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random_soldier1337

What's your opinion on Reddit?

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38 minutes ago, Futz Handango said:

 

Not really surprised that the donald got banned on an election year, but I am certainly surprised that the corporate overlords decided that chapo was too hot to handle.

 

 

CTH advocated for violence so they effectively were left with no choice. That sub is associated with rulebreaking content elsewhere on Reddit, notably the PresidentialRaceMemes sub where a mod sockpuppeted several accounts there and shadowbanned everybody who didn't call Joe Biden a rapist.

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I don't know why, but the almost site-wide circlejerking they do consistently is what irks me the most

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"While the rule on hate protects such groups, it does not protect all groups or all forms of identity. For example, the rule does not protect groups of people who are in the majority or who promote such attacks of hate."

 

Yeah, this goes in line with the whole privilege+power ideology. Not a big surprise there either.

 

4 minutes ago, Wagi said:

CTH advocated for violence so they effectively were left with no choice. That sub is associated with rulebreaking content elsewhere on Reddit, notably the PresidentialRaceMemes sub where a mod sockpuppeted several accounts there and shadowbanned everybody who didn't call Joe Biden a rapist.

 

I'm a bit too cynical when it comes to big social media corporations, but I can't help but think that CTH was some sort of sacrificial lamb to go "See? this has nothing to do with bias, totes" I mean, they survived this far, that alone raises all sorts of red flags.

Also I just read that Trump got suspended...from Twitch? I honestly had no idea he had a Twitch account.

 

Big Tech is done with being subtle it seems.

These companies only play for team ME, I severely doubt they are worried about hate or anything of the sort.

 

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I don't get this wording at all. Why was it even worth spending time adding that extra exception into the words of the text, when the rest of the text of rule 1 would presumably forbid it anyways? It's a genuinely bizarre decision, and on top of that it's super poorly defined. Where's the criteria for what constitutes a majority? Is it the United States, China, or where? Is it based on the user's post location? If so, how is it enforced?

 

I'm reminded of that time github tried to do basically the same thing, rolled it back from the negative response, and then put up a revised code of conduct that does not have such language.

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40 minutes ago, Futz Handango said:

Also I just read that Trump got suspended...from Twitch? 

 

Big Tech is done with being subtle it seems.

Social media companies have been extremely lenient when it comes to Trump specifically because he is POTUS and I have no doubt in my mind that hid Twitter account would have been suspended outright for "When the looting starts, the shooting starts" and other messages that glorify and encourage violence if he weren't in a position of power. The fact that they only hid it to the point where you had to click on it to see it was extremely tame but it was treated like this huge overstep by them that he shouldn't be immune to even minor consequences for rulebreaking content on a privately owned platform just because he's President.

 

Even then, he retweeted it from the official Whitehouse account and faced zero reprecussions for doing so, even though that basically amounts to evading the rules. 

 

Really you can say CTH was a "sacrificial lamb" all you want but I'm convinced the only reason it took them longer to quarantine is because they were much less blatant about breaking the rules than the_donald was.

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56 minutes ago, Futz Handango said:

Yeah, this goes in line with the whole privilege+power ideology. Not a big surprise there either.

Which is a very poor understanding of marxism and essentially serves to redefine power and privilege as a racial trait. The result is that the working class fights itself along racial lines, and the actual privileged elite laughs all the way to the bank.

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Fuck Reddit. It's just post-2010-Stormfront-invasion-4chan except people aren't Anonymous. Same amount of fucking idiotic socially retarded nazi fucks.

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3 hours ago, Wagi said:

CTH advocated for violence so they effectively were left with no choice.

The wrong kind of violence, no doubt - i.e. not the kind of violence that's cheered on by folk who claim to be on the "right side of history".

(Incidentally, how do these Doctor Who wannabes know how history will pan out? A defining characteristic of history is the fact it's not been written yet.)

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2 hours ago, Wagi said:

Social media companies have been extremely lenient when it comes to Trump specifically because he is POTUS and I have no doubt in my mind that hid Twitter account would have been suspended outright for "When the looting starts, the shooting starts" and other messages that glorify and encourage violence if he weren't in a position of power. The fact that they only hid it to the point where you had to click on it to see it was extremely tame but it was treated like this huge overstep by them that he shouldn't be immune to even minor consequences for rulebreaking content on a privately owned platform just because he's President.

 

Even then, he retweeted it from the official Whitehouse account and faced zero reprecussions for doing so, even though that basically amounts to evading the rules. 

 

Really you can say CTH was a "sacrificial lamb" all you want but I'm convinced the only reason it took them longer to quarantine is because they were much less blatant about breaking the rules than the_donald was.

 

I disagree.

I'd say you should be way more worried about Twitter itself than anything the president could say.

Google, Facebook, Twitter, all these companies have the means and whats more, the willingness to put their thumb in the scales come November, a russian troll farm is nothing compared to any of the people who hold positions of influence in the corporate ladder.

 

To put this on perspective, imagine if any of the tools that already already in place to shape public discourse were taken over by an ever bigger, even more malicious actor? Paul Singer tried to oust Jack out of the company if I recall correctly, that motherfucker has entire countries by the balls in the form of debt, my own country included, now imagine if that fellow had succeeded.

Private company my ass, break them up to hell and back and then we talk. 

 

 

 

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On 6/25/2020 at 3:11 PM, El Franko said:

Reddit is EXTREMELY cringe and soy and should be IMMEDIATELY shut down and the headquarters be burned to the ground.


Um... crying for things to be shut down is kinda the definition of soy. If you're trying to make a joke about how alt-righters are actually the most sensitive snowflakes out there, you should have tagged your post with /s

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I avoid Reddit like the plague, but I love watching youtube videos about Reddit posts.  I might have spent hours watching those youtube vidoes. xD

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Fuck Reddit. When the CEO of a company is so fucking fragile that he goes in through the back door and flat out EDITS people's posts, you know there's an issue.

 

In fact, fuck big tech in its entirety. Silicon Valley views individual freedom of expression as a bug and any deviation from the programming will ultimately be purged. There is no[ prinicpled argument in favour of censorship, only arguments borne of a desire for power, to exert control over others. If you need to shut people down in order to maintain your argument, your argument sucks. If you need to alter the definitions of words in order to maintain your argument, your argument sucks. If you support censorship of anything that is not already illegal, you are part of the problem. Censorship creates echo-chambers. What do you get with echo-chambers? CHAZ. Cities on fire. Statues being torn down for completely arbitrary reasons. Segregation. Fucking Golden Girls episodes disappearing.

 

What we are witnessing now has been happening just below the radar for years. Now, in a US election year, those TRULY in power are making their big play, screwing over everyone's ability to communicate just so they can get rid of one person they don't like. A person I happen to not like, either, but that's beside the point. These fuckers have the money, the resources and the power to render meaningless the one and only means of making a change that the vast majority of people hold - the vote. They tried in 2016 and failed, they're gonna make damn sure they don't fail again. Sundar Pichai has said as much, and now we're seeing it. First it was actual Neo-Nazis, then the actual alt-right, then traditional run-of-the-mill conservatives, then people on the left who said one or two contentious things or posted their dog doing something unsavoury. Now we have independent news outlets being kicked from AdSense, effectively kneecapping them, another round of YouTube bans, 2000 subreddits retroactibely banned and now Twitch just straight up BANNING the fucking US President? Silicon Valley is basically OCP at this point, and it's depressing. Frankly, I expected the dystopia to have more neon lights and hookers.

 

Someone wise (can't remember who) once said that if you wish to sow discord among your enemies, give them identity politics. Reddit is a glowing example of how effective that strategy can be. EVERYTHING is drawn along lines of race/gender/sexuality/species/etc and all it does is cause division. ResetEra is the same. I hear all this stuff about how white supremacy is this omnipresent threat lurking around every corner and that everything you say and do as a white person is built upon this nebulous original sin called "privilege". I say fuck this tribal bullshit, because I know exactly where it ends. I grew up in Northern Ireland. We didn't have racism, we were too busy killing EACH OTHER and even though the guns are silent (mostly), the tribalism remains. Yeah, about your vote not meaning anything? I speak from experience.

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49 minutes ago, scalliano said:

Fuck Reddit. When the CEO of a company is so fucking fragile that he goes in through the back door and flat out EDITS people's posts, you know there's an issue.

 

In fact, fuck big tech in its entirety. Silicon Valley views individual freedom of expression as a bug and any deviation from the programming will ultimately be purged. There is no[ prinicpled argument in favour of censorship, only arguments borne of a desire for power, to exert control over others. If you need to shut people down in order to maintain your argument, your argument sucks. If you need to alter the definitions of words in order to maintain your argument, your argument sucks. If you support censorship of anything that is not already illegal, you are part of the problem. Censorship creates echo-chambers. What do you get with echo-chambers? CHAZ. Cities on fire. Statues being torn down for completely arbitrary reasons. Segregation. Fucking Golden Girls episodes disappearing.

 

What we are witnessing now has been happening just below the radar for years. Now, in a US election year, those TRULY in power are making their big play, screwing over everyone's ability to communicate just so they can get rid of one person they don't like. A person I happen to not like, either, but that's beside the point. These fuckers have the money, the resources and the power to render meaningless the one and only means of making a change that the vast majority of people hold - the vote. They tried in 2016 and failed, they're gonna make damn sure they don't fail again. Sundar Pichai has said as much, and now we're seeing it. First it was actual Neo-Nazis, then the actual alt-right, then traditional run-of-the-mill conservatives, then people on the left who said one or two contentious things or posted their dog doing something unsavoury. Now we have independent news outlets being kicked from AdSense, effectively kneecapping them, another round of YouTube bans, 2000 subreddits retroactibely banned and now Twitch just straight up BANNING the fucking US President? Silicon Valley is basically OCP at this point, and it's depressing. Frankly, I expected the dystopia to have more neon lights and hookers.

 

Someone wise (can't remember who) once said that if you wish to sow discord among your enemies, give them identity politics. Reddit is a glowing example of how effective that strategy can be. EVERYTHING is drawn along lines of race/gender/sexuality/species/etc and all it does is cause division. ResetEra is the same. I hear all this stuff about how white supremacy is this omnipresent threat lurking around every corner and that everything you say and do as a white person is built upon this nebulous original sin called "privilege". I say fuck this tribal bullshit, because I know exactly where it ends. I grew up in Northern Ireland. We didn't have racism, we were too busy killing EACH OTHER and even though the guns are silent (mostly), the tribalism remains. Yeah, about your vote not meaning anything? I speak from experience.

 

You just laid out all of my own concerns and worries better than I ever could.

The echo chamber effect is real, you have one half of people being fed footage of police brutality and the other is fed footage of rioters burning shit up, toppling George fucking Washington, telling a priest in St. Luis to his face that after they come for his saint, they will come for his church.

 

We are not speaking the same language most of the time

 

"I'm trying to tell you that this moral panic bullshit is undoing the values that keep our societies together!"

"And I'm trying to tell you that there is inequality and that black people are dying!"

If you don't adress BOTH everyone will be in big trouble. Then who the fuck is going to stand up to China?

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, scalliano said:

First it was actual Neo-Nazis, then the actual alt-right, then traditional run-of-the-mill conservatives, then people on the left who said one or two contentious things or posted their dog doing something unsavoury. Now we have independent news outlets being kicked from AdSense, effectively kneecapping them, another round of YouTube bans, 2000 subreddits retroactibely banned and now Twitch just straight up BANNING the fucking US President?

 

oh FFS 

 

The right to free speech does not include the right to mass distribution. You didn't have the right to force the New York Times to publish your rants before the internet and you don't have the right to force YouTube to do it now. There's no rule saying "Private business should be run privately, unless there's a network effect". You are not constitutionally protected against corporations doing things you don't like, otherwise I'd be able to sue Nintendo for not making an F-Zero game in two decades. 

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30 minutes ago, Mr. Freeze said:

otherwise I'd be able to sue Nintendo for not making an F-Zero game in two decades. 

 

Tell me about it, F-Zero X and GX especially were so much fun :(

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Mr. Freeze said:

 

oh FFS 

 

The right to free speech does not include the right to mass distribution. You didn't have the right to force the New York Times to publish your rants before the internet and you don't have the right to force YouTube to do it now. There's no rule saying "Private business should be run privately, unless there's a network effect". You are not constitutionally protected against corporations doing things you don't like, otherwise I'd be able to sue Nintendo for not making an F-Zero game in two decades. 

okay I'm not sure all the legal stuff but I believe I've heard that companies like YouTube, and FaceBook can't go around banning everything they don't like, because then they aren't a public forum and then that makes them publishers, then as publishers they are accountable for anything that gets published on there site.

So yes they are a private business but they have to let people post what they want too (as long as its not something thats like part of the rules not to post) or they lose their status as a public forum.
Again I don't know all the legal stuff behind this but this is my understanding of it, but if anyone is more knowledgeable about this particular subject please speak up.

Edit: so uh I may have jumped the gun and I think I misinterpreted what Mr Freeze was saying.

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2 hours ago, Mr. Freeze said:

The right to free speech does not include the right to mass distribution. You didn't have the right to force the New York Times to publish your rants before the internet and you don't have the right to force YouTube to do it now. There's no rule saying "Private business should be run privately, unless there's a network effect". You are not constitutionally protected against corporations doing things you don't like, otherwise I'd be able to sue Nintendo for not making an F-Zero game in two decades. 

It's high time the laws are updated. Specifically when it comes to freedom of speech, and specifically when it comes to de-facto monopolistic social network platforms. These platforms are not newspapers, they are not media outlets. They do not publish - they provide a platform for everyone to publish their own stuff. As such, they act more like the FCC, and therefore they should not be allowed to discriminate based on the opinions of people who use their services. The fact that they are run by a private corporation and not by the government should not matter. Due to their de-facto monopoly, when they ban or censor someone, they effectively shut them up, and it is definitely against the spirit of the freedom of speech principle.

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Posted (edited)

Largely ideologically driven and garbage website. Extremely biased, especially /r/politics. I've dropped completely from politics in general but I can give you some reasons besides the ones @Nevander listed:

Trump hate, misinformation, misleading or questionable sources for said information and pro-Antifa/pro-violence against police? A-OK.

Conservative viewpoints and/or support for Trump that are mostly rule abiding? Suppression, deleted posts, bans, quarantined subreddits (see /r/The_Donald) and other means of censorship.

Twitter can get just as bad if not worse, this is why my account is STRICTLY Elder Scrolls Online goodness, nothing else.

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Regarding what's going on with the updated reddit rules, inequality aside, symbolic gestures are well and good but it doesn't help minorities get opportunities, let alone what someone actually needs like the basic of livelihood.

 

On the discussion of social media, much as I hate the "Do some research bro" statement, it may actually be helpful than having social media feed you BS. All people on these platforms have some bias. Hell, I know plenty people IRL that bias their stances on social or political issues with personal sentiments.

 

12 hours ago, Phobus said:

I don't look at Reddit, but that word cloud @LHSpanner posted makes the whole thing seem very dominated by young Americans and all of the ridiculous politics that used to make this sub forum a cesspit several years ago. As a Brit, it seems unbearable. The rest of this thread seems to just detail why it is unbearable.

 

I see what you mean. It often does seem that nuanced topics deserving more careful and considerate replies don't or are heavily biased towards what their societies have taught them about the world as opposed to what the world actually may be. If nothing else, top voted posts are just satirical circlejerk statements with nothing to add. Just another voice of indignation. How frustrating threads can be if you try to find information and just keep going through this.

 

6 hours ago, magicsofa said:


Um... crying for things to be shut down is kinda the definition of soy. If you're trying to make a joke about how alt-righters are actually the most sensitive snowflakes out there, you should have tagged your post with /s

 

Ironic considering the topic.

 

6 hours ago, EvelisH said:

I avoid Reddit like the plague, but I love watching youtube videos about Reddit posts.  I might have spent hours watching those youtube vidoes. xD

 

I used to watch those. Then I started avoiding them and as I type this, I have realized something. In retrospect, these videos became so characterstic and becoming of reddit it exemplified the banality of reddit responses as well as the threads that will be on the front page.

 

4 hours ago, Mr. Freeze said:

 

oh FFS 

 

The right to free speech does not include the right to mass distribution. You didn't have the right to force the New York Times to publish your rants before the internet and you don't have the right to force YouTube to do it now. There's no rule saying "Private business should be run privately, unless there's a network effect". You are not constitutionally protected against corporations doing things you don't like, otherwise I'd be able to sue Nintendo for not making an F-Zero game in two decades. 

 

I'm not sure about your statement. It's definitely encompassing many things when you say corporations doing things I don't like. I definitely don't want them to sell me watered down 30% ethanol to save costs, all the while lying to me about it when I specifically wanted 60% or above to disinfect surfaces in these times.

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On 6/24/2020 at 11:47 PM, Avoozl said:

Reddit is toxic and I will never create an account there.

I've said it before, the one true way to win at Reddit. 

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Reddit is a site that occasionally appears on my Google search result when I ask about something, similar to how StackExchange and Quora appear. When the topic is specific to something particular, the posts on Reddit provide useful answers. It uses a threaded (instead of linear) forum layout, but I find this threading remarkably tidy, so it's easy to skip any derailing subthreads. I don't post there, so I don't waste my time there and don't have to put up with their community. Win.

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Me, I just surf the gilded posts. Slightly less likely to be exposed to breathtaking idiocy that way.

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3 hours ago, dr_st said:

It's high time the laws are updated. Specifically when it comes to freedom of speech, and specifically when it comes to de-facto monopolistic social network platforms. These platforms are not newspapers, they are not media outlets. They do not publish - they provide a platform for everyone to publish their own stuff. As such, they act more like the FCC, and therefore they should not be allowed to discriminate based on the opinions of people who use their services. The fact that they are run by a private corporation and not by the government should not matter. Due to their de-facto monopoly, when they ban or censor someone, they effectively shut them up, and it is definitely against the spirit of the freedom of speech principle.

So after decades of hands-off approach and swearing up and down the river that government should not regulate the way private companies run their businesses on the Internet, you think it is time to ammend laws and declare Facebook and reddit public utilities? So they get funding from governments' budget, ergo your taxmoney for infrastructure and moderation costs, because they finally caved to public pressure and started applying basic moderation and adherence to their own terms of service? Do you even realize how good the online racists and age of consent philosophers have it right now and how their veil of anonymity would get stripped away if reddit is a public utility? Careful what you wish for when you demand to see the Internet's manager.

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Reddit is fine for me because i stay away from the front page and from undifferentiated, black & white "right wing" or "left wing" bullshit. My feed is customized with all my specific niche interests and wholesome (or at least not toxic) communities, and i like the fact that all of them are conveniently grouped together on a single site. And from what i've been reading here, i'll let it stay that way.

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I only go there for subreddits like r/puppysmiles and r/tuckedinkitties. The politics side of Reddit can go fuck itself, I'll be out here beaming wholesome dog/cat pictures directly into my brainstem.

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23 minutes ago, dew said:

you think it is time to ammend laws and declare Facebook and reddit public utilities?

Facebook and Twitter, pretty much, yes. Reddit - probably not yet.

 

23 minutes ago, dew said:

Do you even realize how good the online racists and age of consent philosophers have it right now and how their veil of anonymity would get stripped away if reddit is a public utility?

Reddit is not there yet, in my mind, as I said. Most of it is still anonymous message-board style. Facebook and Twitter are largely based around people and organizations using their real identities to share their thoughts, opinions and promote their business and agendas. At least, the accounts that have the most followers/exposure are like that.

 

I want to take away the right of Facebook and Twitter's management to censor their users because they disagree with their opinions, or because certain political pressure groups want it censored.

 

In fact, I think the rule of anonymity can be a good rule of thumb to decide when free speech protections should apply. If you wish to hide behind anonymity, it's your right, but then you don't get the protection. Perhaps the test should be that if you are saying something that you would be allowed to say, standing at Times Square, and if you are wiling to come forward and identify yourself, then Facebook/Twitter (and perhaps, soon, Reddit) should not be allowed to take it down / censor it / block it in any way.

 

This way whatever laws you have that limit the freedom of speech in general, still apply. The content of said laws and how they are applied/enforced, is the subject of a different discussion.

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9 minutes ago, dr_st said:

Reddit is not there yet, in my mind, as I said. Most of it is still anonymous message-board style. Facebook and Twitter are largely based around people and organizations using their real identities to share their thoughts, opinions and promote their business and agendas. At least, the accounts that have the most followers/exposure are like that.

Therefore you agree it was perfectly appropriate for them to get rid of the_donald. Lovely, converging opinions already.

 

10 minutes ago, dr_st said:

I want to take away the right of Facebook and Twitter's management to censor their users because they disagree with their opinions, or because certain political pressure groups want it censored. 

But then the companies need to identify every poster. Bubba Racistsson of Alabama may be protected by this freeze peach initiative when pondering that all women are whores, but the same won't apply to you hiding behind a twitter egg, or to JohnSmith21453214466132587 lazily going through the script in his Red Square basement office.

 

20 minutes ago, dr_st said:

In fact, I think the rule of anonymity can be a good rule of thumb to decide when free speech protections should apply. If you wish to hide behind anonymity, it's your right, but then you don't get the protection.

Interesting proposition for political dissenters in countries like Turkey or Saudi Arabia, heh. Also, brigading, doxxing, twitter mobs... your proposition actually empowers all of that. But hey, if you want to give us a way to cancel future Karens with even stronger force, who am I to oppose such a gift?

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24 minutes ago, dr_st said:

Facebook

Facebook is a trainwreck with regards to free speech moderation. If you report racist jokes, nobody bats an eye. But the power of the mob can mass-report anything you do to ban you for 30 days, just because you said "shit" three years ago.

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37 minutes ago, printz said:

Facebook is a trainwreck with regards to free speech moderation. If you report racist jokes, nobody bats an eye. But the power of the mob can mass-report anything you do to ban you for 30 days, just because you said "shit" three years ago.

 

Yeah, reporting pages and comments is unbelievably trash on Facebook, I have first-hand experience with that.

 

Mass reports are a good way to cancel a page there, sadly... Some atheist pages I follow got deleted at least once, for reference.

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, dew said:

So just because you simply must be allowed to express your desire to exterminate all Jews

Is "expressing one's desire to exterminate all Jews" allowed under American free speech laws?

 

12 minutes ago, dew said:

American laws should be rewritten to force Twitter to just deal with it and stop its business in Europe?

American laws govern Twitter's operation in America, not in Europe or anywhere else.

 

12 minutes ago, dew said:

How the hell do you unmask yourself on such a trivial line? Look at you sliding into casual racism, because you get triggered by the Karen meme.

Ah, yeah, all the standard leftist tropes. Derogatory stereotypes aimed specifically at whites are allowed, but against blacks - it is racism. Not even the stereotypes themselves - even showing some parallels between stereotypes is racism.

 

Complete disregard of the point, complete inability to actually think about anything in any way other than identity politics, or to see your own reflection when the mirror is placed in front of your face. "Triggered and unmasked" indeed. :)

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