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Hot_Pink_Doomguy

DOOM 3: BFG Edition should've been a console exclusive...

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So here's a hot take. DOOM 3: BFG Edition did not need to be on PC. Around the time that the BFG Edition was released(circa 2012)the 7th generation of consoles were more-or-less on their way out, the Xbox 360 and the PlayStation 3. Those two consoles were, at the time, powerful enough to get DOOM 3 running properly as it was originally designed. Yeah, the Vicarious Visions port of DOOM 3 to the original Xbox was impressive, but wasn't the full package if that makes sense. I understand that PC owners are appalled with the BFG Edition, but given that the original DOOM 3 and Resurrection of Evil are both available on Steam for $5 a pop, to me it isn't really worth getting worked up over. There's already source ports for DOOM 3 that fix some of the issues the original had, EVEN AT VERSION 1.3.1. The BFG Edition may have an uncapped frame-rate, an FOV slider, and all that, but who's to say that source ports will have those features soon added some time in the future?  It would render the BFG Edition on PC completely obsolete.

 

     Which is where my point comes in. I think DOOM 3: BFG Edition should've been a console exclusive only.  Since the 7th gen at the time were powerful enough to get DOOM 3 up and running as it was originally designed, the BFG Edition should've stayed on consoles. Bethesda and id didn't have to put it on PC, given that the originals were already available on Steam. I think they wasted resources putting it on PC. At least they didn't de-list DOOM 3 and Resurrection of Evil on Steam when the BFG Edition came around, am I right?

     

     

 

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I liked the Lost Mission and I liked No Rest For The Living. That's why I bought the BFG Edition and I'm glad it came to PC :)

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This is a worthless post. Even if it's on PC or Consoles or both it does not affect absolutely anything.

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2 hours ago, PaulRazvan95 said:

This is a worthless post. Even if it's on PC or Consoles or both it does not affect absolutely anything.

Just my opinion, bro. 

 

 

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17 hours ago, Plasma Slayer said:

No Rest For The Living. That's why I bought the BFG Edition

 

I think it's the only physical copy of that for PC?

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1 hour ago, Boaby Kenobi said:

 

I think it's the only physical copy of that for PC?

Yes, and now and from the unity port.

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Posted (edited)
18 hours ago, PaulRazvan95 said:

This is a worthless post. Even if it's on PC or Consoles or both it does not affect absolutely anything.

 

Are any threads on this forum worth anything?

 

BFG edition strikes me as a port that very deliberately catered to whiners who had problems with the original, and that's a pretty tragic sentiment. Fact is, it probably shouldn't exist at all, but now it's almost the standard issue if you try to buy 3. It's a valid argument, and I agree.

 

Buying the original Doom 3 was a pain in the ass after BFG came out, I tried, because my copy got destroyed by fire. In fact I think they removed it entirely from Steam for a short period after BFG came out, which is absurd. I had to buy both disks off of amazon, new, because the stupid copyright protection would complain if the key was already used. I wanted to get it on Steam, but it was literally no longer available. It's there NOW, but it wasn't for awhile.

 

So yes, it gummed up the works and made the original unavailable. Fun fact.

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@Hellektronic Lol, my copy decided to forget the key the next time I launched it, despite launching it like a hundred times prior with no issues. RoE didn't prompt me for the key again but for the base game did. I don't feel like having to dig it out because of a random screw-up, so there's a neat workaround that's totally legit. Hit ~ ctrl alt to bring down the console, then type map game/site3 (any map will do if you remember the name) and enter, it'll load it and once in-game you can access the main menu again. Keys be BTFO'd.

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Posted (edited)
On 8/24/2020 at 12:27 PM, Lila Feuer said:

@Hellektronic Lol, my copy decided to forget the key the next time I launched it, despite launching it like a hundred times prior with no issues. RoE didn't prompt me for the key again but for the base game did. I don't feel like having to dig it out because of a random screw-up, so there's a neat workaround that's totally legit. Hit ~ ctrl alt to bring down the console, then type map game/site3 (any map will do if you remember the name) and enter, it'll load it and once in-game you can access the main menu again. Keys be BTFO'd.

 

I eventually just got a hacked version, not even joking, lol... I got so sick of playing charades with id's copy protection that I ended up breaking bad, haha.

 

Someday I might get it on Steam with RoE now that it's available again, but ya know. Anything but BFG Edition.

Edited by Hellektronic

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The Doom 3 source port dhewm3 pretty much fixes that problem.

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10 hours ago, Avoozl said:

The Doom 3 source port dhewm3 pretty much fixes that problem.

 

To be perfectly honest with you, I didn't even realize there were source ports of Doom 3.

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41 minutes ago, Hellektronic said:

To be perfectly honest with you, I didn't even realize there were source ports of Doom 3.

 

There are, but only 2 "big" ones to my knowledge, dhewm3 and fhDoom.

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On 8/23/2020 at 1:20 PM, Boaby Kenobi said:

 

I think it's the only physical copy of that for PC?

 

It's available as part of the Steam version. I just extract the nerve.WAD and play it in Chocolate DOOM.

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Doom 3 in general should've been canceled. It was a bad game originally, it was a bad game with BFG Edition, and it's still bad today.

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While I dislike many of the changes made, the BFG Edition of DOOM 3 is still worthwhile for one simple reason: convenience.  You can play DOOM 3, RoE, Lost Mission, Ultimate DOOM, DOOM II, and NRFL all from the same executable.  You don't need to make multiple purchases, install and configure additional software, copy your WAD files somewhere, or create shortcuts with command line arguments.  It just works.

 

There's also the matter of the new content it introduced.  Prior to the Unity port of DOOM II, there was no legal way to play No Rest for the Living on PC unless you owned DOOM 3: BFG Edition.  Moreover, the BFG Edition is still the only way to experience the Lost Mission expansion.  (I'm aware of the unofficial backport but that's still legally questionable.)  Lastly, there's achievements to unlock.

 

As for source ports, those also exist for the BFG Edition too.  There's RBDOOM-3-BFG and DOOM BFA.  RBDOOM-3-BFG adds several niceties to DOOM 3 and DOOM BFA does the same for classic DOOM.  They're also compatible with several existing DOOM 3 mods.  (Mods with custom DLL's will need to be ported to the new engine but that problem has always existed.  See Dhewm3.)


To me, if you don't own any DOOM games for PC and you have $20 to spare, the BFG Edition seems like a good purchase.  (The Slayer's Collection is a better deal but I don't believe it's available on PC, and even if it is, Steam doesn't have the Unity ports.)  Hell, even if you don't like DOOM 3, you could always load the DOOM and DOOM II iwads in your source port of choice.
 

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4 hours ago, famicommander said:

Doom 3 in general should've been canceled. It was a bad game originally, it was a bad game with BFG Edition, and it's still bad today.

 

Terrible take there :(

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Posted (edited)

Console exclusive? nah not at all. Any and all Doom should be available to fans everywhere on any system wherever possible.

 

Doom is for everyone.

Edited by Eurisko

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18 hours ago, Plasma Slayer said:

 

Terrible take there :(

Nah, it's awful. 

 

Bad gunplay, bad story with unskippable cutscenes, bad horror because supplies are plentiful and it's not difficult, bad monster design.

 

When it came out it was technically impressive. In 2020 it has no redeeming features. It's not a good shooter, it's not a good horror game, it's not a good anything. It's a disgrace to the Doom name and both Final Doom and Doom 64 are far more deserving of the Doom 3 title.

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5 hours ago, famicommander said:

Nah, it's awful. 

 

Bad gunplay, bad story with unskippable cutscenes, bad horror because supplies are plentiful and it's not difficult, bad monster design.

 

When it came out it was technically impressive. In 2020 it has no redeeming features. It's not a good shooter, it's not a good horror game, it's not a good anything. It's a disgrace to the Doom name and both Final Doom and Doom 64 are far more deserving of the Doom 3 title.

 

We need a laugh/rofl reaction for these kind of posts specifically.

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Posted (edited)

@Eurisko

The best take.

@famicommander

I mean no disrespect to Team TNT or the Casali brothers but I'd much rather play DOOM 3 than Final DOOM.  (DOOM 64 is also great.)

Edited by KainXavier

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Posted (edited)

BFG edition would've split the already small modding community for Doom 3, there's some people making mods only for that version now.

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13 hours ago, famicommander said:

unskippable cutscenes


Did we play the same game? I can skip every cutscene.

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Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, Lila Feuer said:


Did we play the same game? I can skip every cutscene.

Maybe you have used a source port (if we are talking about the BFG/2019 Editions)

Edited by MadGuy

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Wasn't the biggest issue was that someone filed a lawsuit against iD for using his lighting code? I know John Carmack denied stealing code, and I can't believe he would ever steal code; but instead of going to court they decided to stop selling the original, physical version. Which I still have a copy of. So instead, they redid the lighting code, released it as the BFG edition along with ROE and The Lost Missions, and called it a day.

 

Which sucks, the original version looks so much better. And I might be talking out my ass here; but I think there was a lawsuit issue revolving around the lighting system used. Because the original version of Doom 3 was far more atmospheric than the BFG edition. Plus the ammunition and health balance was quite a bit better.

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10 minutes ago, Jello said:

Wasn't the biggest issue was that someone filed a lawsuit against iD for using his lighting code? I know John Carmack denied stealing code, and I can't believe he would ever steal code; but instead of going to court they decided to stop selling the original, physical version. Which I still have a copy of. So instead, they redid the lighting code, released it as the BFG edition along with ROE and The Lost Missions, and called it a day.

 

Which sucks, the original version looks so much better. And I might be talking out my ass here; but I think there was a lawsuit issue revolving around the lighting system used. Because the original version of Doom 3 was far more atmospheric than the BFG edition. Plus the ammunition and health balance was quite a bit better.

Not a single thing you said is true. The only thing you have there that's even distantly correct is Creative filed suit for breach of patent on the original Doom3 while it was in development due to the lighting Carmack algorithm used. The settled out of cout which resulted in A) Doom3 including hardware EAX support and B) The source code release using a slightly modified algorithm. Note that the change in algorithm doesn't change the lighting visually at all, just how it performs.

 

That's it. Doom3BFG uses the exact same lighting code as the original Doom3 (BFG's source release has the same replaced algorithm). Physical copies weren't removed from retail (seriously what). There was no code theft.

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It's a perpetual danger that old games get remastered now. Sometimes this results in them getting butchered instead. It's like a time limit within which you should play the game before the developers remove it from stores and replace it with a damaged modern version. It's not quite the case with Doom 3, but it's pretty close: you can't find original Doom 3 on GOG, just on Steam. This despite similar games like Quake 4 being available on GOG.

 

It's also that Windows and hardware continue evolving (unfortunately) and you should visit a certain game wiki which explains how to fix games like Doom 3 and Quake 4 not to look bad on today's computers (otherwise some objects will look conspicuously low detail).

 

Old Doom is safe from this, thanks to open source and ports. But the way the new official versions on walled-garden platforms look gives me no hope it will ever be good to remaster.

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On 8/29/2020 at 10:47 AM, famicommander said:

Doom 3 in general should've been canceled. It was a bad game originally, it was a bad game with BFG Edition, and it's still bad today.

Whoo! My face is MELTING, that was spicy.

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