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Eurisko

SIGIL ,Final Doom and more now available for DOOM console ports.

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The jankiness of the 1990s-vintage renders and weird design decisions are a perfect complement to the absurdity of the story, and contribute to the goofy charm of the whole.

 

If you really dislike them, well, have you heard about something called SLADE?

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3 minutes ago, Gez said:

If you really dislike them, well, have you heard about something called SLADE?

 

I was tempted to use SLADE, but actually never found the time, and instead played other stuff.

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On 12/11/2019 at 8:06 AM, Doomkid said:

The use of green crosses was a mix of Geneva Convention compliance and listening to the community!

Man FUCK the Geneva Convention

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You know, I was gonna make a thread in here asking 'if the current Doom ports ever got updated with curated PWAD support, what would you like to see?' then THIS happens. Anything they do add will need to be original assets, stuff with textures ripped out of other games or midis that aren't original creations will obviously not be eligible :p

 

On 12/12/2019 at 3:44 PM, Gothic said:

My vote goes to Back to Saturn X.

 

Maybe this will encourage the BTSX team to ACTUALLY wrap up and finish Episode 2, which iirc is still in a beta after how many years?

 

On 12/12/2019 at 1:55 PM, scalliano said:

Ultimate Doom

Doom II

Master Levels

Evilution

The Plutonia Experiment

No Rest For The Living

SIGIL

and Doom 64 coming in the spring.

 

What timeline is this?

 

Also MMI&II as first downloadable PWADs. Calling it.

 

Needs Perdition's Gate and Hell to Pay and MAYBE Lost Episodes of Doom to truly to be complete, but yeah, every official Doom game is going to be in ONE place, on all four platforms.

 

Now if only we could get a competent Quake 1 port for the first time in history, and the other Doom Engine games on console to boot. I'd love a Heretic/Hexen collection, I first played Hexen on the PS1.

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I'm curious as to why we never were able to put custom WADs on a USB and run them with the existing console ports.

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2 hours ago, Nevander said:

I'm curious as to why we never were able to put custom WADs on a USB and run them with the existing console ports.

The console giants generally don't like that — loading external game data from USB could be a potential pathway for console exploits and running arbitrary code. They allow MP3s, images, and video on a system level because they're common mediums/formats, making them easy to account for. The same can't be said for a proprietary game data file format like WAD, there's too much to account for from a security POV.

 

It'd also result in customer support channels being clogged up, due to port features or quirks that custom WADs are often built around — even if they were built to identify non-vanilla WADs and block them from being loaded, you'd still end up with users complaining that X port doesn't support Y WAD, or doesn't render Z port feature correctly.

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5 hours ago, Lollie said:

The console giants generally don't like that — loading external game data from USB could be a potential pathway for console exploits and running arbitrary code.

What exactly could you even run from inside a WAD anyway? Aren't ports designed to ignore unrecognized lumps?

 

5 hours ago, Lollie said:

It'd also result in customer support channels being clogged up, due to port features or quirks that custom WADs are often built around — even if they were built to identify non-vanilla WADs and block them from being loaded, you'd still end up with users complaining that X port doesn't support Y WAD, or doesn't render Z port feature correctly.

Shouldn't people expect that? I mean, you're loading custom content. That's always been an issue on this subject no matter the game. Just throw up a big disclaimer saying something along the lines of "if you're running custom files, we can't help you." I guess I'm giving people too much credit.

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35 minutes ago, Nevander said:

What exactly could you even run from inside a WAD anyway? Aren't ports designed to ignore unrecognized lumps?

It does not matter if you physically can or can't do arbitrary code execution in Doom (not even being the only thing of concern, you have the danger of exposing secure information in memory overflows, something that we know Doom can in fact possibly do), console manufacturers will not allow arbitrary access to unverified/unmoderated content in games (and depending on the platform, can't even give access as the design of the hypervisor or filesystem physically prevents it). This is a blanket restriction that exists regardless of the game and its capabilities.

Game consoles are not Win32.

Foot note: Thinking that only unrecognised data can ever expose vulnerabilities is how we get things like heartbleed and people reprogramming Mario using an array of gamepads.

Edited by Edward850

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What I'm curious about whether or not this new update is console exclusive or if it's gonna show up on PC, and maybe become available to existing owners of Doom I & II on GOG and Steam, seeing that what they shown in the livestream did feature keyboard prompts instead of console ones.

 

DOOM_Classic_Update3.png

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2 hours ago, AmethystViper said:

What I'm curious about whether or not this new update is console exclusive or if it's gonna show up on PC, and maybe become available to existing owners of Doom I & II on GOG and Steam, seeing that what they shown in the livestream did feature keyboard prompts instead of console ones.

 

Sigil is already freely available on PC.

 

https://www.romerogames.ie/si6il

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There's also a chance the footage was from an Xbox One (was the platform specified at any point by the way?), as it does actually support mouse and keyboard for a while now.

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I'm late to the party but this is very cool to hear! It's great news and i enjoy playing the Doom games (albeit on a lower difficulty due to using a controller) no matter what device they are on.

 

Anyway's to me it seems that Bethesda wants to keep the classic Doom games just that...classic. So if they ever added PWAD support it would probably have to be PWAD's that only play like the original Doom games (aka no freelook, jump ect.) even though i'm sure this port supports those options. That's just what i can gather.

 

AND yes i am aware that NRFTL is limit-removing but it basically plays like vanilla Doom imo.

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5 hours ago, CyberDreams said:

So if they ever added PWAD support

What is No Rest For The Living and SIGIL if not PWADs?

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3 hours ago, Edward850 said:

What is No Rest For The Living and SIGIL if not PWADs?

 

I think we both have an idea about what he meant by "PWAD support".

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13 hours ago, AmethystViper said:

What I'm curious about whether or not this new update is console exclusive or if it's gonna show up on PC, and maybe become available to existing owners of Doom I & II on GOG and Steam, seeing that what they shown in the livestream did feature keyboard prompts instead of console ones.

 

DOOM_Classic_Update3.png

I would be genuinely happy to see an official standalone release of Doom on PC that includes proper Steam support. Like hey, give me multiplayer that works with my Steam friends list, I'll take it.

 

8 hours ago, CyberDreams said:

Anyway's to me it seems that Bethesda wants to keep the classic Doom games just that...classic. So if they ever added PWAD support it would probably have to be PWAD's that only play like the original Doom games (aka no freelook, jump ect.) even though i'm sure this port supports those options. That's just what i can gather.

At the moment, it seems any PWADs that they support will have to be actively curated via their new mods section. That's about as good as we'll ever get on console. Anything beyond that, we'll just have to see if they have a PC release hidden up their sleeves.

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I just hope they release it soon , can't wait to play SIGIL and the full version of Final DOOM. Would be nice if it dropped next week for Christmas.

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Sigil patched in? Radical! But that remains one question. What is not coming in the future? TNT 2? Plutonia 2? A version of Master Levels akin to PS3 Doom that is actually playable in coop? Its a mystery and I am starting to like mystery's nahmean?

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15 hours ago, Lollie said:

I would be genuinely happy to see an official standalone release of Doom on PC that includes proper Steam support.

Same, using at least (G)ZDoom as a base. 

Spoiler

But that day may never come due to Bethesda's ignorance for older Doom games.... I will still eat my words if it somehow happens, though.

 

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6 hours ago, AmethystViper said:

I know that but I was referring to this engine update becoming available to those that have the game on GOG and Steam.

 

But...why? Modern source ports have eclipsed anything Bethesda could make in features and functionality, and the GoG and Steam releases are merely Dosbox, as if they expect people to use sourceports. Official modern releases would also get you censored content without wolfenstein features, which messes up PWADs, and the PC crowd here is vocal enough about that and the red crosses.

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2 hours ago, Devalaous said:

 

But...why? Modern source ports have eclipsed anything Bethesda could make in features and functionality, and the GoG and Steam releases are merely Dosbox, as if they expect people to use sourceports. Official modern releases would also get you censored content without wolfenstein features, which messes up PWADs, and the PC crowd here is vocal enough about that and the red crosses.

Because despite the new console Doom's initial launch issues, its developers are working towards making certain features dead simple for players to use. Custom WADs are a big feature for console releases: It is hugely convenient to be able to download new wads (via an officially curated list!) directly through Doom's menu with just a couple clicks, and load them without having to manually reload the entire game. Having this new official port available on PC would signify that Bethesda and Nerve are taking Classic Doom more seriously, and might signify that bigger features are on the horizon — multiplayer being the main one. Imagine being able to just invite friends into a Doom session via your Steam friends-list.

 

On censored content: The Red Cross gets changed in official re-releases simply because they're legally unable to use it. The Red Cross (among other icons) is literally protected by international treaties. Anyone being vocal about that specific change needs to just educate themselves and suck it up.

 

As for the Wolfenstein Soldiers and textures in Doom 2, that may no longer be an issue. Germany lifted the ban on Nazi visuals in video games in 2018.

Quote

Until now, using banned symbols would prevent a video game from being considered for a compulsory age rating - essentially banning it from being sold in stores.

 

The ban on extremist symbols is still in place, but rating body USK said the rules will now be applied to video games in the same way they are used for films. On a case-by-case basis, a game could get past the rating procedure if an artistic or dramatic use is justified.

 

It also said a game which is clearly opposed to the banned group's ideals could qualify - which is the case for many games that require large numbers of Nazi soldiers to be killed by the player.

 

Modern source ports offer a lot of freedom, there's no logical argument against them. But you have to acknowledge a few limitations:

We're still currently stuck downloading archives and using external launchers (or packed-in .bat files) to load mods — the Doom community doesn't really have a Steam Workshop or Creation Club that can be accessed in-game. There's also no hope of having any sort of friends-list functionality to simplify multiplayer setup, leaving us with port-forwarding, server hosting, IP addresses, all the finicky tech nonsense that necessitates having guides on how to set it all up. And even then, netcode quality and features vary from port to port - to the point that a port may even give up on online functionality entirely.

 

These are basically what make an official modern port on PC look like an attractive option — it's for players who just want to be able to play, without messing around with files and settings. Having more ways to play is always a good thing.

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3 hours ago, TheNoob_Gamer said:

Same, using at least (G)ZDoom as a base

There is no reason to do that nor would that ever happen. License complications aside, if they were to release it on the PC it'll remain the same vanilla port, they wouldn't arbitrarily change the code base just and only for a single platform. That's absurd. 

Edited by Edward850

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11 hours ago, Lollie said:

As for the Wolfenstein Soldiers and textures in Doom 2, that may no longer be an issue. Germany lifted the ban on Nazi visuals in video games in 2018.

Still have to be approved on a case-by-case basis, and it'll be hard to convince the German authorities that Nazi visuals are an essential part of a video game when they're used for an optional secret Easter egg pair of levels.

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10 hours ago, Gez said:

Still have to be approved on a case-by-case basis, and it'll be hard to convince the German authorities that Nazi visuals are an essential part of a video game when they're used for an optional secret Easter egg pair of levels.

Yeah lol. Beyond wads that make use of dehacked patches to alter the Wolfen soldiers (I'd be surprised if the devs plan on supporting dehacked patches), I personally don't see any substantial need for any of the Nazi visuals to appear. I haven't checked if they even appear in the new Doom 2 release, but I suspect Nerve would have simply used the same altered Doom 2 wads that they've used for previous re-releases. I only mention it because the option is there this time around.

 

Imo it'd be nice to have altered textures/sprites rather than have it all be removed and replaced, bare walls make the levels look a little drab. But again, optional easter eggs, doesn't break the vanilla experience.

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Well crap, how many times will I end up buying this game? It's going to be my... 5th, 6th purchase?

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On 12/22/2019 at 8:46 PM, Lollie said:

Imo it'd be nice to have altered textures/sprites rather than have it all be removed and replaced, bare walls make the levels look a little drab. But again, optional easter eggs, doesn't break the vanilla experience.

 

The textures and audio have been altered to replace Nazi references instead of the empty wall texture, and the original sprite and monster placement has been restored. This should be present in this next update that includes the curated add-ons. There's a bunch more to this update that hasn't been covered yet, and along with 60FPS, I'm hopeful this will address most of the issues that have built up throughout the years of console Doom ports since the first Xbox

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1 minute ago, sponge said:

 

The textures and audio have been altered to replace Nazi references instead of the empty wall texture, and the original sprite and monster placement has been restored. This should be present in this next update that includes the curated add-ons. There's a bunch more to this update that hasn't been covered yet, and along with 60FPS, I'm hopeful this will address most of the issues that have built up throughout the years of console Doom ports since the first Xbox

 

Any idea on how long it will take for this update to drop? Can't wait.

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1 hour ago, Eurisko said:

Any idea on how long it will take for this update to drop? Can't wait.

69 years from now. 

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