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4everDoomed

Doomguy's movement and speed: Should it get worse after taking too much damage?

Should Doomguys movement speed be reduced when he gets injured ?  

107 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you like it when Doomguy starts to limp or moves slower as soon as his health status drops below e.g. 50% ?

    • No, I don't like any of these effects. Please keep them out of your PWADS !
    • Yes, it might make a PWAD more interesting and challenging.
    • Don't really care. As long as a PWAD is great, I'm up for it!


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I just saw the discussion in the Triton II thread about Doomguy's movement. I'm curious how other Doomworld members think about that issue.

 

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I voted yes but only for PWADs that are designed for it otherwise it can impead your ability to run across gaps etc.

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Hell no! I'm sorry, but I absolutely despise it in games when being injured/shot slows your movement and/or distorts your aim. It's just annoying and impairs gameplay. Some may say it's more challenging and realistic, I say it's annoying.

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Doomguy can take far less hits than most enemies in the game and is always massively outnumbered, but he's really fast. That's his thing. I wouldn't enjoy any mechanic that screwed with this

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I accidentally hit "Don't care" on the poll and don't know how to change it if I even can. Actually I don't like these effects.

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1 hour ago, Nevander said:

Hell no! I'm sorry, but I absolutely despise it in games when being injured/shot slows your movement and/or distorts your aim. It's just annoying and impairs gameplay. Some may say it's more challenging and realistic, I say it's annoying.

 

This.

 

Necrosis (Hexen wad) did this, and it made everything more tedious than it should... 

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Unless you go full realism and are actually remaking Robinson's Requiem in Doom (complete with having to treat your wounds right or they get gangrenous), NO. It's horribly annoying and it results in a negative feedback loop of get hurt -> lose mobility -> can't dodge -> get hurt more which just encourages savescumming.

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This is something that works in tactical shooters or games aiming for realism, so unless it's some kind of total conversion, I don't see it as a good idea.

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No. Unless the PWAD is specifically designed around it, and it's implemented well, but even then I can't see the point in Doom. There have been very few games that I've played where I actually enjoyed healing mechanics. Those are Operation: Flashpoint, STALKER, and Call of Cthulhu: Dark Corners of the Earth. And in those games the healing mechanics were built in from the start. It doesn't mean the mechanics were fun, but they worked well in the games because they were there from the start.

 

Doomguy doesn't need to bandage himself up after getting shot. If anything, he should move faster because he's more pissed off.

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I don't think this mechanic fits well with Doom's core gameplay. Maybe in a targeted Total Conversion it could work, but at that point it isn't what most people would think of as "Doom" anymore.

 

The one place I saw this well implemented in my opinion was Left 4 Dead, where taking damage temporarily slowed the player. This prevented speed-running through the maps and avoiding all the zombies. Something like that could work for a specific TC or map set that involved dodging hordes of enemies without engaging them.

 

But again, that's not really "Doom" as most people think of it.

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1 hour ago, Gez said:

Unless you go full realism and are actually remaking Robinson's Requiem in Doom (complete with having to treat your wounds right or they get gangrenous), NO. It's horribly annoying and it results in a negative feedback loop of get hurt -> lose mobility -> can't dodge -> get hurt more which just encourages savescumming.

This.  I've been playing loads of Vanquish lately, and the "forced overheat" mechanic (which is broadly similar to what's being discussed here) causes exactly this loop, and it's annoying as fuck to not be able to play with good mobility for long periods of time in a mobility-focused game.

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It's an incredibly pointless and frustrating mechanic in any game that has it. You're already at a significant disadvantage at low health just by, y'know, having low health? Why do you gotta slow as sloth snot and unable to dodge, too? It's an unnecessarily harsh punishment for something that's gonna happen eventually, anyway. Think about it. It's bad enough when it happens in Resident Evil. What about something even more mobility centric, like Doom? You're gonna slip up eventually, get hit by that 80 damage Revenant missile and BAM! Your health is low, and now you're in a position where you are completely unable to dodge the next one, and it's not even gonna be your fault. 

 

So, no. I'm not a fan of this mechanic.

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This was annoying in Strife. Take too much damage and be penalized altogether? Leading to inevitable death because your maneuverability got cut in half? That being said, if the PWAD had numerous factors designed to accommodate this in mind, like different behaving enemies and weapons, it could be interesting. But it shouldn't be a default in any other case.

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Strife at least had it happen when you are very near death, like <10 hp. It was still stupid as hell, but at least it didn't happen that often. 

 

OP floated the idea of having your movement speed decrease when you drop below 50. That's insane. 50? I can't think of a single game that does that. Not to mention that the punishment just doesn't fit the crime at all. Raise your hand if your health drops below 50 frequently when you play Doom. Now imagine every time that happens, you start limping. All it takes is one chaingunner. That's cruel.

 

But you don't have to imagine. Hideous Destructor is a thing that exists. You can bleed out, too. Have "fun".

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Trying to implement realistic things in a game as fundamentally daft as Doom is, well, fundamentally daft. It also screws with the gameplay flow which for a finely tuned game like Doom is a massive no no. People have expected Doom to feel and play a certain way for the last quarter century. Don't fix what ain't broke.

If you are making a mod with a new setting, character, sure, that's your game, your call. But if it's Doom - HELL. NO.

Edited by Murdoch

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Might as well give him regenerating health and a cover system, go full on modern First Person Shooter.

 

Just kidding, I think Doomguy's movement speed is a core gameplay mechanic that shouldn't be altered by any means (I'm looking at you Heretic/Hexen).

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I would not enjoy that, I think. Feels like being punished for losing health. 

 

What I could see is a trade off, where a very big and heavy gun slows down your movement. This way you can choose the a trade off of firepower and mobility, thus it becomes tactical. 

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Having finished Strife on Bloodbath, it is sometimes really annoying. It basically means that if you ever reach the point where the movement speed penalty kicks in, you auto-die.

 

Especially with respawning robotic enemies. :/

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23 hours ago, Uni said:

Might as well give him regenerating health and a cover system, go full on modern First Person Shooter.

 

Just kidding, I think Doomguy's movement speed is a core gameplay mechanic that shouldn't be altered by any means (I'm looking at you Heretic/Hexen).

 

I'm still waiting for Chubz to release the 4th installment of Call of Dooty.

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No.

 

Health is a resource, just like ammo. Double-dipping its effects would reduce the gameplay space for players and level designers.

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15 hours ago, seed said:

 

This.

 

Necrosis (Hexen wad) did this, and it made everything more tedious than it should... 

I remember that video. The threshold was 40 hp for all classes, which was bad enough, but you chose the mage, which had the starting health cut to 80 hp. The cleric started with the usual 100 and fighter started with 120. And then you got hit by a stalker or two and you were limping along for the next 15 minutes or so. It's definitely not a good thing.

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Just now, Ichor said:

I remember that video. The threshold was 40 hp for all classes, which was bad enough, but you chose the mage, which had the starting health cut to 80 hp. The cleric started with the usual 100 and fighter started with 120. And then you got hit by a stalker or two and you were limping along for the next 15 minutes or so. It's definitely not a good thing.

 

Bingo.

 

Also the much stronger Wendigos were everywhere, the floor was slippery, and I only had the starting weapon... it was not fun at all... Perfect example of difficulty arising from poor design decisions.

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1 minute ago, seed said:

 

Bingo.

 

Also the much stronger Wendigos were everywhere, the floor was slippery, and I only had the starting weapon... it was not fun at all... Perfect example of difficulty arising from poor design decisions.

Oh yeah, those souped up wendigos with their spread attack. Those were annoying, mostly because they did start out early on instead of later when you had more weapons.

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That kind of game mechanic works in something like Deus Ex but I don't think it would work in Doom levels, not the original maps anyway.

It could be good for a user-made map(s) but I wouldn't want to see it in Doom/Doom II/Final Doom/Doom 64.

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