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Pokemanic33

Comeuppance: My first short little attempt at mapmaking

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I like to mess around with Doom Builder in my free time and I actually finished a map at once, so I figured I might as well post it somewhere. I'll admit it's nothing exceptional (in truth it's probably fairly mediocre), but I had fun making it. It's supposed to be visually reminiscent of the vanilla game, specifically Knee-Deep. It's probably pretty basic in terms of visuals (and everything else actually), but I like to think it's at least presentable. 

 

So, some suggestions from the "new to posting maps" thread:

  • Screenshots at the bottom (I think, I don't know how to work a forum yet.)
  • Ports: GZDoom (g3.5.1 is the only one I tested it with). It uses some ZDoom features (MAPINFO and TEXTURES lumps, some light ACS) so I assume it won't work with anything else.
  • GZDoom stuff:
    • Freelook, jumping, crouching? No, no, and no. All those are in the MAPINFO though, so it'd only be an issue if you had those settings forced.
    • Compatibility settings? Actors are infinitely tall. It's not necessarily required, but there's one specific part of the map that was designed with it in mind.
    • Renderer? I'll admit, this isn't exactly my area of expertise. Basically, anything that vaguely resembles vanilla lighting would probably suffice. My setup, the one you see in the screenshots, is OpenGL renderer with sector lighting set to software and tonemap mode set to palette, and the map was lighted with those settings in mind. Software renderer would probably look fine, but I don't know enough about this to be able to say definitively.
  • IWAD: Doom 2.
  • Maps: Just MAP01.
  • Difficulty: Probably too easy.

 

I think I've got everything working as it should, but I don't have anyone else to run it by for testing so I fully admit that something could be totally broken. Fingers crossed that's not the case.

 

Comeuppance.zip

 

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Screenshot_Doom_20191008_183923.png

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Welcome to Doomworld! Here's to hoping you enjoy your stay.

 

The screenshots look nice; at least, there's nothing that jumps out from them. Don't worry about the map being too easy--the important point is that you finished it and released it here for further consideration.

 

Obviously, the ZDoom features won't work outside the ZDoom family, but I do wonder if the map would still play in other ports, even if some parts wouldn't behave quite as intended. There is a big difference between being completely broken and just not looking quite like you wanted it to look.

 

 

11 hours ago, Pokemanic33 said:

I don't have anyone else to run it by for testing

 

For future reference, you may want to check out this thread of people who have stated a willingness to be playtesters.

 

 

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Played through this just a minute ago!

 

Some things worth immediate fixes:

  • Secret sector 243 seems utterly inaccessible, judging by the lack of any linedef special for tag 16 (like a ceiling raise in this case).
  • Floor lamps in the nukage room bleed into the low wall sectors they're placed on top of; shunting them leftward, or simply reshaping the walls, would help.
  • You should only need to use one secret tag for the hidden skull-switch-lower secret, activating when you enter the opposing room which contains the green armor prize.

I liked this despite its low difficulty and corridor-based play. There's a nice efficiency to the progression and how you revisit spaces, though I wish the nukage room lifts would have less delay between movement. Some traps are rather good, like the first baron and the final closet with tight room to dodge the manc. (For port compatibility, redesigning the baron room to use something besides ACS shouldn't take too long.) Texturing's clean, the lighting's IWAD-ish in a good way, and it doesn't overstay its simplicity.

 

You definitely need less shoebox-y shapes for each room, and the corridors are generally too long/narrow to offer much of anything, but there's good ideas in here which work nonetheless. I'll say that the plasma secret's way too obvious, even playing with the settings you recommend; consider keeping it while adding a trap monster and changing the weapon out for something less overpowering (chainsaw, for instance). I definitely want to play more of your future maps!

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Did a playthrough (Hopefully my breathing wasn't too loud - I'd just come home from a run).

 

Fun little map. I managed to accidentally do a sequence break with getting the blue key (I didn't go for the blue key door after, so no harm no foul) but you may want to make those bits impassable so wily players like me can't do that.

 

Monster wise it was as you said; fairly easy. That's not actually a problem. You had a neat little layout. Texture choice was fine for me, no glaring issues. There were some misalignments on the outdoor rocks, you should be able to fix that in Doombuilder by just finding the texture you want to align everything too and hitting the 'A' key.

 

Nice job.

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That does look very fabulous! Putting this in my backlog.

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Wow, so a few people commented on this overnight, and I'm glad to be getting a response. Uhh, I don't know if it's common practice to do this, but I guess I can address them here?

 

10 hours ago, Pegleg said:

Obviously, the ZDoom features won't work outside the ZDoom family, but I do wonder if the map would still play in other ports, even if some parts wouldn't behave quite as intended. There is a big difference between being completely broken and just not looking quite like you wanted it to look.

I'm pretty sure the map would be unbeatable without the ACS. It's responsible for several aspects that are required for progression; you wouldn't be able to get the blue keycard, get out of the Hell area, or get to the exit without it (or IDSPISPOPD I suppose). I'd like to make maps that are vanilla/Boom-compatible, but I just find ZDoom to be far easy, at least for now.

 

10 hours ago, PasokonDeacon said:
  • Secret sector 243 seems utterly inaccessible, judging by the lack of any linedef special for tag 16 (like a ceiling raise in this case).
  • Floor lamps in the nukage room bleed into the low wall sectors they're placed on top of; shunting them leftward, or simply reshaping the walls, would help.
  • You should only need to use one secret tag for the hidden skull-switch-lower secret, activating when you enter the opposing room which contains the green armor prize.
  • There actually is a door open special for tag 16, but it's only in the ACS. It has the same tag as the exit door, and it's opened by the same line in the script.
  • Those lamps are a tricky situation. I discovered that you could walk on the walls in that room, allowing you to get the blue key early. I didn't want to completely remove this sequence break, but I wanted to make it more difficult to achieve (and was too lazy to change the shape of the room). So I put those lamps there, the idea being that you would have to drop down into the nukage to get the key early. You could still run around them without falling down though, so I shoved them into the wall further. In hindsight it's a "fix" that doesn't really need to be there (it's not like you can skip much without getting the yellow key anyway), but that was my thought process when I put them there.
  • Yeah, this one I don't really have an argument for. I guess I thought that they should be separate secrets because they were both off the beaten path? I don't know really.
10 hours ago, PasokonDeacon said:

There's a nice efficiency to the progression and how you revisit spaces...

That's actually a huge compliment. I love the idea of revisiting areas and I think it's something that's missing from a lot of Doom's original maps, so it's somewhat relieving to see that my intentions came across in the level design.

 

10 hours ago, PasokonDeacon said:

You definitely need less shoebox-y shapes for each room, and the corridors are generally too long/narrow to offer much of anything

This, like the floor lamps, is mostly an example of my own laziness. Scale is something I have a problem with and I always make rooms way too small. I'm trying to get better about it (and compared to my private Doom Builder endeavours I am) but as you can see, I've still got plenty of improving to do. I usually didn't discover these scaling issues until testing, and by that point, it would be a pain in the ass to go back and fix them. Bad excuse, I know, but that's why the map is the way it is. I opted to leave the rooms mostly empty because of this scale problem too to keep them from becoming even more cluttered than they already were. 

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