Microsoft's GS Wavetable Synth is the best soundfont for Doom?

[Get Phobo]

Yeah, and besides, you can load audio recordings of those MIDIs with most ports anyway, so there isn't really any need for a MIDI player and soundfonts.

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

14 minutes ago, Bauul said:

but surely 99.9% of people who played Doom in the 90s wouldn't have heard it like that? Including the other MIDI writers of the time? This feels like chasing an experience that basically nobody actually had. 

Most players in the 90s probably would have heard the music playing with FM synthesis (via either Adlib/Sound Blaster when playing the DOS version, or a generic OPL3 synthesizer when playing DOOM95) or perhaps "wavetable" synthesis (Ensoniq cards for example).

 

I can't find information online about the SC-55's MSRP, but it can't have been cheap, especially since it was aimed more at PC MIDI musicians rather than people who just played DOS games.  I can't imagine too many DOOM players at the time would have wanted to go out and by an expensive Roland device just to hear the music how it was "supposed" to sound.

 

7 minutes ago, Get Phobo said:

Yeah, and besides, you can load audio recordings of those MIDIs with most ports anyway, so there isn't really any need for a MIDI player and soundfonts.

True, but there are also many PWADs with soundtracks that do not have recordings available.  Although I guess not too many PWAD soundtracks were composed on a hardware Sound Canvas.

[Get Phobo]

1 hour ago, TheUltimateDoomer666 said:

Most players in the 90s probably would have heard the music playing with FM synthesis (via either Adlib/Sound Blaster when playing the DOS version, or a generic OPL3 synthesizer when playing DOOM95) or perhaps "wavetable" synthesis (Ensoniq cards for example).

I got me a Gravis Ultrasound after a few years of enduring Sound Blaster's crappy audio. A friend then got me a patch set arranged specifically for Doom. And man, was it great.

 

Quote

I can't find information online about the SC-55's MSRP, but it can't have been cheap, especially since it was aimed more at PC MIDI musicians rather than people who just played DOS games.  I can't imagine too many DOOM players at the time would have wanted to go out and by an expensive Roland device just to hear the music how it was "supposed" to sound.

I've found one article from the UK, according to which the Mk. II cost £649 in 1994.

Edited September 6, 2019 by Get Phobo

[Gez]

I really, really doubt anyone is ever going to write an accurate Orchid GameWave 32* emulator, so I'm not going to get anything that sounds how it sounded to me back then. So as a fallback I'll settle for an accurate SC-55 emulator.

 

* A pretty sweet soundcard, it had both an OPL chip and a soundbank system, and could therefore emulate Sound Blaster, General MIDI/MPU-401, and MT-32.

[MaxRideWizardLord]

16 hours ago, TheUltimateDoomer666 said:

It's gm.dls, located in C:\Windows\System32\drivers.  Gmreadme.txt has a description and copyright information for the sound set.

 

I've tried to put gm.dls in the soundfont folder, but for some reason my GZDoom 4.2.0 doesn't see it. What's the problem??

Also, I've just foundout that the FluidSynth says that it's "Not set", yet it still play musics by itself. What does that mean? And if I want it to set it back to default to "not set", what exactly I should do in this case?

 

14 hours ago, Get Phobo said:

19 hours ago, MaxRideWizardLord said:

If I set multiple soundfonts, will I be able to see them all in GZDoom midi player selection in the sound menu?

If you copy them into GZDoom's "soundfonts" folder, then yes. You can also use them with Timidity++ that way.

 

No, I mean like, have multiple of VirtualMIDISynth like VirtualMIDISynth 1#, VirtualMIDISynth 2#, VirtualMIDISynth 3#, etc, each of which use it's own soundfont, and to be able to select these from GZDoom's MIDI Device. Sorry, should have said that more clearer.

 

It seem like I having only one VirtualMIDISynth to choose from, and it seem to use only one soundfont, would like to have multiple of these so I could compare multiple soundfonts.

 

13 hours ago, Bauul said:

Although, I can't help but wonder, if the objective is adjust GZDoom to play MIDIs as closely to how most people heard them back when they were released, is attempting to as perfectly as possible emulate the SC-55 sounds the wrong approach, given pretty much nobody who has ever played Doom has ever heard them? Yes Bobby Prince used an SC-55 to write the songs, but surely 99.9% of people who played Doom in the 90s wouldn't have heard it like that? Including the other MIDI writers of the time? This feels like chasing an experience that basically nobody actually had. 

 

At first my goal was to find the reason why that one particular song from map09 of Hell Revealed 2 sound only correct under Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth, and as well find a way to make FluidSynth play it properly, and as well have Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth for Android.

 

Then I've learned that not only Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth is not a soundfont but some build-in program of Windows that cannot be extracted, but the soundfont it's uses is not even a soundfont a Doom soundtrack was designed for, but were designed for some shaitan mechanical box called "SC-55 mk.I" and that it's, somehow, impossible to close SC-55 mk.I with all of it's processing for PC. While the previous goals still stands, I'm more concerned as to find a way to replicate perfect close sounding SC-55 mk.I soundfonts for PC, and maybe midi players for it too.

[chungy]

40 minutes ago, MaxRideWizardLord said:

I've tried to put gm.dls in the soundfont folder, but for some reason my GZDoom 4.2.0 doesn't see it. What's the problem??

Release versions of Fluidsynth don't yet support DLS soundfonts. You probably just can't use it yet.

[Get Phobo]

53 minutes ago, MaxRideWizardLord said:

I've tried to put gm.dls in the soundfont folder, but for some reason my GZDoom 4.2.0 doesn't see it. What's the problem??

You will need to edit GZDoom's .ini file. Look for the line "timidity_config=gzdoom" and replace it by "timidity_config=gm". That way the gm.dls file will be loaded for use with the integrated Timidity++ player. And yes, I've done exactly that; it sounds horrible, but it does indeed work.

 

53 minutes ago, MaxRideWizardLord said:

Also, I've just foundout that the FluidSynth says that it's "Not set", yet it still play musics by itself. What does that mean? And if I want it to set it back to default to "not set", what exactly I should do in this case?

I have no idea.

 

53 minutes ago, MaxRideWizardLord said:

No, I mean like, have multiple of VirtualMIDISynth like VirtualMIDISynth 1#, VirtualMIDISynth 2#, VirtualMIDISynth 3#, etc, each of which use it's own soundfont, and to be able to select these from GZDoom's MIDI Device. Sorry, should have said that more clearer.

I suggest you take a proper read into the VMS documentation. You can specify up to 4 VMS devices, each with it's own soundfont config and other options. The program has all the functions you're looking for, but you seem to be too lazy to even read stuff and get properly acquainted with it.

 

53 minutes ago, MaxRideWizardLord said:

It seem like I having only one VirtualMIDISynth to choose from, and it seem to use only one soundfont, would like to have multiple of these so I could compare multiple soundfonts.

Sure, because you've only defined one. See above. If you define more than one VMS device, you will be able to choose any of them from the game's sound menu. It takes ~20 seconds to set everything up. It's not difficult, let alone impossible.

[MaxRideWizardLord]

29 minutes ago, Get Phobo said:

I suggest you take a proper read into the VMS documentation. You can specify up to 4 VMS devices, each with it's own soundfont config and other options. The program has all the functions you're looking for, but you seem to be too lazy to even read stuff and get properly acquainted with it.

 

Literally googled the coolsoft's VirtualMIDISynth just to find out there is no information about this subject - https://coolsoft.altervista.org/en/virtualmidisynth

The README.htm file I found in folder just show me changelog between versions, so it's no help either.

Looking in the options of VirtualMIDISynth program I've only found soundfont (банк звуков) and midi mapper, and if I add more soundfonts they will just replace the one from above to bottom, and in midi mapper I could select only two choices as well.

 

so then I made this post.

 

EDIT: after a long and intense googling on both languages, I've found a russian website with a much deeper informations on details that explained that "количество устройств" (roughly translated as "amount of hardwares") is actually a number of MIDI players I can use. Something that is very counter-intuitive to guess to begin with. So calling me lazy for not knowing that is rather rude at least.

Edited September 6, 2019 by MaxRideWizardLord : After some time of research, I've finally found it.

[MaxRideWizardLord]

1 hour ago, chungy said:

Release versions of Fluidsynth don't yet support DLS soundfonts. You probably just can't use it yet.

 

Is there any soundfont that is about as close to gm.dls as possible, or preferable gm.dls that is actually ported to .sf2? Considering it's not a hardware, I hope porting is not that should be considered impossible.

[BBQgiraffe]

in the words of the great Micheal Reeves, it's "Shid" and "Doo-Doo"

[Cacodemon345]

17 hours ago, MaxRideWizardLord said:

 

Is there any soundfont that is about as close to gm.dls as possible, or preferable gm.dls that is actually ported to .sf2? Considering it's not a hardware, I hope porting is not that should be considered impossible.

Try Scc1t2.sf2.

[MaxRideWizardLord]

On 9/7/2019 at 6:36 PM, Cacodemon345 said:

Try Scc1t2.sf2.

 

Interestingly, I've attached this Scc1t2.sf2 in both VirtualMIDISynth and in to GZDoom's FluidSynth's soundfont, and they both sound exactly the same. Which makes me curious, how exactly fluidsynth midi player is any different from any of the rest?

 

Unfortunatelly, neither of these midi players managed to play Short Circuit properly, which makes me be curious if the song has some errors that weren't originally meant to be played by GS Wavetable Synth with it's soundfont.