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OfficalGeeDee

Requesting Feedback

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As the title of this Topic suggests, I'm looking for some feedback. I'm new to mapping, and I've spent a bit of time playing and looking at other mappers' wads in DB2. I studied how things worked and used that to learn how to map. I'd like those who are more experienced to give my first wad a play, as well as maybe look it over in the editor and give me some criticism and tips for how I can improve. Please let me know with a reply in this thread if you download and try it out (along with feedback) Thank you, and I'm looking forward to growing into this community even more! (Important edit! The switch to end the level isn’t set up, I forgot about that. I can fix that tomorrow once I can get back on the computer, sorry)

MONSTRANCE.zip

Edited by OfficalGeeDee : Update

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Hey, there, welcome to doomworld! I would recommend posting something like this in "WADs and mods" instead of "Doom Editing." As the latter is meant for questions and tidbits relating to the process of editing doom wads, while the former is for things such as this, WADs for others to play. Also, you should provide things such as the port the map is intended in, various ports you tested in, and screen shots. Also, I'm guessing it's meant for gzdoom, as it uses wall textures as floor textures, which is impossible in vanilla and boom ports. Anyway, as far as the map goes, its a bit too flat, very wolfenstein feeling. The map is nice and open, but overall bland due to its flatness. Not very difficult, but that's not a huge deal. It's a good start, but you've got to give the map more variety in terms of height. I didn't find any bugs, besides the blue key door and ending switch not working, but you've already noted that. Anyhow, keep at it, and keep in mind what I've said here (or not, your choice, really). Happy mapping.

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Just took the map for a spin, and I like what you did with the place! For an early attempt at mapping I thought you did an admirable job. I loved the lighting in the Yellow Skull area, and your overall choice of textures made for an interesting theme and feel to the level. As for action, it would definitely occupy an early map slot in terms of difficulty, but I actually really enjoyed it. The monster closets got to be a bit predictable, but they were still fun, and gave me a good surprise sometimes with their choice of monsters. This is an awesome starting point!

 

So, for the feedback:

 

As Egg Boy mentioned, the map does tend to feel a little flat. Given the almost constant action, coupled with an endless train of monster closets lying in wait for the player, the flatness didn't actually bother me that much (that's to say, on some level I did notice it, but I was more often concerned with combat that it hardly ever surfaced in my mind in a bad way). This is one of those areas where, there's room for improvement I think, but height variation just for the sake of height variation isn't necessarily always a good thing either -- whether it's a monster, a weapon, an item, a room, a door, or height variation, there should always be a reason for adding it (in my opinion). Superfluous things are normally relegated to aesthetic detail only, though again, exercising moderation even here is generally good advice, I think. 

 

You can always look at some of id Software's levels for inspiration on how height variation can be utilized. I often enjoy going back to Underhalls to see a great example of how to make a small, simple map with low tier bad guys, with great use of highs and lows.

 

underhalls_forum.png.bb9d9dc979d4520f3b7c608cb3588391.png

 

 

Something else I'll pick on is the texture work. Now, texturing (and aesthetic detail in general) is arguably a long, slow learning curve where time matters most. The more you practice, play around with textures, and explore others' work, the better you'll get. This is not an issue early on, so definitely don't dwell on it. Two things I'll note as feedback though are texture alignments, and border textures. For most people, aligning textures is a desirable thing. In the editor, if you hover over a wall you can align it's texture with neighboring walls (that have the same texture), by pressing "A" to align on the X axis, pressing "Shift+A" to align on the Y axis, or pressing "Ctrl+A" to align on both the X and Y axes. (I recommend briefly perusing the Keybind/Shortcut reference manual for your editor, it's absolutely full of awesome things you can do that might not be obvious).

 

I'm always a big fan of breaking up different textures with some kind of "border" as well, so that the transition is less extreme. I've provided a few images in the Spoiler tag below as a small example from your map. It is also generally accepted practice to change floor/ceiling elevation if you're going to change the floor/ceiling texture -- one of John Romero's own mapping tenets which you can read here. 

 

Spoiler

pic1_forum.png.92549370426af4cc3eab12c2fb7bbf56.png

 

pic2_forum.png.7ac5ec106ec8bf31dcf40b7ba0755771.png

 

pic3_forum.png.2b8c5f0002ca8c28de53a50c17e0a501.png

 

pic4_forum.png.16de34fae0ad5c3992102326633b52bc.png

 

 

Beyond that, I definitely want to re-state what Egg Boy mentioned. If you're looking for feedback on a playable map, the Wads and Mods section of the Doomworld forum is the place to put it. When you do post a project there, including something as modest as a first time map with the hope of constructive criticism, there are a few simple guidelines worth following to have the best possible response. These can be found here:

 

 

 

There is also a friggin' beautiful essay on monster placement written by Grymmoire and Ghastly that I believe is worth reading, which can be found here:

 

 

 

Now, as far as "what makes good level design"... you're going to run into every conceivable and contradictory piece of advice, humble opinion, and howling doctrine under the sun. You can search queue this topic and read for hours... days... years probably. You'll pick up on the odd universally accepted piece of information on "good level design", which generally revolve around the idea of just not being a massive dick to the player. Other than that, don't stress out on what makes for good or bad levels. Just make them, test them, and if you enjoy them, chances are that others will as well - not everyone! But, you can't please everyone, so don't try.

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21 hours ago, Egg Boy said:

Hey, there, welcome to doomworld! I would recommend posting something like this in "WADs and mods" instead of "Doom Editing." As the latter is meant for questions and tidbits relating to the process of editing doom wads, while the former is for things such as this, WADs for others to play. Also, you should provide things such as the port the map is intended in, various ports you tested in, and screen shots. Also, I'm guessing it's meant for gzdoom, as it uses wall textures as floor textures, which is impossible in vanilla and boom ports. Anyway, as far as the map goes, its a bit too flat, very wolfenstein feeling. The map is nice and open, but overall bland due to its flatness. Not very difficult, but that's not a huge deal. It's a good start, but you've got to give the map more variety in terms of height. I didn't find any bugs, besides the blue key door and ending switch not working, but you've already noted that. Anyhow, keep at it, and keep in mind what I've said here (or not, your choice, really). Happy mapping.

I’m so glad that I have decided to join this community. I’m going to take all of this feedback into use and study a lot, I’m going to keep on practicing and playing around with stuff. Thank you so much.

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