still remember their names and minor character arcs. No one had that much of a defining character arc, not even Joan Dark I felt, although they at least tried to give her some depth and something that resembled a story arc, but I don't feel that it was particularly strong.  The acting was never very strong either for the most part, save maybe for the Captain Savage, Bennet (the boy friend), and the aforementioned Mafham as Betruger. The first movie certainly had better actors, infamous Karl Urban/Rosamund Pike scene and Dwayne Johnson's incredibly forced swearing notwithstanding. 

 

Imp monster designs were alright, though the effort that it took to kill them seemed a bit ridiculous, but I suppose it's because it's the only demon monster in the movie aside from zombies. As such, they do come off as menacing when they appear, and characters that can die at any moment sort of keeps you on your feet, even if you can't surrender a real care about any one of them. But, with that said, this movie had shootouts throughout, fun references, actual demons and something that looked like Hell (although it looked ridiculously silly and fake, with the sudden change in Imp design being really jarring. Also that horrible looking shaky head cam for that one shot), so in a lot of ways the movie certainly was doing what it could to make up for the sins of the father. 

 

I think what needed to happen was to have this story be the one we got in 2005, with the 2005's production and cast being combined with it. The "future" guns looked even sillier and more awkward than the guns in the previous movie (See the gun that the linguist marine carries. Like, damn, does it look awkward and cumbersome). The eBay sourced airsoft military costumes in particular were hilariously awful and cheap looking. 

 

Overall I'll give it a 5/10, which for me means enjoyable enough and featuring some objectively good aspects and technical bits, but also still more or less a bad movie overall. Pure Direct to Video trash, but better than most of that trash, no doubt. 

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Posted (edited)

It's pretty well known ID was inspired by the movie Aliens when they came up with the Doom story. The Alien movies all

have a female protagonist so when I realized what DA was doing I thought "Oh cool." I'm just saying "inclusiveness" may not

be the only reason there's a female protagonist.

Edited by bfredric

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Posted (edited)
51 minutes ago, bfredric said:

The Alien movies all have a female protagonist so when I realized what DA was doing I thought "Oh cool." I'm just saying "inclusiveness" may not be the only reason there's a female protagonist.

Alien and Doom are rather different things. Doom since inception was primarily a "story" about a dude who's so brutal he can kick ass to each and every demon in hell while running like he has jet engine in his arse. This applies even to Doom 3, by the way. This by this point is an archetype of a protagonist. Just like you cannot supplement Bayonetta or Lara Croft with some random dude, you cannot just supplement Doomguy with some random chick. And if director did not understand that and was not motivated by "inclusiveness", he starts to look stupid. But I think that, au contraire, considering how BAD everything this movie has to offer is - from sets, to art, to acting, to special effects, to script, to even marketing, it's more likely that they decided to make at least some buzz around the movie by stirring controversy. And even at that they failed.

 

PS If I was to make a Doom movie, I'd make it more of technogothic mindfuck with emphasis on insane aesthetics of environments, with some kind of metaphorical synergy of the lone guy with a shotgun trying to overcome Hell despite Hell being the fundamental part of reality that cannot be overcome just like the laws of physics are.

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If the name isn't obvious enough for you, there's an interview with the director in which he explicitly confirms that Joan Dark is named after Jeanne d'Arc, the medieval shepherdess-turned-holy-warrior after she heard the voice of God telling her to drive the Englishmen out of France.

 

I guess the literal Middle Age is too "inclusive" for you lot, though.

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7 minutes ago, Rastrelly said:

Doom since inception was primarily a "story" about a dude who's so brutal he can kick ass to each and every demon in hell while running like he has jet engine in his arse.

"Doomguy" is an avatar for the player, so he is only as bad-ass as the player playing the game is.

 

Anyway, the movie was better than I had anticipated. It certainly felt more Doom than '05 Doom, but that doesn't say much...

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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, Archvile Hunter said:

"Doomguy" is an avatar for the player, so he is only as bad-ass as the player playing the game is. 

Can't agree completely. The way you are playing the game, and the way the game presents it to you are two different things. Those flavour texts exist for a reason. There is a clear intent behind Doom's design, and it's not quite possible to say that YOU are the Doomguy. While it's correct that Doomguy is your avatar, you cannot, say, make him crawl on his knees begging imps to leave him alone, for example. He'll still just grunt angrily at getting damaged while poking his gun at them. Obviously, some things can be attributed to limitations of programming, but too many small things indicate what type of person the Doomguy is supposed to be despite all his blankslateness.

 

27 minutes ago, Gez said:

If the name isn't obvious enough for you, there's an interview with the director in which he explicitly confirms that Joan Dark is named after Jeanne d'Arc, the medieval shepherdess-turned-holy-warrior after she heard the voice of God telling her to drive the Englishmen out of France. 

 

I guess the literal Middle Age is too "inclusive" for you lot, though.

 

Believe me, nobody could guess that paper thin reference. What that reference has to do with the movie is quite a different question, though.

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I did. I got it when Perfect Dark did it 20-odd years ago, too. Given the hoo-hah over this movie's production, I was fully expecting it to be politically-correct garbage and it just isn't. The film makes absolutely no bones about what it's trying to ape. Forget the Doom fanservice - there are that many scenes that so completely and directly rip off Aliens that it could easily be turned into a potentially lethal drinking game.

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12 minutes ago, scalliano said:

I did. I got it when Perfect Dark did it 20-odd years ago, too. Given the hoo-hah over this movie's production, I was fully expecting it to be politically-correct garbage and it just isn't. The film makes absolutely no bones about what it's trying to ape. Forget the Doom fanservice - there are that many scenes that so completely and directly rip off Aliens that it could easily be turned into a potentially lethal drinking game.

Let's be real, Doom is basically Aliens with a Achillean action hero, and with demons instead of Xenomorphs.

Any Doom movie by extension is just going to be ripping off Aliens by extension.

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3 hours ago, Gez said:

If the name isn't obvious enough for you, there's an interview with the director in which he explicitly confirms that Joan Dark is named after Jeanne d'Arc, the medieval shepherdess-turned-holy-warrior after she heard the voice of God telling her to drive the Englishmen out of France.

 

I guess the literal Middle Age is too "inclusive" for you lot, though.

Not gonna lie, the whole time I was thinking that name sounded familiar and was thinking of Perfect Dark but I ultimately missed the reference. Shame on me...

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3 hours ago, Rastrelly said:

Doom since inception was primarily a "story" about a dude who's so brutal he can kick ass to each and every demon in hell while running like he has jet engine in his arse.

Bullshit. Doom wasn't meant to be straight action, it was meant to be action-horror. Tell me, if you got caught up in a situation like that in real life, would you try to do what Doomguy did? And in fact, I think 2016 is actually just a terrible parody of Doom's original idea that bases itself on bad memes.

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6 minutes ago, Sgt Nate V said:

Tell me, if you got caught up in a situation like that in real life, would you try to do what Doomguy did? And in fact, I think 2016 is actually just a terrible parody of Doom's original idea that bases itself on bad memes.

So if I couldn't/wouldn't do what Doomguy did in the games that means he's his own separate entity?  Would that mean he's not an avatar for me as the player since he wouldn't do what I would do from a realistic perspective?  Maybe I'm missing something here.

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8 hours ago, Clonehunter said:

Was mostly pretty stupid, with embarrassing production values

If you wanna know something stupid from Doom is: not the movies, not all of the novels. Slayer's testaments in Doom 2016 are quite stupid. Specially the one located in Titan's Realm.

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8 minutes ago, STILES said:

So if I couldn't/wouldn't do what Doomguy did in the games that means he's his own separate entity?  Would that mean he's not an avatar for me as the player since he wouldn't do what I would do from a realistic perspective?  Maybe I'm missing something here.

I mean, you feel badass in the game, but you might feel a bit powerless in real life.

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I'm confused. Was Joan not a total badass? This strikes me as like arguing Ripley wasnt a badass since they're practically the same character...

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Very ridiculous seeing people saying 'Doomguy' is an avatar. You guys don't know what you're saying. 

 

I would prefer going back to old days when he was Flynn Taggart on the forums.

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2 minutes ago, Gerardo194 said:

Very ridiculous seeing people saying 'Doomguy' is an avatar. You guys don't know what you're saying. 

 

I would prefer going back to old days when he was Flynn Taggart on the forums.

That name and the novels in general have never enjoyed a good reputation or any widespread acceptance in the community.

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7 hours ago, Rastrelly said:

Alien and Doom are rather different things.

Fun fact: id was original offered the Alien license to make a game and turned it down so they could have more creative freedom.

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1 hour ago, Gerardo194 said:

Very ridiculous seeing people saying 'Doomguy' is an avatar. You guys don't know what you're saying. 

 

I would prefer going back to old days when he was Flynn Taggart on the forums.

Canon only in its own story. My doomguy would never have such a horrid name! 

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11 hours ago, XLightningStormL said:

Let's be real, Doom is basically Aliens with a Achillean action hero, and with demons instead of Xenomorphs.

Any Doom movie by extension is just going to be ripping off Aliens by extension.

True, but some elements are literally shot-for-shot do-overs - for example, the bit where Ferro gets killed in Aliens is all but recreated here in its entirety. Wearing your influence on your sleeve is one thing, but try switching things up at least a little bit! 

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9 hours ago, Quasar said:

That name and the novels in general have never enjoyed a good reputation or any widespread acceptance in the community.

I already know that story... I used to hate them all. You could even search my posts throwing shit to those novels and even the name. 

I read that on Doomwiki.org many years.

But I learnt one needs to respect how others see the Doomguy...

7 hours ago, Pegg said:

Canon only in its own story. My doomguy would never have such a horrid name! 

Canon?? I never said it was canon to the Doom games,,, My Doomguy is William Blazkowicz, but not as shitty fandom wikis believe just like Doom wiki wikia.

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I really don't understand why people argue against the whole concept of the player character being a demon-slaughtering machine. Yes, that bit of text in the game's manual says you're just some ordinary marine with a slightly higher than average sense of justice, not a mythical or legendary hero. But the game doesn't agree. There's a huge disconnect when the game encourages you to move fast and slaughter great amounts of demons. What sort of ordinary marine would be able to do this and keep it up despite constant wounds and literally fucking going to hell? I'm not the greatest fan of Doom 2016's story (thank goodness though you can just set it aside and play the game!) but I think the Doom Slayer really works because instead of standing in contrast to what the player does in game, he instead works with it.

 

Would this work in a tense movie like this one? I dunno. I watched the movie last night and our main character sure did get involved in a lot of demon shooting. Even faced with what lies beyond the portals, a swarm of demons, and the big bad demon explaining everything to her, she's still able to just slaughter all the demons present. So maybe it could.

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Posted (edited)

There's something almost tragic about the results of Doom: Annihilation, because underneath its conservative budget is a better movie. Perhaps not Aliens or The Thing or Event Horizon; but at least a B-schlock facsimile, which is very nearly what we get. It's a strangely humble picture, as much of what happens is in-camera, with a smattering of squibs, muzzle shots, monster suits, props, costumes, and memorable sets. It's a very old school approach.

 

In the manual of the original game, you as the player is a space marine that, following a major screw-up, was transferred to the United Aerospace Corporation facilities on Mars. When the UAC's teleportation experiments on the Martian moon Phobos go awry, your team is called in to clean up the mess. Word for word, this is exactly the plot of the movie, with lieutenant Joan Dark (Amy Manson) serving the role as the player. She is at odds with Dr. Betruger (Dominic Mafham), the scientist responsible for the debacle.

 

Doom necessarily presents its own riff on familiar tropes. We get the scene where upon waking up, the crew sits down to a meal, followed by a debriefing; we get glimpses into Joan's haunted past; we quickly learn that Winslow (Clayton Adams) is the Dwayne Hicks—the least-liked marine in Aliens—of the film. It all works, but it also has that Sy-Fy channel feel, and whether that's enjoyably quaint or disappointingly bland is a matter of taste.

 

Once the action ramps up, things get a bit messy. The budget really shows here, with much of the gunplay revolving around possessed humans, and not so much as a single demon until the third act. It's almost frustrating to think of what could have been, as well as knowing there was nothing director Tony Giglio could have done about it. The results are simultaneously repetitive and brief, designed to provide the illusion of more than meets the eye. Does it work? Mostly. The middle sags, and the teleportation sequences were undercooked, but the finale provides more eye-candy than you'd expect.

 

Universal first gave Doom a go in 2005, and the results were disastrous⁠—it failed to recoup its $60 million budget, and was a far cry from the source material. Here, we have a smaller, scaled-back, more legitimate attempt. Its sincerity is what carries it more than anything else, and for all its flaws, it treats its subject with praise. Non-fans might toss it aside, but any true Doomer ought to appreciate the work involved.

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5 hours ago, Gerardo194 said:

I already know that story... I used to hate them all. You could even search my posts throwing shit to those novels and even the name. 

I read that on Doomwiki.org many years.

But I learnt one needs to respect how others see the Doomguy...

Canon?? I never said it was canon to the Doom games,,, My Doomguy is William Blazkowicz, but not as shitty fandom wikis believe just like Doom wiki wikia.

It's funny how a franchise can have so much arguing on it's protagonist's name.  That's sorta the beauty in Doom, guess it's whatever you want it to be at this point.

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If anything, Doomguy is two things at once.

He's meant to be you the player, since he doesn't have some details, so you get to be the Doom marine and go through Hell.

But he's also his own individual at times that beats his corrupt boss and had a cute pet rabbit, while 64 stated him having nightmates, laughing when discovering one of the secret levels and him choosing to stay in Hell and 2016 had him care little about certain UAC stuff/people but still backed up an AI he assumed wasn't evil, liked cute dolls and didn't harm the people at Phobos.

 

I mean, if id really wanted him to be an empty vessel, he wouldn't have his faced in the HUD.

Most of this "the story/protagonist doesn't matter" feels less like an intentional choice and more of a case of the gameplay being too important, the story and protagonist were just there.

 

And it's usually seen through John Carmack and Romero but what about the other people at id, like Sandy Peterson saying the Archvile just wants to help his partners?

 

I guess another reason to see Doomguy as its own person is to see a character associated with the most important FPS, as if it was the genre's Mario, in case BJ Blazkowicz, Gordon Freeman or Master Chief aren't the ones to fill his throne.

 

Spoiler

I was also thinking of a really dumb idea: a Doom crossover movie with horror/sci fi movie franchises, like Doom vs Alien or Doom vs Freddy.

 

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7 hours ago, SaladBadger said:

What sort of ordinary marine would be able to do this and keep it up despite constant wounds and literally fucking going to hell?

Literally every single marine from the Doom universe, as the game's multiplayer modes will quickly demonstrate.

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