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DoomSpud

Least favourite weapon and why?

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If there's anything I don't like it's the inconsistency of the melee weapons. There's far more variance with the damage of the fist than anything else in the game. With berserk it can either one-shot a pinky or leave a shotgunner completely unscathed. And how many times I've died or taken heavy damage due to the latter are beyond count.

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16 hours ago, DoomSpud said:

Honourable mention to the Super Shotgun. Don't get me wrong, I DO like it and it's fantastic against high-health enemies such as Barons and Arch-Viles but I will always take the regular shotgun over it 90% of the time. It's more accurate (especially over medium to long range) and it's damage per shot/shot per second ratio makes it a more strategic option in most cases. The reload time on the Super Shotgun has gotten me killed more times than I care to count and can be a total liability sometimes.

The SSG is the convenient affordable meal you like a little bit less each time you eat it.

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The chaingun for me. The sound effects just aren't as meaty as all the other guns.

 

And the pistol doesn't count as an option. Obviously no one likes that.

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59 minutes ago, DuckReconMajor said:

The SSG is the convenient affordable meal you like a little bit less each time you eat it.

I love it too much.

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Strangely, the SSG.  Not because it's bad, but quite the opposite, it's far too good.  It is literally a valid weapon against every single enemy in the game: it's as useful against an Imp as a Cyberdemon.  It's so universally useful it kind of becomes a bit boring.  I try to avoid putting it in my maps for a little while to force players to have to flip between the SG, Chaingun and RL more.

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Pistol obviously, but after that probably the rocket launcher. It's great for taking out big enemies in open spaces if you don't have plasma ammo, but it's useless in tight spaces.

 

Why all the complaining about the Chaingun? It's great for taking out Imps and Former Humans from far distant heights.

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Posted (edited)
37 minutes ago, Unitron said:

Why all the complaining about the Chaingun? It's great for taking out Imps and Former Humans from far distant heights.

For me, the Chaingun feels like a step down from the Shotgun.  Sure, staggering enemies with it is fun, but it just lacks punch, IMO.  I only feel the need to use the Chaingun if I lack shells.  Otherwise, the Chaingun fills only a niche role for sniping, for me.

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1 hour ago, silentzorah said:

For me, the Chaingun feels like a step down from the Shotgun.  Sure, staggering enemies with it is fun, but it just lacks punch, IMO.  I only feel the need to use the Chaingun if I lack shells.  Otherwise, the Chaingun fills only a niche role for sniping, for me.

 

I agree that in general it is a step down, but that niche role in sniping is what I was talking about. Niche yes, but an important one in certain maps. 

 

Though it works for crowds of weaker enemies as well, more so than the shotgun.

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BFG. I just don't like it, it doesn't look well, its effect is underwhelming (green flash - meh), it doesn't sound particularly strong and robs you of good and tense fights. :)

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Following rdwpa's format, should be an arrangement like this:

 

Chaingun/BFG/Plasma rifle -> Super shotgun/Rocket launcher/Chainsaw -> Berserk/Shotgun -> Pistol/Bare fist

 

Neither the pistol or the fist give me any joy despite the one or two usages others mentioned. As a contrast, if these came in pairs, like the double pistols in DVII or double fists in STRAIN, I'd absolutely use them without hesitation. 

 

Shotgun is okay but does inconsistent results rdwpa already explained and I feel the same way. Similar case with the 'zerked fist, it could use a less extreme range of damage values, but then blockmap bug exists and meh. Barons, HKs and revs generally elude this for some reason, imps don't, or is it just me idk. SG is though still a considerable option for me over the SSG if both are given, in some cases, but perhaps the SSG shouldn't be there to begin with, not straight away.

 

Super shotgun and rocket launcher are good, the latter should be more "standardized" in Doom 1 wads as well as non-SG weapons. I can live without the SSG in maps where other weapons do the job well enough. I also think the reload is good because otherwise it would be OP. The RL autoaim sometimes annoys me, coupled with the speed of rockets, at mid-far distance it can be counterproductive in most cases. Infinite height and splash damage are the weirdest holy combo. Chainsaw is just a guilty pleasure of mine over the fist, but still could do around 1.5x more damage to improve the speed of attack, and why the hell does it reject enemies sometimes?.

 

Plasma rifle is also good, chaingun is lovely. I prefer them both for carving through stuff while keeping it intimate, possibly one of my favourite situations in wads. SG over CG for sniping is debatable, I used to think that way but the technique of tapping changed my mind. The only cases I choose SG to snipe are for revs/imps on ledges or fat hitboxes. PR is usually the ace up the sleeve, in case the BFG isn't in the map or is more efficient depending on the circumstances. PR-centric maps are one in a million, unfortunately. Guess it's hard to balance a map around a tool that is OP in many cases and underwhelming in many other cases. Same with the BFG except it tends to be "too generous" in maps not designed around it as the main weapon. BFG is 100% satisfaction when one makes it work, but kinda irksome when it's wasted.

 

Bonus comment: every once in a while an archvile eats the ball, goes in pain state, moves away from my FOV, and tracers go to waste. Ergo, as RNG rules the game, sometimes the delay of the tracers can fuck off, and archviles are trolls but that's off-topic.

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I used to have major disdain for the plasma rifle for using "precious" BFG ammo (which in itself would often not be used). I was also not keen on the inherent risk of the rocket launcher.

 

Now I'm tempted to say the SSG is my least favourite. Partially because it reduces fights with tougher enemies to a slower rhythm with it's reload, but also because of how many streams I've seen where players waste a shell by using it on enemies that don't need it. Rockets and plasma are more fun against tougher enemies and perhaps more helpful in crowds. The sounds of the SSG are terribly satisfying, though...

 

My longstanding exclusive use of ZDoom means I'm pretty happy with the shotgun, fist (preferably with berserk) and chainsaw, although the pulling on the latter is definitely something to be wary of. The pistol is ok. I would quite like it as an alt-fire for the shotgun, so you can deliver the coup-de-grace (with appropriate accents) on "lucky" imps or zombies you've winged.

 

Also, as I'm sure anybody who's played Knee-Deep in the Dead on Nightmare! can attest, the chaingun is incredibly useful.

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Vanilla Chaingun if its the smooth doom chaingun then its fine but not the vanilla one.

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Clearly the pistol. As a mapper, I like to string-out the pistol experience for a while simply because it's rendered absolutely redundant by almost any other weapon pickup; so some pistol-heavy early action makes the value of those other weapons really stand out.

But also the chainsaw, because I almost never use it. 'Sticking' to an enemy until it's dead (or you stop attacking) is a liability, and if you're berzerked it feels somewhat like a booby prize option in comparison.

Everything else is fine.

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13 hours ago, Mk7_Centipede said:

the flashlight.

If were bringing newer Dooms into this, then yes, Doom 3's flashlight is is a useless weapon.
Also, the heavy assault rifle from Doom 2016, it only becomes useful after you get the micro missiles.

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Posted (edited)

It depends on the map that i'm playing, but most of the time i'll refuse to use the plain shotgun. It makes most enemies incredibly tedious to kill, and even an Imp doesn't always die in one single shot, which makes it unsatisfying to use. At least the CG stunlocks monsters so you can use it for some sort of crowd control, and it is also more effective against zombie hitscanners.

 

Pistol and unpowered fist are merely screen decorations until you find a proper weapon, so i don't take them into account.

 

So yeah, i really like it when a map hands me the plain shotgun right at the start and then the SSG immediately after, so that i can forget about it.

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People still say the SSG is overpowered? I always laugh when a wad gives the ssg half way through but you get the RL and plasma rifle way earlier. Much more batshit op weapons than the ssg can ever hope to be.

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7 minutes ago, Pegg said:

People still say the SSG is overpowered? I always laugh when a wad gives the ssg half way through but you get the RL and plasma rifle way earlier. Much more batshit op weapons than the ssg can ever hope to be.

 

Also no one said you can't starve the player for ammo :p.

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Posted (edited)

Pistol definitely. As for best, IMO:

 

RL > BFG > SSG/CG > PR/Shotgun > Berserk > EE.

 

-> RL is definitely my favorite, it's a really well balanced risk/reward weapon which I'll use whenever possible. It's too fun to use to kill multiple low-tiers enemies and kills any grinding feeling against mid-tiers or even barons. The self-damage might be a bit too much, and I see many players struggling to use it, but once you get used, it becomes a really rewarding weapon to use.

 

-> Second goes to the BFG. I'm not very good at using it and I struggle to do the 2 Cyberdemon shot, but still, it's a really fun and rewarding weapon which has its power maximized when using at close range (I'm pretty sure this is not accurate though lol), so if you want to get maximum power of it, you have to put yourself at risk. At last, BFG x Cybers iterations are always fun, IMO. (as they are with MM).

 

-> SSG and Chaingun go to the 3rd place. Both are really good weapons which are useful to deal in different situations, although not as good as the 1st and 2nd due to taking longer to kill midtiers. Chaingun at its best is pretty good to take down weak foes (mostly hitscanners) and pain-locking some midtiers, as to finalize damaged midtiers. SSG is really useful to take out foes at close range at the risk of being vulnerable due to reloading, while you don't have to worry about self-damage, but it's a bit too slow to take down meaty enemies, IMO. It's also a really safe weapon to use against cybers.

 

-> Plasma Rifle and Shotgun feels more like situationals weapons especially after you get the BFG or the SSG. The shotgun has the advantage of having a faster firerate + being more precise at mid-distance, but even killing pinkies can make it a slow weapon to use, chaingun is just better and you don't waste your SSG ammo. Plasma Rifle shares the same BFG ammo and its fire sound is too damn loud. It's a really powerful weapon if you don't have the BFG, usually being an option against harder enemies when you don't have to deal with long distances. I don't find it very rewarding compared to RL though.

 

-> Berserk goes at last because I suck at it.

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The Chainsaw; useful against zombies, imps, spectres, demons, cacos, pain elementals, and lost souls. Unfortunately using the damn thing locks you in, so you can't use it effectively if there are other monsters nearby, another issue is that sometimes monsters can hit you with their melee attack while being stun locked by the chainsaw. 

Even tough the chainsaw may somewhat feel like a melee chaingun, it's not as effective as a chaingun, using the chainsaw against mancubi and arachnotrons is suicide in comparison to using the chaingun against them at melee range.

 

Another less favorite is the Plasma Rifle; it's a fantastic weapon but it sounds annoyingly loud, i preffer it's PSX counterpart because it isn't as loud and sounds more fitting. 

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Non berserk powered fists for very obvious reasons (that usually leads to your demise.)  Other than that it's the pistol for being slow and inaccurate when you hold down the trigger.

 

Really like the plasma rifle but I always hated how I tend to miss bolts or overuse it on an enemy and waste ammo.  Something about that has always irked me and trained me to fire it in short bursts.

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16 minutes ago, LadyVader1138 said:

To those who are hating on the chaingun: that thing has saved my life against many a cacodemon.

Yeah and it's a very accurate weapon when you fire it in bursts too.  Great for sniping.

 

Chainsaw is effective against Cacodemons/Pain Elementals one on one as well.

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The least reliable weapon for me is easily the chainsaw. At least with fists you can have some distance without locking yourself in and putting yourself in bigger jeopardy.

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, NuMetalManiak said:

The least reliable weapon for me is easily the chainsaw. At least with fists you can have some distance without locking yourself in and putting yourself in bigger jeopardy.

Not if you use it right. For instance, it is GREAT against Pinkies if there's a corner of 90 degrees or less to stand in.

I mean, E3M7 on UV would have been a pain if I hadn't gotten that chainsaw in E3M6.

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The Chaingun, honestly I don't really like it, It lacks a lot of stuff I could like on a Weapon such as perfect sounds, power, design and situations It can be used in.

I would use Plasma Rifle over it for horde-cleaning and if I don't have it, either Shotgun or Super Shotgun.. SUPER SHOTGUN POWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEER!!!!

 

Ahem.

 

And if I could have a order for favorite to less favorite, I think that's pretty easy.

 

Super Shotgun > BFG9000 > Plasma Rifle > Rocket Launcher > Shotgun > Pistol > Chainsaw > A Duck > A Dog who has just bitten the Dust > Chaingun

 

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Posted (edited)
On 8/12/2019 at 12:21 AM, Randall said:

The chainsaw, I really only use it for 1 enemy 

I'm guessing you're talking about the pinkies but If you get the movement right you can also use it to quickly get rid of a few imps or zombieman without taking damage and losing any ammunition

Edited by ([zen3001])

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1. Pistol: Weak, ineffective. Not fun to use period.

 

2. Chainsaw: weird lock-in jerks the player around. A fun novelty the first time I used it, but rarely want to put it in my maps. Also worthless with the availability of beserk.

 

3. Chaingun: it's adequate in Doom, but feels underpowered in Doom2 due to stronger foes, bigger hordes, and the availability of the SSG.

 

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