Thoughts on the Fallout Games?

[Rudolph]

32 minutes ago, hybridial said:

There's no reason not to play New Vegas instead, they're stand alone stories.

Oh, I already have New Vegas on my wishlist. I am just waiting for the right time to get it.

 

I guess what I should have really asked is if I should bother with Fallout 3 at all, since it is reportedly inferior in every respect to New Vegas.

[_bruce_]

Fallout 3 was he first game of the series that I played and I really dug it.

 

Later on I got my hands on part 1 and 2 and I couldn't believe how atmospheric and fascinating these games were... entering The Glow in part 1 was an experience I'll never forget - pure magic.

Unfortunately anything that came after 1&2 was a huge letdown in comparison. NewVegas seems like the best "afterbirth" to me though whereas part 4 was fun for a week and then never played again. Seems more like a random game mimicking something it does not understand.

 

Luckily there's outstanding user made content for the old games - thanks to some talented Russian fans.

 

 

[Dimon12321]

Fallout 3 disappointed me with its battle system and quest outcomes with devil/angel choices, like I can't do anything in good conscience and therefore identify myself with ingame character. I think I'll refuse to take it for free in Epic Games Store during its free period (20 - 27 October).

 

New Vegas has fixed it all. I'm satisfied with this game, even though I didn't manage to pass this game. Too many DLCs does it have.

 

Fallout 4 fixed some mistakes, but it still has problems. Sandbox features, you know, building your villages and improving "happiness" of your people is a time consumer and I didn't find anything which can be paid off for this. The storyline is boring. 

 

Fallout series is meant to be long. Really long! It's one of those rare cases, when I like the series, but it's just not for me. Maybe some day, when I forget what is "full game walkthrough" (aka. 100%), I'll replay some of those.

Edited October 16, 2022 by Dimon12321

[Mr Masker]

I've enjoyed the Fallout series for a good bit of my life now. For a while I went through a phase of "New Vegas good, 3 and 4 are rubbish, Bethesda bad, Obsidian good" but now I can see the qualities of those games, and laugh at the 8-hour response videos reiterating the same stuff about how Fallout 3 bad lol.

 

Fallout New Vegas is a great RPG but my god, it's most vocal community is so circlejerky it's just embarrassing.

 

 

[Dexiaz]

Fallout New Vegas is the best if we're talking about 3D FPS Fallouts.

 

Fallout 1/2 is a different...situation. Cool storyline, cool concepts, but hard to play if you never played it as a kid back in late 1990s.

 

P.S.: Also waiting for this GZDoom project :>

 

[StodgyAyatollah]

There's an extremely small handful of PC games I grew up with that I rank to be above all others. Fallout 1 & 2 are firmly among them alongside the classic Doom and Diablo series. I'm glad there are still a handful of mods being released for them. Stuff like Nevada, Olympus 2207 and Resurrection. BOS tactics was an interesting but mostly forgettable diversion. BOS the console arpg was so bad that it was kind of entertaining but still really bad. Betheda Fallouts are soulless cash grabs on a garbage engine. New Vegas seems alright but being on Bethesda's trash engine I just can't get into it. Would probably love it if it were a proper crpg. I'm glad some indie devs took influence from the classic series with games like Underrail and Atom rpg. I'm looking forward to seeing what New Blood accomplishes with their teased Fallout-like.

[Rudolph]

What is most intimidating with Fallout 1 for me is having to figure out where to go while there is a time limit. It is weird how the developers did not think to implement a customizable difficulty system like System Shock 1's, where you can turn off the timer altogether!

 

[LadyMistDragon]

I've never played the first two Fallout games.

 

Fallout 3 was an incredibly immersive and sandbox-y experience, although the RPG elements seems to be weaker than the originals. And the sidequests were fine when they didn't cross into fucking comic-book territory (I think you know which one I'm referring to here).

 

New Vegas definitely hits more of the Fallout vibes but the story felt entirely directionless. Mr. House was a good villain though and the factions' identity was considerably more elaborated upon than F3. It's probably more replay able though.

[Rudolph]

Ah, fuck it: all this talk of Fallout made me feel like giving the first one another shot, since I already own it anyway. Wish me courage! :P

[Gez]

For Fallout 3, the best way to play it is through Fallout New Vegas with the Tale of Two Wastelands mod. It gives you access to the slightly improved FNV gameplay (multiple ammo types, crafting, etc.) and also access to most of the FNV mods which are much better and more up to date than the FO3 mods if you are into replacing models, animations, textures, interface, etc. with better ones.

[CittyKat112]

Fallout 1 is pretty good, but I hated it on my first playthrough because I didn't pay attention to the timer so I got a bad ending for all of the towns. Subsequent two playthroughs were a lot better. I think this game in the series is the best in terms of story and atmosphere but I didn't like it as much as Fallout 1. Fallout 2 is great, I liked it more than Fallout 1 tbh because it has much more content, and there's a lot of small gameplay improvements, I had much more fun exploring the map in Fallout 2 than in FO1. I can't thank Black Isle devs enough for CHRYSALIS HIGHWAYMAN...

I loved Fallout 3 because it was my first introduction to the series but after having played New Vegas I can't see myself playing it ever again... And I played Fallout 3 when I was in school so I had a shitload of free time and was playing it non-stop for like a month or two... At some point I started noticing that there really isn't much content in the game, the map is pretty big but there's only like 20+ side quests and they're not much interesting. And after I played New Vegas a few years later I started seeing Fallout 3 as an overhyped steaming pile of shit where there's seemingly no room for roleplaying because all your choices are shallow and meaningless. I really liked exploring the map though, it felt like an adventure and that's the only thing Fallout 3 does better than NV in my opinion. I didn't play Fallout 4.

[StodgyAyatollah]

33 minutes ago, Rudolph said:

What is most intimidating with Fallout 1 for me is having to figure out where to go while there is a time limit. It is weird how the developers did not think to implement a customizable difficulty system like System Shock 1's, where you can turn off the timer altogether!

 

It even felt a bit intimidating back in the day but the way the game works time really only passes on the overworld and there aren't a lot of locations so unless you're doing a lot of needless travel you don't have to worry about it very much. Once you get your first objective done you're free to do whatever.

[DoomPlayer00]

I really like FO1 & 2 but I do understand why fans of 3D game struggle to get into them. First 2 Fallouts are punishing to newcomers (myself included, took me well over a dozen restarts in both games before I managed to make a character who wouldn't struggle in combat situations too much). Overall though, I think they're great RPG games and have aged rather well.

 

I also like Fallout Tactics. Its gameplay reminds me a lot of first 3 Commandos games which I absolutely love. Fo:T tried something new and I appreciate it for that.

 

Fallout 3 was my introduction to the Fallout series so I view it fondly and haven't come to hate it over the years unlike some other fans. There are many things the game could've done differently but overall it's not a bad game and certainly not the worst in the series. I do think the DLCs were a bit weak but do enjoy Broken Steel's increased level cap and Pitt's aestethics.

 

Fallout New Vegas is considered best in the series by many and understandably so. I liked all the callbacks to the original 2 games and New Vegas overall fixed many things that were wrong with FO3. DLCs were also all great. I am sad about all the cut content though.

 

Fallout 4... Well, it's an alright game on its own but a bad Fallout game in my opinion. Don't get me wrong, the game did feel good at first. Gunplay's satisfying, building bases is fun and I really liked the companion characters (Preston is underappreciated follower tbh). That said, I really hate how overdone the settlement building mechanic was and how poorly level scaling was implemented in the game.

The weapon crafting and ability systems were also rather poorly thought out. There is no incentive to try different part combinations for weapons since only stat that matters is damage and random abilities on enemies' dropped weapons made FO4 feel more like a looter shooter than an RPG.

I won't bother with explaining downsides of a voiced protagonist and the story since those are pretty much self-explanatory.

 

I have not played Fallout:BoS, FO4's DLCs or 76 therefore I do not have an opinion on those.

[Rudolph]

Damn, for my current playthrough, I have decided to basically role-play as the Doomslayer in the sense that I have put all my points into Endurance, Strength and Agility so I could rip and tear, so to speak. Unfortunately, I had to do it at the expense of other stats and now my character cannot speak and everybody is calling me a literal moron. While this is funny, it seems to make the game much trickier than I expected: in my earlier attempted playthroughs, I distinctively remember acquiring a rope in Shady Sands in order to explore Vault 15, but here, no sign of a rope so far.

 

Also, and I am not sure if it is related, but I appear to be unable to light flares up. Is Intelligence linked to the character's ability to use items more sophisticated than weapons and healing items? I have tried Google, but so far, I have not gotten any answers.

Edited October 16, 2022 by Rudolph

[StodgyAyatollah]

33 minutes ago, Rudolph said:

I distinctively remember acquiring a rope in Shady Sands in order to explore Vault 15, but here, no sign of a rope so far.

Item placement is always the same so there are always two ropes in shady sands. As for making a dumb character INT is used as a modifier for how many skill points you get when you level up on top of everything else so it will make the game harder in the long run. Doesn't make things impossible but is probably not the best build for a first play through, especially for anyone who hasn't played many old CRPGs. It's better suited for a "challenge" run once familiar with the game. I love the game but it isn't balanced fairly for some builds. 

[rzh]

Fallout 1 is the only canon game I keep replaying.

I'm going to explain why, but people might find it hard to understand and I'm also going to go on tangents.

 

In general I like games that are slow paced and on a small scale, which is why I also like Diablo 1 more than 2.

Fallout 2 is too big, has too much overlapping content (either thematically or mechanics-wise) and lacks atmosphere compared to Fallout 1.

Fallout 1 also feels darker. Also has better locations and a better villain.

 

Feel free to skip the following rant, because it's only partially related to what I said above.

 

Spoiler

 

In both Fallout and Diablo's case, I feel like the comparison between the original game and the sequel is sort of like comparing folk tales/ fairy tales/ mythology to fantasy settings.

Generally, I see fantasy unfavorably compared to folk tales.

Folk tales are more symbolic, more mysterious, more genuine and personal and also, usually, batshit insane and unique.

Fantasy settings are elaborate, detailed but also suffer from try hard syndrome or too much filler.

Side note, westerns are also kinda like folk tales which is probably why I like them as well.

In fantasy you get a lore dump of how this god created this world and these other gods too and satan or someshit created this and now it's a Balkan-tier dick measuring contest between races with thousands of years of history, all with their own rules, settlements, cultures etc.

The main hero is probably chosen by the gods to end this millennia old conflict but he probably dies and gets reincarnated and he's actually an angel and this magic artifact and that world-spanning adventure and his party and so on.

Nerd shit.

In folklore, the king actually rules over about 20 people in his village, some ogre showed up out of nowhere and kidnapped some woman and some cocky bastard is going to wreck that ogre's shit with help from his lake nymph sidehoe or his talking horse or something.

Where does the ogre come from? Who cares, he doesn't keep The Complete Ogre Biology, Genealogy and History Explained (Abridged) in a chest in his shitty tower.

How strong he is? If he pointed his chin up when he spat, we wouldn't have the Sun.

How does the hero defeat him? Some Scooby-Doo or Tom & Jerry bullshit probably. Most likely he oiled the steps in the Ogre tower and abused the Ogre's limited mental faculties to trick him into stepping on the lubricated steps, leading to the Ogre breaking his neck.

How much training does this hero have? Is he like this super badass assassin-royal guard-spartan elite-knight legionnaire-barbarian? Nah, he's just some local dipshit, potentially the King's son or nephew.

What about muh lore? Don't care, not relevant.

 

In the same way, in Fallout 1 the Vault Dweller was chosen for some reason, but not destined to save the world or some other shit like that.

It could be because it's a suicide mission and the 13 on the jumpsuit represents VD's IQ, or it could be because he's gigachad, it's up to the player and the stat allocation.

The BoS are a bunch of larping hobos, a dozen people in a shitty little bunker.

The Hub is the biggest settlement of pure humans and it's like two streets of shacks.

The Master's Army is probably about a hundred Super Mutants, 150-200 at most, and we never even get to see that many.

The Glow is just a secret base that got fucked up.

Your items and weapons are limited in number and each fill a specific role.

 

In Fallout 2, you're the Chosen One, the nephew of the Vault Dweller and the son of the leader of your tribe, who embarks upon a quest in all of California for the mighty GECK, but your plans change halfway through, when you realize you're going to have to defeat the technically legitimate government of the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, who uses a specifically designed monster as their poster boy.

There's the normal city, the arrogant city, the gangster city, help shape their geopolitical and ideological issues.

A billion companions with backstories, and a million weapons await you.

It's so tiresome, zero fun in replaying the game, because there's so much shit to do that it ends up feeling like a chore.

I will say however, that both Fallout 2 and Diablo 2 have QoL improvements over the original and really good music, so they're still great games.

Thematically they don't fit me though.

 

 

New Vegas is also a lot of fun, but I can only finish the game with Caesar's Legion now, so it loses some replayability and some aspects of the game are undeveloped.

While it does suffer from the issues I mentioned in the spoiler, I feel like getting to meet most of the people relevant to the setting mitigates the problem and makes you feel like you're creating lore instead of suffering through it.

Fallout 3 is really mediocre, but The Pit is amazing and the whole game should've been like that.

I haven't really played 4 and never touched 76.

Tactics is also really cool.

[Rudolph]

25 minutes ago, rzh said:

Fallout 1 is the only canon game I keep replaying.

Are there QoL mods for Fallout 1 you recommend?

[Capellan]

9 hours ago, Rudolph said:

I guess what I should have really asked is if I should bother with Fallout 3 at all, since it is reportedly inferior in every respect to New Vegas.

 

Fallout 3 has a good opening sequence and multiple very good parts, even if the resolution of the main plotline isn't very good.  It certainly shows its age now, but I played hundreds of hours in the Capital Wasteland, and don't regret them.

 

Note that if you get Fallout: New Vegas, you can get the Tale of Two Wastelands mod, which allows you to play 3 as a mod within FNV.  That gives you somewhat better graphics and a more robust crafting mini-game.

 

Fallout 4 is much prettier than either.  It has numerous good bits, but the weakest main storyline overall.  The DLC is also rather uneven.

 

Fallout 76 has the whole "online multiplayer only" thing against it, but the basic shooting and building elements are okay, and there are definitely some cool post apocalyptic environments in it.  You can mostly just play it as a solo game if you want to (that's my preference).  It does suffer from a lack of any real 'endgame' that isn't tied hard to the multiplayer elements though.

[Wyrmwood]

To answer the topic : Fallout 1 and 2 are two of the best CRPGs of all time only bettered by Baldurs Gate and Planescape Torment. I didn't gel with Fallout 1 immediately because I thought the whole game was timed and played 2 first. After I returned to 1, found the timer ends after a couple of hours or so of gameplay and liked that one best.

 

Fallout Tactics is not terrible but not fantastic either, the much older Xcom games are better.

 

Fallout 3 I didn't like that much on release, too pissed off it wasn't a proper RPG and felt too much like Oblivion. I replayed a few years back with a shit ton of mods that turned it into a survival game and enjoyed it much better.

 

New Vegas was a huge improvement and I'm an Obsidian fan anyway, no point in saying more everyone know it's great. It seemed on release I was in a minority for far preferring it to 3 but it seems public opinion changed. Guess maybe Bethesda fans liked 3 best but Fallout fans like NV.

 

Fallout 4 was pretty disappointing on release, I modded the crap out of that too and ended up enjoying it for a bit but it was just to unstable with or without mods, kept getting broken quests, crashes or falling through the floor shit, corrupt saves, etc. Never want to try again.

 

Fallout 76 just no.

 

@Rudolph I'd honestly recommended you roll a new character for your first playthrough, it's a proper role playing game not a min/max Arpg, you'll have a much more fun if your character can actually talk. Though I always loved the fact you could at least try to play as the big guy from Goonies.

[RDETalus]

Fallout Tactics is my favorite Fallout game because it features a much more interesting depiction of the Brotherhood of Steel compared to the other Fallout games.

 

The game is about an ideological splinter faction of the BOS that ends up stranded in Chicago. What sets them apart from their eastern or western cousins is that they are aggressively expansionist, willing to share technology, and have a complete lack of xenophobia. But they'll also throw you in a forced labor camp if you oppose them. They have a very "we're gonna free the shit out of you" ethos.

 

If you run into a BOS patrol on the east or west coast, it's going to be dudes in power armor and maybe a scribe. If you run into a BOS patrol in the midwest, it's going to be a gang of half-feral tribals high on voodoo drugs with a ghoul specialist in tow.

Throughout the game, you'll act as both a soldier and a representative for the BOS. There isn't much role playing in this game at all, but you'll still experience the interesting narrative situations that play out as the BOS interacts with the local communities around it.

If you decide to try it, there is one quality of life mod that is worth considering: https://www.moddb.com/mods/fallout-tactics-redux

Edited October 17, 2022 by RDETalus

[Murdoch]

46 minutes ago, Wyrmwood said:

Fallout 4 was pretty disappointing on release, I modded the crap out of that too and ended up enjoying it for a bit but it was just to unstable with or without mods, kept getting broken quests, crashes or falling through the floor shit, corrupt saves, etc. Never want to try again.

 

It's weird, because my experience with Fallout 4 is precisely the opposite. It has been the most stable for me modded or otherwise. Get the wrong combination of mods and I did get get chaos though. I have a heavily modded playthrough right now that is rock solid. Don't think it's crashed me once.

 

My thoughts... I have not played the original games much. I want to, but I cannot stand turn based combat. I find it grating, dull, and puts too much of the combat result into factors out of my control.

Fallout 3: Good world design (for the time), bad quest design.

Fallout New Vegas: Superb quests and writing, especially for the tight timeframe. So-so world design. Some good spots, some a bit dull.

Fallout 4: Major issues "out of the box" with poor writing, interface and quest design but I love the world design. Definitely needs a lot of modding to make it truly good.

Fallout 76: Yeah nah.

[Xim]

I have been a fan of Fallout since I was a kid, before the development of the 3rd. I watched my older brother play it a few times and then started playing myself. So I've got a lot of thoughts on it.

 

The first two games I thought was amazing. Immediately got me hooked on the franchise. The game-play, the story, the factions and creatures, the guns and especially the convo system. The second one I think is superior in almost every way, but you really need to play the first one first. There are more QOL features in the second one to make it easier on the surface, but they throw much more of a challenge at you, even from the start, and those extra features become much needed necessities for the second chapter. Fallout Tactics is another old one, but I don't really recommend it unless you're a huge Fallout nerd, and even then it's still worth skipping. It's non cannon and the game-play feels like playing a clunky RTS. (edit, but I might want to check out that mod RDETalus posted)

 

When the new games came out, I was actually very happy to have more people to talk about Fallout with. Game play wise they are very different but I personally feel like they really capture the whole vibe of the game, I still feels like Fallout to me. So I think both eras are pretty good. Fallout 4 is okay, but it was weird, in some ways. I haven't played 76 yet, it looked terrible at first but after the updates and watching others play it I might pick it up some day.

Overall I'd say my favorite two would be Fallout 2 and New Vegas. The others are still good but those two probably have the best story-lines, and game-play wise they are better versions of each of their predecessors.

 

EDIT: Btw, word of advice on playing the first two. It took me several characters before I figured out on that suited my play style, so be patient and don't feel too bad if you have to restart the game. Make several save files just in case too.
But here's a fun fact, the same character build I use in the first two is the same I use in the new ones (speech, smalls guns and energy weapons).

Edited October 17, 2022 by Xim : RDETalus shared a mod for a game that may make me reconsider my whole opinion on it

[Wyrmwood]

35 minutes ago, Murdoch said:

It's weird, because my experience with Fallout 4 is precisely the opposite. It has been the most stable for me modded or otherwise. Get the wrong combination of mods and I did get get chaos though. I have a heavily modded playthrough right now that is rock solid. Don't think it's crashed me once.

 

I may be tempted to try again on my newer PC, but yeah even unmodded was getting crashes to desktop walking in certain spots like near the Red Rocket gas station. Don't know if I can go through the opening again though must of played that part 10 times or more. It's a shame because with mods it's actually a pretty damn good game.

[Murdoch]

6 minutes ago, Wyrmwood said:

 

I may be tempted to try again on my newer PC, but yeah even unmodded was getting crashes to desktop walking in certain spots like near the Red Rocket gas station. Don't know if I can go through the opening again though must of played that part 10 times or more. It's a shame because with mods it's actually a pretty damn good game.

 

Might be worth grabbing a save off of Nexus Mods at the Vault 111 exit, save slogging through all that again. Play a bit with no mods, see if it's stable, then slowly fold in some mods.

[Rudolph]

39 minutes ago, Xim said:

Btw, word of advice on playing the first two. It took me several characters before I figured out on that suited my play style, so be patient and don't feel too bad if you have to restart the game. Make several save files just in case too.

What would you suggest is the best starting build? What stats, traits and skills should I focus on?

[Xim]

39 minutes ago, Rudolph said:

What would you suggest is the best starting build? What stats, traits and skills should I focus on?

Agility is even more useful in the first two I'd say. Your action points is directly affected by your agility, and action points are required for EVERY action in combat. I usually go with small guns as my first combat skill, low AC cost, decent damage and common ammo, but you might want to put some stats into unarmed or melee early on when ammo is still rare, later on you'll get ammo everywhere though. Traits depends on how you want to play, but I avoid "Skilled" because it lowers the amount of perks you get, I don't always like picking "Fast Shot" either since you can't do aimed shots (the old one's equivalent to VATS), it does lower AC cost, but you can get a perk that does that with no debuff later in the game.

EDIT: Almost forgot, friggin OUTDOORS, unless you want random encounters like you're walking through pokemon long grass every time you leave a town, get a good outdoors skill so you'll reduce them. If your skill is good enough you get a description of the encounter along with a choice to skip it or not.
 

Edited October 17, 2022 by Xim

[Wyrmwood]

37 minutes ago, Rudolph said:

What would you suggest is the best starting build? What stats, traits and skills should I focus on?

 

Actually sounds like me and Xim have similar play styles, I also use speech and small guns in all the Fallout games, especially in the first 2. Guess I usually role play my character based on Clint Eastwood in Fistful of Dollars. You get party members that can use the big guns and things like hacking are only selectively useful, maybe for a second or third playthrough might be fun. The start of the game when your on your own is by far the hardest, once you've recruited Keith or whatever the biker dudes called in the first settlement and Dogmeat combat becomes much easier and faster.

[rzh]

7 hours ago, Rudolph said:

Are there QoL mods for Fallout 1 you recommend?

Not really, most of the stuff that gets released is for Fallout 2.

There's some mods for FO1 as well, but they're usually outdated or broken.

There is one mod that allows you to play FO1 in 2's engine, but it introduces some noticeable changes to the game. No purist option.

For FO2 I use Sfall.

I also highly recommend Fallout Nevada for FO2 (No relation to New Vegas' plot).

[Azuris]

I really love the Atmosphere of Fallout 1 & 2.

Imo it is unreached by other similiar Games.

 

Fallout 3 was a let down by this regard, it felt very different.

But Gameplay Wise it was fun and i also like this Game very much.

Same with New Vegas.

 

Fallout 4, i don't know.

Everything looks fine and it seems that i could have fun with that Cunstruction Stuff, but i really really really dislike the new Dialog System and that your Protagonist is voiced.

 

Sometimes you don't know if it is a rude Answer or not.

Often the Protagonist sounds like a stupid morron i hate.

It destroys all the Roleplay and by diliking your own Protagonist, you just don't want to go further.

 

I have much doubts about the new Elder Scrolls in this Regard, as they surely will adopt Stuff from Fallout 4.

 

[Rudolph]

26 minutes ago, Azuris said:

I really love the Atmosphere of Fallout 1 & 2.

Oh yeah, the atmosphere and music are great. Even the opening video is absolutely haunting.

 

I guess I just struggle with the story itself, as I find myself having a hard time caring about anything or anyone, which means that I do quests because I feel like I have to for gameplay reasons rather than because I actually want to. Even the main quest does not feel like there is a big sense of urgency to it, despite the time limit: so a bunch of people that I do not even know or get to know are sending me in a hostile world on my own to fetch an item that is supposedly vital to a place that I do not even get to familiarize myself with, yet none of them are willing to help me or accompany me in any capacity, and I am supposed to care? I am sure there is a story reason behind that, but it does not feel particularly compelling to me.

 

At least, from what I have seen of New Vegas, the game begins with you being robbed and left for dead by some prick dressed like a crossword puzzle.

Edited October 17, 2022 by Rudolph