No imagination, inspired by "Game realism"...

[AndrewB]

Let me say something about war and fighting. Being in a war in real life sucks, is not fun, is hard work. I've never been in one but I'll sure bet money on it. To me, it's no different than constructing a building in terms of difficulty and boringness. So why are games based around this? Think about it. A real-time construction-worker simulator. Or a librarian simulator. Or a garbage disposal game. Or a game where you run a convenience store. Or a dancing game (quite popular in Japan).

Like ___, now that I think about it, there are about 2 dozen good ideas for games that have never been done before, and could be fun if done properly. All this graphical power, all this room for AI development, and 90% of all games are about one thing. Shooting people, or fighting bad guys. Like ___. I'm _______ sick and tired of it. It's a _______ waste.

It's the fault of the ______-___ developers who are too ___________ scared to stray from the norm. I'm sick of _______ shooting things and being in ______-___ wars. How is one unpleasant activity any more suitable for a game than another? It _______ isn't.

If you're going to try to tell me that games that involve fighting and battling in one way or another are THE ONLY ONES that can showcase graphics and technology advancements, I'm going to say in advance that you're _______ insane. The whole _______ industry is screwed up, and they're monopolizing on people's stupidity by convincing them that fighting is the only thing a game can be about.

With the obvious exceptions of racing games and puzzle games, the entire _______ industry is about combat games and shooters, the same _______ thing over and over and it's _______ ________.

[Naked Snake]

_______ wonderful.

[Captain Red]

I've never been to hell, but I'm sure that's not fun Either.

Have you ever noticed that sports are like mini wars? Once upon a time, Sports where used to train solders for combat. It’s the same principal for games really.

[IMJack]

Actually, nine times out of ten, it's the publishers that tell the game developers what games they can and cannot make.

Makes me want to start up an independant game developing "label".

[Insomniak]

My aunt and uncle are in the 1st PPCLI batallion in Edmonton. My aunt just got back from serving in Afghanistan, and my uncle left for Bosnia a few weeks ago.

My aunt also served in Bosnia during the war there. Once, she was giving some candy to some young kids there, and watched as a sniper shot their brains out right in front of her.

I can't even play CS because of that story.

war's a ____ing terrable thing.

[myk]

You just noticed modern mass-media entertainment in the western world is heavily based on how the roman circus worked.

[Fredrik]

I'd love to argue about this matter, whatever it is, but I didn't find the power to read your post - too many annoying _____'s in the way.

[Shaviro]

Fredrik said:

I'd love to argue about this matter, whatever it is, but I didn't find the power to read your post - too many annoying _____'s in the way.

Agreed. Change your post and I will read it, too.

[The Ultimate DooMer]

Well, unfortunately the games industry (like all other industries) puts profits before originality, so that's why todays games (like pop music) are identikit nonsense.
(not helped by every game having a '2', '3', '4' or '2002', '2003' etc. on the end - give me mission packs and custom maps any day...)

[Little Faith]

But unfortunately even the custom modders and mappers are loath to stray away from the norm.

[Ultraviolet]

AndrewB: If you have a problem with profanity, then you should also have a problem with suggestively using _______'s in a suggestively profane context.

Unless...

It's the fault of the FLUFFY-FUN developers who are too FURRYKITTEN scared to stray from the norm. I'm sick of SUPRMAN shooting things and being in FLUFFY-JOB wars. How is one unpleasant activity any more suitable for a game than another? It FUNNYHAPPYSUPERGOOD isn't.

[Ralphis]

Time for madlibs kiddies!

[The Ultimate DooMer]

Little Faith said:

But unfortunately even the custom modders and mappers are loath to stray away from the norm.

But not me, as I like to be different...

[Remilia Scarlet]

I wrote an essay for english class on a very simular topic just last month. It was about how games were stagnating and falling into design patterns. It would seem that every game is a clone of the one next to it. But, I never did realize how many of these cloned clones are shooting and fighting games...

Now that I think about it, 90-95% of the games I own are shooting or fighting games of some sort. Hell, I have one game for my Sega Saturn that doesn't use fighting or shooting guns: "NiGHTS Into Dreams" (well, and Christmas Nights, but it's just a demo thing).

Our market is being oversaturated again (well, the beginnings of it, it seems). This time by clones (heh, Attack of The Clones).

In my essay, I proposed that we create another crash of the videogame market (simular to the one in '83, but controlled). Do this by boycotting such stagnated games, as well as doing stuff like the independant lable IMJack mentioned (that wasn't in the essay, btw). After the crash of '83, we were presented with cool new gameplay ideas. The market straightened itself out. Should do it again.

I'm glad a friend recently introduced me to Dance Dance Revolution. I've been hooked lately. And it seems that I'm spending more and more time playing older, more original games than I am newer ones.

However, some of us like violence in videogames. I do. I enjoy aiming down in Soldier of Fortune on my DreamCast and blowing the head of a dude away for no reason. I enjoyed going around with the fiber wire in Hitman 2 when I tried it on my XBox. I was pissed when Thrill Kill was canceled for PSX. But, maybe we should seek to add elements outside of violence to our games. Hell, just putting a damned story behind violence will make it a bit better (Halo, for example) and more memorable. I'm beginning to think that developers are just seeking ways to either 1) make games more and more violent, or 2) make the violence look better and more real. I'd rather see the horsepower of a chip spent on the game than the graphics now adays. Focus less on violence and graphics, and more on gameplay.

Eugene Jarvis, creator of Robotron, Defender, the Crusin' series, and others recently said:
"For me, the retrogaming movement is more than just nostalgia of misty eyed Gen X-ers. It's a reaction to the current graphical overkill, the simulation-obsessed gaming environment of the late '90s. In our quest for absolute graphical realism, we have forgotten the basics of gaming. Look at Virtua Fighter 3 versus Virtua Fighter 2. Unless you are a proctologist, you can't find a dime's worth of difference in the gameplay. It is clear that the design team focused on the beautiful water effects, facial expressions, awesome backdrops, and 400-polygon, fully rendered loincloth animations.

Ok, I'm rambling. Sorry.

[dsm]

The reason why war games are so popular is because they take something which most people don't get to try in real life (i.e. fighting in war) and allow people to try it, but with all the truly terrible things removed from it, like the stench of death, tasteful things like what Insomniac's Aunt experienced in Bosnia, terrible pain, disease, starvation and so on.

War games only include a tiny little fraction of what you may experience in a war, it's possibly so small a fraction that war vets would argue that there is absolutely NO element from a war in a war game.

Base a game on anything that you can normally do and it's not at all fun because it reminds you too much of what you normally do. It's hard to explain but war games also involve a huge adrenaline rush because they trick you into believing that you are in danger and that it will be fatal if you make mistakes. Also effects and elements from the action in a war look cool (which is also the reason why there are lots of action games).

I've actually tried playing a few games that were about rescuing people (without fighting "bad guys") - some of them sucked, all of them were inferior to war games, but I believe that some of them could have been a lot more fun if balanced and designed probably. I think the problem is that people haven't been doing these kind of games near enough times to have enough experience on how to make these fun.

[Grazza]

dsm said:

I've actually tried playing a few games that were about rescuing people (without fighting "bad guys") - some of them sucked, all of them were inferior to war games

Lemmings was about rescuing things (not quite people, but close enough), and it was certainly a game you could get totally immersed in. I recall one particular level (called Five Alive) where I must have spent a full day working out the exact timing and sequence needed to rescue all five lemmings, and another full day managing to implement this plan.

[The Ultimate DooMer]

Yeah, Lemmings ruled! The one that I found the hardest was 'Save Me' - everything had to be spot on. (although I can't recall the one you mentioned - I think it was in Oh! No!... somewhere)

But it's easily the most original and addictive game away from DooM.

One of the games I found most addictive was an old RPG called 'Legend' - one of those where you wondered round various dungeons grabbing keys, solving puzzles and blasting hordes of monsters with self-made spells. I just couldn't put it down. (and it took 2-3 weeks to finish!)

[zark]

Ultimate DooMer said:

Yeah, Lemmings ruled! The one that I found the hardest was 'Save Me' - everything had to be spot on. (although I can't recall the one you mentioned - I think it was in Oh! No!... somewhere)

But it's easily the most original and addictive game away from DooM.

Lemmings owns j00. One of the most fun and addictive games of all time.

[dsm]

ZarcyB said:

Lemmings owns j00. One of the most fun and addictive games of all time.

If only there was a decent save game feature - I played it for about a year, then I got sick and tired of it because I couldn't get very far on the tougher skill levels. But yeah, the idea was cool and I had loads of fun with the levels on the easier skill settings.

[Grazza]

Ultimate DooMer said:

(although I can't recall the one you mentioned - I think it was in Oh! No!... somewhere)

Here it is. However, looking at it now, that's not the one I was thinking of. I think I must have remembered the name but associated it with the wrong level. Anyway, it was one where you had to make full use of the odd way that builders worked, among other things.

[Naked Snake]

Ultraviolet said:

AndrewB: If you have a problem with profanity

He has a proxy that filters out cursing.

[doomedout]

myk said:

You just noticed modern mass-media entertainment in the western world is heavily based on how the roman circus worked.

Elaborate. That seems to be a very interesting point.

[AndrewB]

BigBadGangsta said:

He has a proxy that filters out cursing.

The proxy is in my brain.

So like, if you have a problem with underlines and you're so underlinaphobic that you can't read the first message, then ____ off ay, I don't mind.

[fraggle]

STOP ____ING SWEARING!

[Ultraviolet]

MY GOD NO!! MY EYES!!! MY EYES!!! THE LINES... the lines... the...

[zark]

Heh. _______ _______.

[Sephiroth]

yea the game industry is really sucking. sony pays off companies to make play station games only. this limits many games as the technology ages, and it prevents a larger number of people from playing it. microsoft does a similar thing with xbox, however it pulls the strings of its own companies. many xbox games are on other platforms. however a good number of PS2 games should have been made for other systems. games like red faction would rock on the xbox, good thing that series is also out for the PC(but u must wait several months) a good example is square soft, i would like to see many of there games ported to PC, as that is my main system. but gameboy/gamecube and xbox ports of games would be nice too.

really makers of console systems would be forced to make it better, upgadeable and stronger if the game companies were in control.

another classic example of the producer controling the ring is eidos. almost every Eidos game for the PC sucks, not because of a bad story or repeated series(well some games were plain bad) but due to a lack of beta testing and debugging. almost every Eidos game i have ever bought has been filled with nasty bugs and flaws. even on the consoles these games suffer. many promiseing games have died because of eidos and its dumbass ways. those who can afford to do what they want, ID and others(manly someway related to Id) are the ones pumping out good games.

other games are just plain stupid, lame or even badly made, yet get good rateing because of who made them, advertiseing and if a main company is behind it. i never did like the new grand theft auto, which is extreamly violent. yet sony is blocking games for les extreams. GTA3 had more advertisement than i have ever seen in any game. There are loads of good games that are over shadowed by shit, bad producing/publishing, or chopped up by some executive who had nothing to do with its creation. honestly there should be a gameing company run by gamers(who really do WORK) that does the publishing and such. I am a hard person to buy games for because i look for quality. though i have bought games i quickly traded in i tend to only have a few i am interested in. some games that other say are great i never liked because it either was chopped to hell, buggy or just not top quality

[Fletcher`]

Let's see my list of things that suck:
War
Media
Half Life
Relatives
Reality TV
Most all TV (that isn't cartoons and sitcoms)
Rap
Media
Politics
Snipers
Bugs
People
Anna Nicole Smith
Media
Really bad mods
Controversial mods

I think that summs it up for one week.

[Lizardcommando]

Grazza said:

Lemmings was about rescuing things...

I always thought Lemmings were supposed to die. :p In real life, lemmings are little rodent-like creatures that jump off of high cliffs during a certain time of year. I saw this in an encyclopedia a few years ago.

[IMJack]

Hate to say it, but the "lemmings jump off clifs every year" thing is a myth popularized by Disney.