List of things removed in DOOM 3 (2019)

[MadGuy]

As you know DOOM 3 BFG Edition had some elements from the Original DOOM 3 (2004) removed or altered (mainly in ROE in which they removed a whole map setpiece).

Now with the new Re-Release of DOOM 3 Which is available on XBOX One, PS4, Nintendo Switch and PC (from Bethesda.net) they manage to remove even more things.

 

Those things (so far) are:

- Multiplayer, even if you use source ports to access the option none of the maps are loading

- Classic DOOM games, I have done a lazy check to the binary of the game and I can still find traces of the Classic DOOM engine in it.

- Console, yep no console, recent discovery when I was on the Bethesda forums, the launch argument for the console is not even working

- PC menu bar, not actually removed, but it's inaccessible. The main reason at least for that is due to how poorly SWF UI handles dynamic switching between PC and Controller UI (wait a moment that is not part of the vanilla, that's part of my own port).

 

This is a purely informative topic for those wondering what changes BFG Edition and 2019 versions are having between them.

[printz]

What?! Are they touching DOOM 3 again?!

 

What is this, is it based on original DOOM 3 or on the bfg edition?

[MadGuy]

Just now, printz said:

What?! Are they touching DOOM 3 again?!

 

What is this, is it based on original DOOM 3 or on the bfg edition?

The BFG Edition

[seed]

Ah what? Really? They've made a new version based on the BFG Edition? Amazing.

 

Was it really that difficult to just, you know, add the BFG Edition there instead? And it's now even more stripped down of features. Some of them I can understand honestly, but the console is gone? For what purpose?

[MadGuy]

6 minutes ago, seed said:

Ah what? Really? They've made a new version based on the BFG Edition? Amazing.

 

Was it really that difficult to just, you know, add the BFG Edition there instead? And it's now even more stripped down of features. Some of them I can understand honestly, but the console is gone? For what purpose?

Beats me, slayer club millestons? It's not like they didn't had a way to disable things like achievements if the console is active or anything like that.

[printz]

Maybe they saw that the majority hates DOOM 3 for being too slow and dark, and are slowly defacing it. RIP AND TEAR DOOM 3! RIP AND TEAR ITS GUTS!

[MadGuy]

2 minutes ago, printz said:

Maybe they saw that the majority hates DOOM 3 for being too slow and dark, and are slowly defacing it. RIP AND TEAR DOOM 3! RIP AND TEAR ITS GUTS!

Yeah, at this point I belive we have already played it future ultimate re-release, the DEMO.

[seed]

Makes sense :v .

 

Honestly I just wish they would restore the cut content from the BFG edition and I'd be totally fine with it. Ah, and cut down on the supplies, because the BFG edition carry capacity is ludicrous.

[Herefornow]

Come on that ones my favorite.

[Tetzlaff]

38 minutes ago, printz said:

Maybe they saw that the majority hates DOOM 3 for being too slow and dark, and are slowly defacing it. RIP AND TEAR DOOM 3! RIP AND TEAR ITS GUTS!

 

Bullshit. Doom 3 was a big success for id Software and sold enough copies to justify an expansion.

[Lila Feuer]

Snort. What console nowadays wouldn't handle the original Doom 3? More-so, why not a re-release that gives you the option of extra ammo and accessible flashlight?

[ReaperAA]

2 hours ago, printz said:

Maybe they saw that the majority hates DOOM 3 for being too slow and dark, and are slowly defacing it. RIP AND TEAR DOOM 3! RIP AND TEAR ITS GUTS!

 

1 hour ago, Tetzlaff said:

Bullshit. Doom 3 was a big success for id Software and sold enough copies to justify an expansion.

 

Although I don't like Doom 3 much but like Tetzlaff said, it was a very successful game for its time (infact it was id's best selling game up until that point)

 

Though with the passage of time, the opinion of players have become more and more negative due to the gameplay being slow paced.

[seed]

2 hours ago, Tetzlaff said:

Bullshit. Doom 3 was a big success for id Software and sold enough copies to justify an expansion.

 

It was well received by critics and fans, sold very well, certainly, but even back then it was divisive among community members, just like D2016 and Eternal are now. And there's really no point in pretending that Doom 3, like it or not, wasn't a flawless piece of game, and gameplay-wise it didn't aged very well.

 

1 hour ago, Lila Feuer said:

Snort. What console nowadays wouldn't handle the original Doom 3? More-so, why not a re-release that gives you the option of extra ammo and accessible flashlight?

 

Believe it or not, I'd actually like an "uncut" version of BFG instead. One that restores the cut content, brings back the original ammo capacity as a toggeable option, and of course, bring back the flashlight, another toggle.

 

The new lightning and graphics have grown on me frankly, and after re-watching the E3 footage multiple times a while ago, I seriously doubt the original was ever meant to be pitch dark. That probably has more to do with optimization and the underpowered hardware of the time. An example: HL2 was also visually downgraded before launch. The advanced DX9 shaders presented here, originally showcased in a DX9 AMD HDR presentation, for instance, have been cut from the final product along with other effects as well - yes, cut (water and HDR are two main differences between retail and Lost Coast).

[Plasi Garbo]

why is it so hard for company's who are paid to port these games always fuck it up while fans who do it for free always seem to do it the best
it really seems like a lack of care "they will not notice"

[Lila Feuer]

@Plasi Garbo Dale noticed.

[seed]

26 minutes ago, Plasi Garbo said:

why is it so hard for company's who are paid to port these games always fuck it up while fans who do it for free always seem to do it the best
it really seems like a lack of care "they will not notice"

 

While it certainly is true that many games, remasters, and whatnot are botched nowadays, you're also missing something: Companies make a product to sell it, maybe make some patches for it, and then they eventually move on to the next project. They don't have the time or funds to keep investing into it past a certain point, unless it's e-sports, MOBA, or whatever, which tend to enjoy significantly longer support.

 

Fans are much more committed to their own projects and stick to them for MUCH longer. Look at the classic Doom ports and compare the new Unity remasters. Of course the ports are better by a long shot since they literally had decades to mature and become what they are nowadays. You don't get that kind of stuff with a product that was in development for a few months, a year, or maybe 2.

[ReaperAA]

50 minutes ago, seed said:

An example: HL2 was also visually downgraded before launch. The advanced DX9 shaders presented here, originally showcased in a DX9 AMD HDR presentation, for instance, have been cut from the final product along with other effects as well - yes, cut (water and HDR are two main differences between retail and Lost Coast).

 

I had no idea that HL2 had bloom/HDR even back in 2003. I thought they were first introduced in Lost Coast in 2005.

[Leninova]

 

 

 

 

 

 

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57 minutes ago, seed said:

 

It was well received by critics and fans, sold very well, certainly, but even back then it was divisive among community members, just like D2016 and Eternal are now. And there's really no point in pretending that Doom 3, like it or not, wasn't a flawless piece of game, and gameplay-wise it didn't aged very well.

 

 

Believe it or not, I'd actually like an "uncut" version of BFG instead. One that restores the cut content, brings back the original ammo capacity as a toggeable option, and of course, bring back the flashlight, another toggle.

 

No games are flawless after 15 years or even more. Doom 3 should be taken as a true classic, not as a piece of shit, compared to Eternal/2016. The standards were different back in 2004 and like now. Not accepting this fact is pure ignorance

Doom 3 can be hated, but for REAL reasons. Since every old game can be crap in 2020

 

 

 

[Leninova]

2 minutes ago, Leninova said:

 

Oh great, I can't even write a normal comment. Whatever 

[seed]

53 minutes ago, ReaperAA said:

I had no idea that HL2 had bloom/HDR even back in 2003. I thought they were first introduced in Lost Coast in 2005.

 

I did, long ago tbh, it's a pretty easy video to find if you search for techdemos and E3 stuff of HL2 on Youtube. Lost Coast had them because it was meant to demonstrate the engine capabilities, even more so than the base game due to the limitations of the time - if the HDR, better water reflections, and a few more effects and highly detailed models/textures made it into the base game, it would have murdered the framerate of most people's game, not to dissimilar from how Doom 3 would've tanked framerate if it had the same light sources and effects BFG edition has.

 

Valve themselves said this too - why LS looks better, I mean, but my reasoning for why the features were cut from the base game and it was visually downgraded is most likely the same as Valve's here. While still canon, LS is indeed, a glorified tech demo in essence.

 

51 minutes ago, Leninova said:

No games are flawless after 15 years or even more. Doom 3 should be taken as a true classic, not as a piece of shit, compared to Eternal/2016. The standards were different back in 2004 and like now. Not accepting this fact is pure ignorance.

 

Doom 3 can be hated, but for REAL reasons. Since every old game can be crap in 2020.

 

I suppose this want meant to be the reply. Nice ignorance of objective flaws you've got there buddy, irony is on you, actually. Yes, standards were different back in 2004, but 2004 =/= 1993 when classic Doom first came out, that truly was a period of time when standards did not exist in this industry.

 

And this argument doesn't make it immune to criticism, sorry to burst your bubble, if it's good it can stand on its own feet and speak for itself without needing defenders. Put down the nostalgia goggles, aggression, and leave the fanboy-ism at the door, mkay? Also learn to quote, you just broke the page, now I see a long scroll bar at the bottom of the screen and can scroll it to the right until I see only the black empty background with nothing else.

Edited April 7, 2020 by seed

[Leninova]

You have your opinion, I have mine. 

 

I don't care how you will look down at me because I think Doom 3 is a Doom game. I love it, I consider it a great game, it's part of my childhood. Even your so-called, "true opinion" doesn't change the fact that it was successful, highly accepted and still loved by OTHER DOOM FANS. 

 

I understand nowadays it is extremely cool and basically allotted in the Doom community to call it shit and throw it in the garbage. While it is not fair, and it's disrespectful to those, who like Doom 3, who are fans to it. 

 

Also, with your logic, every game around and before 2004 are crap, because "there were no standards back then." As I have realized, there were, much more than in 2020. 

 

Your bitterness doesn't change anything. You can hate Doom 3. Fine. But don't treat me if I were some kind of fucking retard who doesn't no shit about games. I grew up on them, dude. I know what I'm talking about.

 

BTW, the matter of taste still exists and I still not aware if it's illegal 

 

And I'm saying this all, as I absolutely love Doom 2016 and Eternal

 

(and I'm so sorry, that I'm a dumb bitch who makes mistake sometimes) 

[Senor500]

6 hours ago, MadGuy said:

- Console, yep no console,

This is a sin, why? Really why?

[MadGuy]

4 minutes ago, Senor500 said:

This is a sin, why? Really why?

Not a sin (and I don't recall using that term), just a feature that once existed in previous releases (2004,BFG) and is not available in that version

[seed]

15 minutes ago, Leninova said:

I don't care how you will look down at me because I think Doom 3 is a Doom game. I love it, I consider it a great game, it's part of my childhood. Even your so-called, "true opinion" doesn't change the fact that it was successful, highly accepted and still loved by OTHER DOOM FANS. 

 

Bullshit. No "true opinion" propaganda was in my post to begin with, it was aimed at your aggressive attitude towards me from pointing out something that does exist within the community. It was not meant to say "Doom 3 is not a true Doom game, and it sucks anyway", or to dismiss your opinion as being "incorrect" - it was, indeed, meant to dismiss your logical fallacy that it can't be criticized simply because standards were different at the time. And they were, but that doesn't mean it's immune to any and all criticism, it's still a perfectly valid thing to do, while also taking the historical context into account.

 

15 minutes ago, Leninova said:

I understand nowadays it is extremely cool and basically allotted in the Doom community to call it shit and throw it in the garbage. While it is not fair, and it's disrespectful to those, who like Doom 3, who are fans to it.

 

This sounds like being unable to deal with different opinions. Many like the game, many don't, each for their own reason. It is also not a new phenomenon - opposing views existed back when it originally came out as well, as I've just mentioned. That's a simple reality, nothing more. I agree that there does exist a part of the community who ignores the games that came after classic Doom or Doom 3 and dismisses them as "not Doom", which is silly indeed.

 

15 minutes ago, Leninova said:

Also, with your logic, every game around and before 2004 are crap, because "there were no standards back then." As I have realized, there were, much more than in 2020.

 

No such point was ever made.

 

15 minutes ago, Leninova said:

Your bitterness doesn't change anything. You can hate Doom 3. Fine. But don't treat me if I were some kind of fucking retard who doesn't no shit about games. I grew up on them, dude. I know what I'm talking about.

 

Re-read my previous points, you missed my point the first time around. Also I don't hate Doom 3, as a matter of fact, but I'm not fond of it either. But it's a perfectly valid entry into series regardless of one's own preferences.

 

15 minutes ago, Leninova said:

BTW, the matter of taste still exists and I'm still not aware if it's illegal.

 

It still exists, and it's good that it does ;) .

 

15 minutes ago, Leninova said:

And I'm saying this all, as I absolutely love Doom 2016 and Eternal

 

Groovy.

[Senor500]

7 minutes ago, MadGuy said:

Not a sin (and I don't recall using that term), just a feature that once existed in previous releases (2004,BFG) and is not available in that version

Not saying you used that term, I'm just saying it on my own.

[MadGuy]

18 minutes ago, Senor500 said:

Not saying you used that term, I'm just saying it on my own.

Ok then, as for the question, the console was in general allowing you to not only add cheats but also change cvars on the fly, and it quite a bummer that they disabled the launch argument in order to activate it.

[Mr. Freeze]

Maybe they'll turn on the lights in every area to make the atmosphere even blander than BFG Edition!

[printz]

5 hours ago, Tetzlaff said:

 

Bullshit. Doom 3 was a big success for id Software and sold enough copies to justify an expansion.

Believe me, I consider Doom 3 superior to both Doom 1 and Doom 2 and it should have surpassed them by becoming THE main Doom we play (instead of Doom 2). But I'm clearly in the minority. The same minority that enjoys KDiZD.

[snapshot]

I mean I like Doom 3 but I still acknowledge it's not a flawless masterpiece, I just don't see how I'd recommend it to anyone who's not into Doom, much like how I don't see how I'd recommend Classic Doom to anyone who's not into retro shooters so I guess it doesn't count either way 😛 I'd say it's passable, you're not missing out on too much if you don't play it IMO.

[Senor500]

8 hours ago, printz said:

The same minority that enjoys KDiZD.

I never understood, what is it that people don't like about it?