DoomED and NeXTstep history questions

[Max Cady]

Hi guys!

I'm a creative video maker.

I have a facebook business channel and I want to make a creative visual documentary about the development of Doom with DoomED in action. I want the real thing. Not DoomED from ReDoomEd or anything like that. I want the graphical interface to be the exact same one as it was in 1993 back then. I even want to simulate the booting of Nextstep. But in order to do that, I need to know the real nextstep version John Carmack used to program Doom.

I want some precision here about DoomED and NeXTstep. 

 

Is there any DoomEd pictures (''print screen'') taken from the Nextstep desktop during the development of Doom in 1993?

Adobe illustrator 5.0 is from 1993, so I guess it is a historical picture but again, maybe it's still a simulator with that window in it as it was before...

 

1-If you look at the first and second picture, are those pics taken from the Nextcube desktop during the development of Doom or they came afterward through a simulation?

 

2-If those pics were really taken from Romero's desktop in 1993, why are those maps very different with the third picture with Romero in it? The first 2 pics, the maps are white. On Romero,s desktop, it's black. 

Is it possible that DoomED simulator from the Nextstep 3.3 simulator have different graphical interface than the historical DoomED version from 1993? 

 

 

3-The keyboard that Romero used in the picture is a AT101. 

But what was the computer and it's screen?? What is the name of it? 

 

4- (It is solved. John Romero answered me on that specific question and he said that it was a mistake. DoomED worked with nextstep 3.0. So ignore the question below. :-))

 

If you read this article from Romero (forth picture) about the development of Doom, it says that he used Nextstep 3.3 for DoomED and Quake.

Well it's not logical since the version 3.3 only existed after Doom 1 was released: 1995.

I'm lost.

Can someone tell me?

 

 

 

Thx a lot! 

I want my creative video montage documentary to be as much precise as possible. I really don't want any mistakes. :-)

 

 

 

Edited May 23, 2020 by bipolarmaximus

[Redneckerz]

Redoomed is the same thing tho practically

 

However regarding Nextstep, see the Wiki page. It also contains a link i added to NeXTDoom, the Doom build by id.

[Dark Pulse]

I've got a VMDK with NeXTStep 3.3 and DoomEd on it, so you can actually run the real thing, assuming you don't mind jumping through hoops with VirtualBox or something.

[Max Cady]

On 5/21/2020 at 7:24 PM, Redneckerz said:

Redoomed is the same thing tho practically

 

However regarding Nextstep, see the Wiki page. It also contains a link i added to NeXTDoom, the Doom build by id.

Redoomed is not the exact same interface. There is a difference. look at the pics. Redoomed is the last image. Look, it's not the same interface. Letters are not the exact same, the map details are not the same. If you look closely, on Redoomed there is dots at the intersections on the map. On Doomed, it's squares. 

I am that precise. If I can have a hand on one of the actual Doomed like it was back then, it would be awesome!

 

By the way, there is a lot of links. What the link is called? Nextdoom?

Edited May 23, 2020 by bipolarmaximus

[Redneckerz]

8 minutes ago, bipolarmaximus said:

There is a lot of links. What the link is called? Nextdoom?

Its the link underneath ''External links'' that starts the download.

 

You will need an emulator or Virtual Box to run it, however.

[Max Cady]

19 hours ago, Dark Pulse said:

I've got a VMDK with NeXTStep 3.3 and DoomEd on it, so you can actually run the real thing, assuming you don't mind jumping through hoops with VirtualBox or something.

I am very very curious. I know I can run Doomed on a nextstep 3.3, I wonder what it looks like. Is it the exact same interface as redoomed on linux or mac? Cause I don't want that. 

I need a doomed with that exact same interface. If I really really can't, I will change every differences there is on REdoomed with special programs to make it look like it's Doomed. I use photoshop and sony vegas.

[Max Cady]

26 minutes ago, Redneckerz said:

Its the link underneath ''External links'' that starts the download.

 

You will need an emulator or Virtual Box to run it, however.

Got it

Edited May 23, 2020 by bipolarmaximus

[Max Cady]

3 minutes ago, Redneckerz said:

Its the link underneath ''External links'' that starts the download.

 

You will need an emulator or Virtual Box to run it, however.

I really suck when it comes to computer. Do you have a link for a virtual box so that I can download it?

[Morpheus666]

@bipolarmaximus https://www.dosbox.com/

 

The one thing i always use

[Max Cady]

17 minutes ago, Morpheus666 said:

@bipolarmaximus https://www.dosbox.com/

 

The one thing i always use

Thx man! You're awesome!

[cambreaKer]

Romero might have used doomed in nextstep 3.3 for ultimate doom maps

[Max Cady]

4 minutes ago, cambreaKer said:

Romero might have used doomed in nextstep 3.3 for ultimate doom maps

Possible. I read somewhere that he used that: http://www.doombuilder.com/

 

But I cannot remember where exactly.

[Morpheus666]

@bipolarmaximus He used Doom builder for the addon SIGIL, Which was a 5th episode to the Ultimate Doom, also it's valuable to note that this was after he left ID software a few years back.

[cambreaKer]

11 minutes ago, bipolarmaximus said:

Possible. I read somewhere that he used that: http://www.doombuilder.com/

 

But I cannot remember where exactly.

doom builder came out in 2003, and ultimate doom came out in 1995.

[Redneckerz]

1 hour ago, bipolarmaximus said:

I really suck when it comes to computer. Do you have a link for a virtual box so that I can download it?

VirtualBox download page

41 minutes ago, Morpheus666 said:

@bipolarmaximus https://www.dosbox.com/

 

The one thing i always use

That's not what the user is asking however.

[cybdmn]

59 minutes ago, Morpheus666 said:

@bipolarmaximus https://www.dosbox.com/

 

The one thing i always use

 

 

Why didn't you just talk about things you have any clue about?

[cybdmn]

1 hour ago, bipolarmaximus said:

I am very very curious. I know I can run Doomed on a nextstep 3.3, I wonder what it looks like. Is it the exact same interface as redoomed on linux or mac?

 

At least, running NextStep on a VM will be your best chance, beside buying a real NeXTStation or Cube. The first version of NextStep running on x86 machines is 3.1.

[Dark Pulse]

2 hours ago, bipolarmaximus said:

I am very very curious. I know I can run Doomed on a nextstep 3.3, I wonder what it looks like. Is it the exact same interface as redoomed on linux or mac? Cause I don't want that. 

I need a doomed with that exact same interface. If I really really can't, I will change every differences there is on REdoomed with special programs to make it look like it's Doomed. I use photoshop and sony vegas.

ReDoomed is very close, if not functionally identical. All it really is is a port of the code to Cocoa, which is the modern descendent of NeXTSTEP.

 

I mean, if you want to be really, truly, totally certain, you should either run NeXTSTEP via a VM (or fork over a hugely princely sum for an actual NeXT Cube), but in terms of how it seems to work compared to how I futzed around with it briefly in a VM, it's pretty much the same.

[Morpheus666]

2 hours ago, cybdmn said:

 

 

Why didn't you just talk about things you have any clue about?

I know what i am talking about, unlike your grammar. I was wanting to help him because it was to my knowledge that he wanted a means to use the software, however he never specified what he was attempting to do, so therefore i couldn't provide him with what he needed at that time.

 

I apologize if i come off as harshly but people need to understand that no one is perfect and people make mistakes, Also Oracle is the best vm to use for free.

[Max Cady]

3 hours ago, Morpheus666 said:

I know what i am talking about, unlike your grammar. I was wanting to help him because it was to my knowledge that he wanted a means to use the software, however he never specified what he was attempting to do, so therefore i couldn't provide him with what he needed at that time.

 

 

It's simple. 

I am a video creator, and I want to make a creative video documentary as it was back then when John Romero worked on Doomed. In my video, I want a close up of the desktop. 

I just want to play Doomed as it was back then in 1993. Same interface, same look. Redoomed is not the same in terms of look. There is differences. Maybe that it's not possible so I will try to make it look like the real Doomed using photoshop and sony vegas.

 

To be clear, I want in my video to simulate the boot of the right nextstep version and animate the work of John Romero of doomed. I am able to animate a video through a picture with photoshop and be like it was before.

 

 

Edited May 23, 2020 by bipolarmaximus

[Max Cady]

7 hours ago, Redneckerz said:

VirtualBox download page

That's not what the user is asking however.

thx man!

[Max Cady]

6 hours ago, cybdmn said:

 

At least, running NextStep on a VM will be your best chance, beside buying a real NeXTStation or Cube. The first version of NextStep running on x86 machines is 3.1.

Even if I could have a nextcube wouldn't help me cause I also need the original doomed :-)

[cybdmn]

14 hours ago, Morpheus666 said:

I was wanting to help him because it was to my knowledge that he wanted a means to use the software, however he never specified what he was attempting to do, so therefore i couldn't provide him with what he needed at that time.

 

Completely wrong, he wrote what he want to do in his first post.

 

Quote

I have a facebook business channel and I want to make a creative visual documentary about the development of Doom with DoomED in action. I want the real thing. Not DoomED from ReDoomEd or anything like that. I want the graphical interface to be the exact same one as it was in 1993 back then. I even want to simulate the booting of Nextstep.

 

 

[Morpheus666]

7 hours ago, cybdmn said:

 

Completely wrong, he wrote what he want to do in his first post.

 

 

 

Seriously? your still going on about that? wtf get a life.

[cybdmn]

47 minutes ago, Morpheus666 said:

wtf get a life.

 

You have won! Congratulations!

[Max Cady]

WOW! John Romero answered my questions!! I can't believe it. I'm speechless. He is very implicated with his fans. I must say, I am a little bit annoying but even though, he's kind.

 

I asked 4 questions:

 

Hi John!

 

I wrote a long to you on another address that was not a email. Maybe it was inappropriate. it's better to write you here.

 

I have question about Nextstep and DoomED.

 

I am a video maker and I want to make a creative video montage documentary about the production of Doom.

 

First pic:

What is the computer you used in this picture for DoomED?

Why the map was black instead of white like in the second pic?

 

Second and third pic:

Are those actual real images from 1993 when you were working with DoomED?  

 

Was the desktop of Nextstep 3.0 in color or black and white?

I saw some videos of the Nextstep 3.0 booting and it was black and white. But I can also see Steve jobs with this very same version and it was in color. 

 

(First 2 pics: John sent me those in those order.)

(The other pics: In order as he talked like ''First pic''...)

 

thx John!

 

His answer:

 

Hi Max-Olivier,

 

First pic: the computer I’m using is an Intel-based NEXTSTEP 3.0 workstation. There’s a DOS PC behind my back on the other part of the wrap-around desk in my office. I used the DOS PC to run DOOM whenever I made level updates or code changes. The CRT is a 22-inch NEC Multisync.

 

The map is black because I changed it to be Dark Mode since the white bothered my eyes. The screenshot with white is an early screenshot of DoomEd.

 

Second and third pic: Yes, those are the real images from 1993. They’ve been around for years on website in interviews, etc. They weren’t taken in modern times using a VM.

 

The NEXTSTEP 3.0 desktop could be any color. They had 16-bit color since the color Turbostations. The older NEXTSTEP 2.0 was black and white.

 

Booting NEXTSTEP was always black and white, no matter which version you had. For DOOM, we duplicated the NEXTSTEP boot sequence.

 

 

 

Cheers,

John

 

 

 

 

[Redneckerz]

1 hour ago, bipolarmaximus said:

WOW! John Romero answered my questions!! I can't believe it. I'm speechless. He is very implicated with his fans. I must say, I am a little bit annoying but even though, he's kind.

 

I asked 4 questions:

 

Hi John!

 

I wrote a long to you on another address that was not a email. Maybe it was inappropriate. it's better to write you here.

 

I have question about Nextstep and DoomED.

 

I am a video maker and I want to make a creative video montage documentary about the production of Doom.

 

First pic:

What is the computer you used in this picture for DoomED?

Why the map was black instead of white like in the second pic?

 

Second and third pic:

Are those actual real images from 1993 when you were working with DoomED?  

 

Was the desktop of Nextstep 3.0 in color or black and white?

I saw some videos of the Nextstep 3.0 booting and it was black and white. But I can also see Steve jobs with this very same version and it was in color. 

 

(First 2 pics: John sent me those in those order.)

(The other pics: In order as he talked like ''First pic''...)

 

thx John!

 

His answer:

 

Hi Max-Olivier,

 

First pic: the computer I’m using is an Intel-based NEXTSTEP 3.0 workstation. There’s a DOS PC behind my back on the other part of the wrap-around desk in my office. I used the DOS PC to run DOOM whenever I made level updates or code changes. The CRT is a 22-inch NEC Multisync.

 

The map is black because I changed it to be Dark Mode since the white bothered my eyes. The screenshot with white is an early screenshot of DoomEd.

 

Second and third pic: Yes, those are the real images from 1993. They’ve been around for years on website in interviews, etc. They weren’t taken in modern times using a VM.

 

The NEXTSTEP 3.0 desktop could be any color. They had 16-bit color since the color Turbostations. The older NEXTSTEP 2.0 was black and white.

 

Booting NEXTSTEP was always black and white, no matter which version you had. For DOOM, we duplicated the NEXTSTEP boot sequence.

 

Cheers,

John

Really wholesome that John responded to you extensively. Its great that he is so approachable that way.

Glad you got your questions answered OP!

[Max Cady]

8 hours ago, Redneckerz said:

Really wholesome that John responded to you extensively. Its great that he is so approachable that way.

Glad you got your questions answered OP!

What is OP?

 

Yes, and he even helped me to install doomed. He gave me links. :-)

[Max Cady]

9 hours ago, Redneckerz said:

Really wholesome that John responded to you extensively. Its great that he is so approachable that way.

Glad you got your questions answered OP!

My questions that you see is only a part of a bigger question that I posted elsewhere to John. That is why he's talking about the boot cause I explained my project.

The screenshot in white that he is talking about is not in this thread. it was on a website where I asked that question.

[cambreaKer]

28 minutes ago, bipolarmaximus said:

What is OP?

it means original poster, i think