New Unreal engine vs Doom3s

[Katarhyne]

Yeah. Expect bannage here shortly, of him and likely uniQ, too. Depends on how tight the underwear I pick for today are. You know, he e-mailed me? I won't go into it but basically it was "no you're wrong" and he proceeded to go on about the same things he was going on in the thread DSM closed. You know, even after we already proved him wrong. Sigh.

[AIRmichael]

Fredrik said:

So, assume that the character model makes up 1/100 of the whole scene, and you're still dealing with a rendering time 2000 times worse than realtime.

You're actually right, you didn't say that there was going to be 1.4 millions of polys per character in the new Unreal game. However, you've been arguing in your last five or so posts that 1.4 million in-game polys per model is possible and that despite people actually having shown proof that it isn't possible while you haven't provided any facts to back up what you said.

Go to nvidia.com and watch the whole movie. 1.4 million as a maximum in polys that is for 1 model. If u run 20-30 models in the distance they arent 1.4 million. Keep reading:P

BTW did i say you would get a decend fps running a 1.4 million poly environment useing a geforceFX? I only said it might be possible. Who knows, maybe you will get 2 fps, but its still possible. Remember, its 8x agp running on 500 mhz with copper connections:p

[Katarhyne]

STOP. TALKING.

You're only digging yourself further into a hole. The next Unreal is supposed to come out in the next six months or so. If it only runs at two FPS on the absolute latest and greatest hardware at that time, how well do you think it's going to sell?

[AIRmichael]

I AM A MORON WHO CANNOT UNDERSTAND SIMPLE CONCEPTS!!I AM A MORON WHO CANNOT UNDERSTAND SIMPLE CONCEPTS!!I AM A MORON WHO CANNOT UNDERSTAND SIMPLE CONCEPTS!!I AM A MORON WHO CANNOT UNDERSTAND SIMPLE CONCEPTS!!I AM A MORON WHO CANNOT UNDERSTAND SIMPLE CONCEPTS!!I AM A MORON WHO CANNOT UNDERSTAND SIMPLE CONCEPTS!!I AM A MORON WHO CANNOT UNDERSTAND SIMPLE CONCEPTS!!I AM A MORON WHO CANNOT UNDERSTAND SIMPLE CONCEPTS!!

[Katarhyne]

I never said it was Unreal 2. In fact, I never said anything about Unreal 2, did I? And even if it comes out in a year - if it runs at 2 FPS on a Geforce FX - they're not going to sell many copies.

[AIRmichael]

Katarhyne said:

I never said it was Unreal 2. In fact, I never said anything about Unreal 2, did I? And even if it comes out in a year - if it runs at 2 FPS on a Geforce FX - they're not going to sell many copies.

Unreal 2 is the NEXT unreal. Geez. Why do u call it next then? Because it isnt the next one? lol.

[Zaldron]

http://common.ziffdavisinternet.com/util_get_image/1/0,3363,i=18529,00.gif

Don't tell me the GFX is 15, 20 times faster than the GF4.

[Katarhyne]

Anyway, ignoring him now that he's been banned, I'm surprised the XP4 is doing so badly. I mean, I realize it's from Trident, but it was supposed to be pretty impressive. A high-powered tiler, I believe? Too bad. I've been waiting for a nice tiler to blow all these crappy IMRs away. :/ I also have a hard time believing those numbers for the Radeon 9500 Pro. All it is is a 9700 Pro with a 128-bit memory bus. It's amazing how much that extra memory bandwidth helps - unbelievable, really.

[dsm]

I'm tempted to close this thread too, but at least you're keeping it relatively on-topic so I shan't intervene....yet!

[EsH]

Okay, fine, lets say the GFFx can't render 1.4 million polygons per character.

It doesn't matter.

Even with tesselation into the hundred-thousands, and that for the few characters closest to the viewers, you'll hardly be abe to notice the polygons at all. I just loaded a model into a editor, and subdivided it down. At 28,000 polys, I really can't pick out an individual polygon on guraud-shaded mode.

[Zaldron]

EsH said:

Even with tesselation into the hundred-thousands, and that for the few characters closest to the viewers, you'll hardly be abe to notice the polygons at all. I just loaded a model into a editor, and subdivided it down. At 28,000 polys, I really can't pick out an individual polygon on guraud-shaded mode.

Exactly. Now scrap Gourad for Phong or Blinn and there's no point in having more polys. It's all in the shaders, and that includes the very concept of adaptive tesselation.

[Julian]

Zaldron said:

Exactly. Now scrap Gourad for Phong or Blinn and there's no point in having more polys. It's all in the shaders, and that includes the very concept of adaptive tesselation.

There's still the silhouette issue. That's, imo, the next big step in hardware rendering: smooth silhouette.

[EsH]

I read an article in millimeter concerning The Two Towers. I know this must be old news to many, but I though it was interesting.

It was about how, just as off-line movie cg technology as made it's way into games, game logic and ai are starting to make it's way full force into movies. A lot of the battle scenes in the new LOTR installment are pretty much AI driven. Entities, for example, know that when they're near a ladder, the should climb it, and when they get to the top, they jump off and start fighting. That's really, really cool. It take some huge proccessing to do this level of AI, but it's exciting to realize that one day we really could be storming Gondor, living the scene just as it was presented in the film.

The got me thinking about where games are headed in general. What will this new Unreal engine have to offer, besides pretty graphics? Isn't going to be just Doom3 with soft shadows and higher polycounts? I can just see yet another stupid UT 2003 fiasco in the making here. Those graphics just scream for an over-allocation of funds for in-game cut scenes. At least Doom3 pretty much admits it's an interactive movie, and does it well. Most unreal games try to be games, but are really masquerading as interactive movies.

Good graphics deserver a good game!

[qwerty]

I really don't understand why i got banned. I was just discussing things, i wasnt even personal!!!! U peeps are the ones who call me lamer etc. (Frederik, Katheryne). Have I said anything personal that might hurt your feelings? NO.

This is just like how the nazi's did it. U cant even say your own theories etc, u are just made silent.

No shit that this forum turned into people fighting each other more and more each day. (even moderators laming to each other). And the talks about the magazines being scanned and placed online and linked here.And to the people who are against me: How easy is it to attack me online? I bet you dont dare it to people in real life. Get a life, stop getting upset when we are in a discussion, and make this forum WORK.

What is a forum if u cant even tell what's on your mind. GAME RELATED AND NOT PERSONAL RELATED. Ban that frederik guy who called me lamer, oh afcourse not, the moderator who banned me thinks personal attacks are fine, but subject related things not.

And afcourse the moderator again tries to attack me personal by placing offensive messages under my name that i'm banned. (AIRmichael). You'll get paid for being lame to me, YOU are the one who started it, not me.

[Julian]

Mr. qwerty,

I just deleted your spam, moved the thread you started to post hell and banned you (it seems to be for the second time). What you did in this specific thread, apart from showing atrocious mental disabilities, is what I consider as trolling, except you're not good at it. Furthermore, as far as I can tell you made completly wrong statements.
I didn't ban you in the first place, but I tell you this: one gets what he deserves.

kthxbye, now go away.

[doomedout]

any chance he will get unbanned?
I guess give him another chance?

[Julian]

doomedout said:

any chance he will get unbanned?
I guess give him another chance?

Don't start an off-topic discussion. If needed, start a new thread in R&P stating your opinion.