*2020 HAKAWARDS* I'm Also Looking to Play and Record Your Maps 2 *CLOSED*

[Austinado]

Its GZDOOM buddy...hope to hear and see some feedback! Thanks in advance ;) 

 

- Doom2 IWAD

- UV

- Sorry..there is some custom monsters.

- Use the two files please, one is texture resource and other the WAD itself.

Cheers! 

[HAK3180]

Table of Contents

 

 

@Robert_Kendo

 

download the .wad

 

I really like this type of map where you have multiple paths and multiple objectives. The map may have linear aspects, but if so, it’s hard to tell what needs to happen in what order. It certainly appears that the map is yours to explore. I thought the weapon progression was too slow. Even the shotgun is withheld for a decent while, and I never even found a super shotgun. I got the extremely optional BFG on a sidequest (eventually), found plenty of plasma guns and at least two rocket launchers, but I never even saw a super shotgun. I appreciated how obvious your progression was in this map, too. You knew you needed to hit two switches to exit, and you pretty much knew when you were on an objective path and when you were not. I think there are some really good combat setups in here, both incidental and setpiece. I think some things are annoying, such as some odd damaging floors and a slight scarcity of ammo throughout. I also think the visual department could use a minor upgrade. The spatial design is there, but there’s a somewhat noticeable lack of detail and presence of some crudeness. It’s a map with pretty high replay value, and I think people who like big maps won’t be disappointed, but people who don’t want to be confused will be able to follow this decently well.

 

Bottom line: a mostly well done and fun magnum opus kind of map

[Datacore85]

Thanks a lot for playing :p

[Zolgia108]

@HAK3180

Dranyan map will be way more challenging!

Anyway, i m sorry for the visuals, this was a speedmap :( As for the fight itself, you did it in such a weird way hahahaha, you missed the plasma and then you killed the mastermind which was there to help with the next fight (of course you couldn't know in a blind run), archviles come when you press the second switch (the one behind the mastermind), so they shouldn't have been in the middle of the mess, but i guess that's what blind runs are right?

I know this is out of the box, i asked if i could and it seems it was accepted, the first version was harder and the bfg wasn't easy to obtain (it was behind the hks so you had to clean up a bit first) but then i was asked to make it easier and that's what happened. After 26 maps of classic doom i thought that a "breather" would have been nice hahahaha

 

 

thanks a lot for playing it!

 

EDIT: oh oh wait i forgot! since you are a final fantasy (old ones) lover i will quote:

"He who fights and runs away lives to see another day". Dwarves in which ff?

[HAK3180]

18 minutes ago, Zolgia108 said:

"He who fights and runs away lives to see another day". Dwarves in which ff?

 

Hmmm, I don't remember it, but I would guess IV since I seem to remember that one having the most prominent dwarf presence.

[Zolgia108]

21 minutes ago, HAK3180 said:

 

Hmmm, I don't remember it, but I would guess IV since I seem to remember that one having the most prominent dwarf presence.

you know what? i don't remember either.

 

No i am joking it's IV yeaaaa

[Robert_Kendo]

5 hours ago, HAK3180 said:

Table of Contents

 

 

@Robert_Kendo

 

download the .wad

 

I really like this type of map where you have multiple paths and multiple objectives. The map may have linear aspects, but if so, it’s hard to tell what needs to happen in what order. It certainly appears that the map is yours to explore. I thought the weapon progression was too slow. Even the shotgun is withheld for a decent while, and I never even found a super shotgun. I got the extremely optional BFG on a sidequest (eventually), found plenty of plasma guns and at least two rocket launchers, but I never even saw a super shotgun. I appreciated how obvious your progression was in this map, too. You knew you needed to hit two switches to exit, and you pretty much knew when you were on an objective path and when you were not. I think there are some really good combat setups in here, both incidental and setpiece. I think some things are annoying, such as some odd damaging floors and a slight scarcity of ammo throughout. I also think the visual department could use a minor upgrade. The spatial design is there, but there’s a somewhat noticeable lack of detail and presence of some crudeness. It’s a map with pretty high replay value, and I think people who like big maps won’t be disappointed, but people who don’t want to be confused will be able to follow this decently well.

 

Bottom line: a mostly well done and fun magnum opus kind of map

Hey, thanks a bunch for playing, its nice to get some feedback. I totally get all your complaints and I could have upgraded that thing visually till the cows came home. Since I had already sunk so much time into it I just decided to call it a day, hence the fluctuation in visual quality. All of your complaints are totally valid, but I just wanted to address one or two things to help redeem my design ;)

 

So the shotgun can actually be gotten in the main hall. You were soooooo close to getting it, after getting in the little sub-room with green armor you hit the switch and heard the door open but didn't investigate the other little sub-room in the main hall with the now dead shot-gunner in it. You were just distracted with commentary and taking it all in or I think you would have pursued that. There is also a secret early chaingun in the outdoor area. As for the super shotgun(s) I intentionally made them out of the way because I know just how much players rely on it, however...

 

There are two secret super shotguns, although as you stated in the video my secrets are mostly obvious and its just a matter of coming upon them. There is an entirely optional building in the "outdoor city area" that is locked with a red key. This building is chock full of spare rockets, bullets, and in the top floor in the "commanders room" is a very obvious, but stylishly hidden, super shotgun. There is also a secret super shotgun in hell. There are two optional rooms in hell that branch of from the "marble blood pit room" -which is just one other thing I wanted to clarify...

 

Ok so you know that large marble room, the plainly lit one with the green sludge sky and blood pit? Just so you know, when you first enter that room there is a blood podium right in front of you before you hop down onto the green pillars. If you investigate that podium it reveals the room is actually a simple puzzle. There is a certain path you have to take across the pillars or else they sink down into the demons (which I only did because damaging floors seemed played out) and examing the podium at the start will show you the correct path. I know you didn't complain or anything but I just wanted to say that.

 

The weapon progression plays out like this if you're curious...

Blue key[shotgun] -> Yellow key[secret chaingun] -> Yellow switch path[chaingun & plasma rifle & secret bfg]

or

Blue key[shotgun] -> Red key[chaingun & rocket launcher] -> Hell(red switch path) or "Red Outdoor UAC Building"[secret super shotgun]

So if you want the super shotgun right away you can go down the sewer path and grab the red key first thing.

 

As you noticed from just one playthrough there are tons of little quirks besides the ones I listed that are changed depending on what order you choose. Like you can get the plasma gun from the "armory" in the "storage room" early by taking that yellow teleporter to the armory just before getting the red key in the elevator. Or you can grab the plasma gun from the "Yellow switch path" as soon as you get the yellow key, and that pentagram in the center of the adjacent room is actually a teleporter to the main hall. So you could make getting the bfg your first priority and do the rest of the map from there!

 

Thank you so much for your time! It was really cool seeing someone else go through all my traps and I loved how you almost always reacted 100% how I expected the players to react in almost every scenario, that was pretty gratifying. Knowing that I conveyed the flow of combat well enough that you were just able to "get" what the appropriate response is. Good job, its a long map so I don't blame you cheesing it for the sake of a video at certain times. I made this map to be super replayable so I hope you enjoy it enough to try it again one day(although you have so many people asking for your support I doubt that's going to happen) Thanks again! :D

[Egg Boy]

 

[Robert_Kendo]

Hey, I created some very short "bonus footage" for you! Don't take this as a retort to your criticism, because it isn't, I take all of that to heart. I'm just so proud of this map I wanted to show you. Sorry for the crappy potato quality. It's a recording of a recording because I don't have any real video capturing or editing software, but hopefully it's still entertaining.

 

Clip 1: How to get a shotgun and box of shells without leaving the main hall.

Clip 2: Hint on how to get the earliest possible chaingun.

Clip 3: The bonus "red key" UAC building -

Clip 4: - and on the top floor...

Clip 5: Navigating the pits of hell.

Clip 6: A super shotgun and a simple bridge building puzzle... Or is it? Hmmm...

 

[HAK3180]

@Robert_Kendo, I had gone back to check out the demon section with the lifts and stuff. It seemed very Last Call-ish, so even while playing I figured there was something more to that. I wish I had seen that super shotgun puzzle - that looks fun. I'm a proponent of optional stuff.

[HAK3180]

@That_Gay_Kid

 

download the .zip

 

It feels a lot like a newcomer’s effort, but with a little more makeup on it, including the decision to tackle some advanced mapping features early. What I like here is that everything, although basic, is competent. There are some questionable decisions, like death progression points and a possible mandatory secret, but the map appears to have some thought put into it. Next would be to work on core gameplay stuff – more interesting space and how that influences fun combat and gameplay in general.

 

Bottom line: pretty basic with some semblance of advanced mapping knowhow

[WH-Wilou84]

Thanks a lot @HAK3180 , it's really kind of you to take time to play and comment and upload all these videos for us mappers on a steady pace - that's much appreciated :)
 

As regards to 180mpv's map 30, too bad you couldn't see how to progress in the boss area.
You actually get a clue in the room before the BFG9000 :

This room tells you that you have to shoot the orange "organs" of the creature to go further.
During the boss battle, you'll notice the very same organs, just shoot them to expose the boss more and more and reveal the next stages of the fight.
 

I guess trying new strategies and looking for stuff while Lost Souls keep spawning and harrassing you is tough, though, but that's the point. They're here to protect their creator :)
 

I'll make sure the strategy to kill the boss gets demonstrated even more clearly in the upcoming update.
 

This map 30 is definitely long, particularly if you're still expecting actual speedmaps at this late stage of the wad. That is due to the core concept of the level : a multi-author map with multiple sections, each made by a different author, and stitched together by some "hub" area. In retrospect, we should probably have gone for shorter sections, or less of them (my initial goal was 4 sections of 5 minutes worth of gameplay each, guess we got carried away a bit... :)). Also, separating the sections from the boss itself over the span of two distinct maps would've probably worked better as regards to pacing.
Consider the lesson learnt.

I'll soon release a version with a bonus map 30, a completely new level with basically the same concept, although with only 3 different sections and much more eventful gameplay.
 

Thanks again for your time and feedback, and keep at it !

[HAK3180]

@galileo31dos01

idgames download page

 

Very nice. The appearance is just what it needs to be. Not overdone, not underdone. Atmosphere is good – a nice mixture of indoor and outdoor, all in a dark desert environment with some Egyptian-themed buildings. I liked how the first part was linear and then you were in almost a sandbox with optional stuff.

 

Bottom line: varied, but cohesive; atmospheric, but conventional

[HAK3180]

1 hour ago, WH-Wilou84 said:

I'll make sure the strategy to kill the boss gets demonstrated even more clearly in the upcoming update.

 

Okay, I didn’t notice the orange. And even when you told me, I went back to check it out and still couldn’t figure it out for quite a while. It’s almost impossible to hear a door open with everything that’s going on, and both times it happens far away from the trigger. Maybe some flashing lights would draw more attention to those areas. I'm happy to be of service. Best of luck with final updates.

[galileo31dos01]

Thank you for the feedback, much appreciated!. The title "Zeramida" is fictional, it's sort of a mix of the words "Zeliard" which is a very old RPG-platformer game, and "pyramid" together. There is no such real place called like that, no interconnection between the game and the map, it was nothing else but an excuse to make up a title that started with Z. When in doubt, just invent words :)

 

I'm from Argentina, btw.

[HAK3180]

@Soulless

 

Doomworld forum topic

 

For as much height variety as is here, I only used freelook once and didn’t miss it otherwise. This was a very entertaining premise of making your way up and through this beautiful, grand base as the hellspawn came at you in gradually more threatening waves. Maybe some of the action got a little bit repetitive – in a map of this length too much of the same incidental stuff can get wearisome faster than a smaller map or even a comparable-length / longer mapset, but other than that nitpick, I thoroughly enjoyed the action: a good mix of run and gun, quasi-traps, and a legitimate setpiece or two.

 

Bottom line: A very fun vertical adventure

[Soulless]

@HAK3180 Thanks a lot buddy, taking notes here really. Since the map is kinda big, not sure if its gonna take a long time to work on those void/sectors, but i will take a look anyways. Im very unorthodox when it comes to mapping, still learning as you can see.

Higly appreciate your other tech video.

 

Had so much fun watching your run, you blasted both cyberdemons like it was nothing! The 2nd one sadly got stuck, well...

Im so glad changes didnt make you get lost, and progression seemed clear all along. The ammo/health balance was great, finally! You cant believe how much there was on the 1st version. Every fight was as I expected, you couldnt cheese out any encounter (block lines fix).

The archviles angles at the final battle, it is intentional, didnt want to make things too difficult, just enjoyable; you can make monsters infight or not, theres enough ammo, so its up to the player.

 

Thanks for the very useful feedback buddy, catch you on the next one!

 

Edited October 23, 2020 by Soulless

[HAK3180]

@Dranyan (Well, I forgot you had specifically requested Ultra-Violence, but probably for the best. I started on Ultra-Violence and promptly switched to Hurt Me Plenty. I'm confident the footage would have had very little value on Ultra-Violence

 

Doomworld forum topic (project)

 

I often get the sense that some mappers equate difficulty with objective quality. In my opinion, difficulty is a factor in fun, but it is neither directly nor inversely proportional to it. This gameplay is not what I like about Doom at all. When the probability of success of the “correct” strategy is so much higher than the “incorrect” ones without any real cue as to what you should do, I feel like I’m bad for dying and then I feel bad for succeeding. I don’t like that. I also don’t like the extreme tedium of trying to set up a huge infight, one imp and one slightly too-high mancubus firing angle at a time. I don’t like massive hordes of meat without sufficient cells and rockets. I don’t like random, unmarked teleporting starting halfway through a fight when you think you have a foothold. I don’t like awkward damaging floors. I will say the last sequence here was by far the most interesting to me because I thought it depended on a number of factors and could reasonably be played several fun ways. And I thought this thing had a cool layout, utilizing teleports but still being thoroughly connected and reusing areas for new fights. 

 

Bottom line: If this map is five fights, I say 4/10, 2/10, 2/10, 1/10, 7/10

[Dranyan]

Thank you for testing it, @HAK3180.

Yeah, i already expected you will have the same opinion as everyone's else. Like-- "Yeah, sure the layout looks good, but the difficulty ruins everything." And i honestly can't blame you, it's my fault.

 

But yeah, like i said before you should expect a lot of problems considering i didn't playtest it enough (because the deadline was just so close at that time)

 

Anyway, i've noted few things based on your gameplay and i'm already planning to make some change, including making the map so much easier. 

 

Once again, thank you! It's always helpful to have someone like you around :)

Edited October 23, 2020 by Dranyan

[HAK3180]

@Rapp0ng

 

Doomworld forum topic

 

My biggest complaint here is probably a few too many supplies. It’s hard to balance a map like this, and I think better an abundance than a scarcity, but I could tell pretty early that rockets and cells were always going to be there when I needed them. And that will be exaggerated even more yet if there’s a secret BFG somewhere. But I was still able to have a lot of fun. It’s a decent-sized totally nonlinear map, and I love how it’s not just three distinct paths, but a full sandbox, yet the areas are distinct enough that you don’t get lost, and that’s accomplished through texturing, scale contrast, and lighting. There's a noticeable variety in the fights. I thought the weakest was definitely the red (I think) key with easily avoidable hell knights. But other than that, I enjoyed most of the action.  

 

Bottom line: This thing checks a lot of good boxes for nonlinear map design

[HAK3180]

@Kyukon

 

Doomworld forum topic

 

You can see the progress throughout the maps, but even the first couple are decent. There is thought put into the layouts and the encounters. Visuals are a touch crude sometimes, but in more of a vanilla-ish sense. Highlights for me are Map 04 and 07.

 

1: Basic Map 01 stuff, not that bad, but quite noticeably inferior to later stuff

2: Decent layout, still pretty basic

3: TNT-ness is solidified. Another strong layout with more emphasis on specific fight setups

4: Really cool small city-ish survival map. I do think the progression may be too obscure. All I could figure out to do was take a teleporter from the damaging floor and then complete a rather precise SR-50 jump.

5: This felt the most like something you would see in actual Id Doom. It was quality without anything that really stood out

6: High concept map here. It’s very atmospheric and pretty much only features the plasma gun. Pretty fun, but a couple fights got a little tedious. If nothing else, it will be memorable.

7: A thrilling map of nonstop fun action, pitched at a really enjoyable difficulty for me. We may see this in February.

 

Bottom line: Once you get to Map 04, this wad takes a sudden turn from promising to good

[HAK3180]

@Kyukon, I watched @Clippy's video, so I figured out what you're supposed to do in Map 04. A little obscure - that kind of thing is often optional/secret. But I guess I found another way in, haha.

[Kyukon]

First of all, thank you! @HAK3180

 

Second, I see you checked out version 1.0 instead of 1.1.  Not too big of a deal, I should probably just remove the 1.0 link from the bottom of the post.

The biggest changes of course being a Map04 red key fix, SW textures being set to 01s, and the final fight being cut down.  I was honestly afraid of one CB being too easy, but 3 is way too much.  This kind of added on top of not knowing how to make an exit on monster kill.

 

Next, all the callbacks to classic iWads were intentional, and hopefully they were in good taste?

 

4:  I tried to fix all the problems with this one in 1.1, sorry you had to deal with the obscure original version.  Definitely not intended, but that was impressive anyway!

5:  Ah yeah, that hall of mirrors was a little side effect of trying to have the revenants visible but not attackable from the front.  I went back and used the technique I learned on map 6 to sort of get this to work.

6:  That large room with the same fight twice originally had more HKs and Barons and didn't have any pinkies, so it was changed to have more infighting.  I'm also going to need to figure out how to make the graphical side of the glass textures work a little better if I ever try to use similar tricks with the glass cages again.

7:  Yellow key sequence break is intended to be an option, yup.  The whole yellow area is really an optional gearing up for the end. (Plasma, Soul Sphere, etc...)  Also, thanks for the reminder about the key situation on this map and map 3.  It was a little bit of a crutch I used to get some non-linear progression, and while it's fine sometimes, it's good to remember not to spam that concept either.  Some Plutonia Map09 style key bars could work on other maps.

 

Also, what's in February?

 

I’m not entirely sure if I’ll be moving forward with this one since Map07 was kind of intended as some sort of conclusion, but I might make another miniWAD like this with the newfound knowledge and design advice.

 

Thanks again!

[Stabbey]

 

On 10/22/2020 at 5:56 PM, WH-Wilou84 said:

Thanks a lot @HAK3180 , it's really kind of you to take time to play and comment and upload all these videos for us mappers on a steady pace - that's much appreciated :)
 

As regards to 180mpv's map 30, too bad you couldn't see how to progress in the boss area.
You actually get a clue in the room before the BFG9000 :

This room tells you that you have to shoot the orange "organs" of the creature to go further.
During the boss battle, you'll notice the very same organs, just shoot them to expose the boss more and more and reveal the next stages of the fight.

 

 

On 10/22/2020 at 7:41 PM, HAK3180 said:

 

Okay, I didn’t notice the orange. And even when you told me, I went back to check it out and still couldn’t figure it out for quite a while. It’s almost impossible to hear a door open with everything that’s going on, and both times it happens far away from the trigger. Maybe some flashing lights would draw more attention to those areas. I'm happy to be of service. Best of luck with final updates.

 

WH-Wilou84, a trick I use to make it clearer when or where something has opened or lowered is to add, hidden inside the walls, some extra dummy sectors with the same tags, so that sound is produced for the player to hear, even when the actual thing which has opened is farther away. Ideally, I also put that in the direction of the secret.

 

 

 

 

 

[Rapp0ng]

@HAK3180 Thanks for playing! Great to see that you enjoyed it!

 

So happy to see not only people enjoying the gameplay, but the visuals as well. Of course, Doom is very old but it still is great to see a nice looking map so I try to make mine look decent as well.

 

Re the question about what maps you played of mine. Mine was the Sigil inspired map called Vehement Malaise and the 'I just discovered doom builder and made a map far too big' called Breach.

 

Non linear was a real challenge in regards to ammo distribution. I tried to ensure that no matter which way you went you were not punished for doing so.

But the problem with this is that other areas may become easier because of all the ammo and weapon pickups throughout the map. With a linear map you could control how much the player would have throughout the level.

 

But I agree with the sentiment that its better to have more supplies than less. At least a player can have fun shooting things, even if it is a bit easy.

 

Yeah, the red key (the outdoor bridge area one) was the weakest. I was going to throw in arch viles and revenants spawning everywhere but I was worried I was getting too cruel so I eased up a bit on that one.

 

Cheers!

 

 

 

 

[nicolas monti]

Hey man, it's been a couple of months I stayed out of doomworld, I recently managed to do one more map for my Enceladus episode, I didn't comment on the last two videos but I watched them and took into account what could be enhanced as always.

 

This is E4M5, runs on crispy /Prboom etc.

 

http://www.mediafire.com/file/46rs7if6txsc6z9/ENCELA45.wad/file

 

Thanks!!!

Edited October 25, 2020 by nicolas monti

[HAK3180]

20 hours ago, Kyukon said:

I see you checked out version 1.0 instead of 1.1. 

Sorry about that. I probably got to the bottom of the post and there was the download, so I just grabbed it.

 

20 hours ago, Kyukon said:

Also, what's in February?

You'll just have to stick around that long to find out...

 

^{or check the last post on page 27 of this thread.}

[Shawny]

I also made a map for

Quote

 

If the have the time maybe you could take a look.

I will DM you the map.

 

Doom format: BOOM

Map: 13

Tested on: PRBoom+ (mainly) and GZDoom

Edited October 25, 2020 by Shawny

[WH-Wilou84]

Hey @HAK3180, it's me again. :)

I'd like to know if you could also try and play the bonus map 30 for 180 Minutes Pour Vivre that we've just released :
https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/116347-doom-iilimit-removing-180-minutes-pour-vivre-rc4-with-bonus-map-30-released/

A large map in Limit Removing format, it's a multi-section boss level like the one you've recently played in the main wad but with less sections and a focus on intense, challenging fights.
Maybe the experience will be more enjoyable for you :)
 

 

[DragonsForLunch]

Hey @HAK3180

 

I’ve got a GZDOOM map for you! Looking forward to getting your always honest and useful feedback!