Which vanilla map you consider to be the most underwhelming?

[Hisymak]

For me it's MAP25: Bloodfalls. The main reason is the lenght of the map - it's just way too much small and short and easily became forgettable during my playthroughs through Doom2. There's also nothing too special or significant about the map, I like the name/theme and the starting area, and think this map could have been made bigger to use its full potential. On the other hand, sometimes when I play some very hard megawads with lot of very large maps, a smaller and calmer map where I can take a rest is welcome, and those kind of maps are still pretty rememberable for me.

The one interesting thing through about MAP25 is it has its unique music, but it's nothing much special either.

[erzboesewicht]

For a long time, for me it was E4M4, as it's only a succession of three or four rooms without much atmosphere. But actually on UV-fast some of the fights are at least a bit fun. E3M8 is another candidate, because on continuous play it is way too easy for a final boss map, but from pistol start it's not that bad and actually a nice challenge as you must collect most of the ammo provided. TNT MAP24 has the same problems and the same "hidden strength" than E4M4, but is at least a little bit more elaborate. I think I stay with E4M4, because being fun on UV-fast is not really difficult, and it really is extremely short for an official Doom map and has nothing which really makes it stick out.

 

About Bloodfalls - I actually like it a bit, above all because of some of the ambushes. But I can understand why it can be considered underwhelming.

[seed]

Probably E4M1.

 

I like it but also not really, because of its size.

[spineapple tea]

There's like four textures used in Doom II's map 30, not including the ones for the icon of sin. The most detail in the map is the starting room and even then it just looks like someone placed a couple hanging corpses in a box and called it a day.

[IncognitoMode]

3 hours ago, seed said:

Probably E4M1.

 

I like it but also not really, because of its size.

I used to hate E4M1/E4M2 but I kinda like them now because of the challenge. To be honest the rest of thy flesh consumed is pretty forgettable,

and it has some pretty ugly texturing lol

[RonnieJamesDiner]

I'd have to go with E3M8. 

[Percy T]

E3M7. The portals are hard to remember, that's all. The textures are sort of monotonous, but the kicker for me is that you would expect E3M8 to be a large scale boss battle with dark and bloody textures like E3M7, but it's just an empty tech base type map.

[SF.]

The entire episode 3 of Doom was a letdown. Mt Erebus and maybe Warrens were the only cool maps.  

[Cinnamon]

19 hours ago, RonnieJamesDiner said:

I'd have to go with E3M8. 

 

Agree with that. E4 did M8 better, except that the actual spider fight is too easy with so much cover.

 

Also E3M7. It's not bad, I like it, but as a penultimate level it's poor. It would've worked better earlier in the episode.

 

Not to mention E2M9.

 

For DOOM 2, I think it's easily MAP30. So ugly and underwhelming. Plutonia did IoS best.

 

In TNT it's probably MAP21 for me. It really drags.

 

Don't think Plutonia has any seriously underwhelming levels. Maybe MAP22.

 

The crown goes to IoS in DOOM 2.

[ChopBlock223]

Map 12 : Factory

I'll have fun with Doom 2 all the way until here, where it stops dead. There's a bunch of good levels afterwards, but I just don't like Factory at all, it's a pacing whiplash for me.

[Omniarch]

Seconding E3M7 and E3M8. They are both very... anticlimactic. I personally really enjoy the feeling of ever-deepening insanity that marks the progression from E3M1 to E3M6. Tech slowly falls away to wood and marble, progression becomes more and more obtuse and unnerving, layouts become increasing abstract and bizarre, all culminating in the insane FIREBLU hellscape of Mt. Erebus. Then... nothing. Just a huge empty labyrinth, largely devoid of opposition or intrigue. Sure, the progression is obtuse, but in an annoying, gamey sort of way. Dis is just a Disapointm- ahem, letdown, yes letdown. I mean, of all the IWAD boss levels (inc. D2 & Final), only E1M8 isn't shit, and that's just because Sign of Evil is such a fantastic piece of music.

 

Actually, I'll continue with that thought and lump all boss levels into the underwhelming category. And E2M9, fuck that level, along with the stupid Wolfenstein levels from Doom 2. Who in their right minds thought it would be a good idea to shove a couple of random levels from an inferior, redundant predecessor into your latest game? That and throw in a nasty and pointless cameo of Commander Keen just to spite Tom Hall. Uncool, id, uncool.

[spineapple tea]

On 12/7/2020 at 11:16 AM, N1ck said:

There's like four textures used in Doom II's map 30, not including the ones for the icon of sin. The most detail in the map is the starting room and even then it just looks like someone placed a couple hanging corpses in a box and called it a day.

Now thinking about it, why did the classic Doom games have to end on an arena? I think a long and brutal level being the final map would work much better. Dis was disappointing (ha) because after everything you faced, you could just blast the spider mastermind with one BFG shot. If Doom II ended with map 29 or something similar, I don't think many people would be talking about how disappointing its ending was.

[EsmerInHell]

10 minutes ago, N1ck said:

Now thinking about it, why did the classic Doom games have to end on an arena? I think a long and brutal level being the final map would work much better. Dis was disappointing (ha) because after everything you faced, you could just blast the spider mastermind with one BFG shot. If Doom II ended with map 29 or something similar, I don't think many people would be talking about how disappointing its ending was.

Exactly. MAP30 is the only map in doom 2 that I think is actually bad. I had the same idea where the game should have just ended on MAP29, and the "final boss" would be the cyberdemon in front of the portal. icon of sin is pretty much the only thing that prevents me from calling doom 2 a perfect game.

[SF.]

14 minutes ago, N1ck said:

Now thinking about it, why did the classic Doom games have to end on an arena? I think a long and brutal level being the final map would work much better. Dis was disappointing (ha) because after everything you faced, you could just blast the spider mastermind with one BFG shot. If Doom II ended with map 29 or something similar, I don't think many people would be talking about how disappointing its ending was.

I agree with this. I like the concept of making the map itself as the final boss, if that makes sense. Living End would have been a fitting end to Doom II. On a similar note, Mount Pain would have been a great finale to Evilution and Go 2 it to Plutonia. 

[spineapple tea]

Scrapping the idea of the icon of sin would've worked wonders. I don't like the idea of fighting the cyberdemon at the end as the final boss, but if there was a new final boss that was at the end, that would've worked wonders. I'd honestly be all for a Doom II wad that just has an extra level near map 10 so it's 30 maps and have map 29 be the final map. Hell, the name "Living End" already works as a title. It almost feels like map 29 was meant to be the final map.

[Roofi]

 

Dead Simplistic level design

[spineapple tea]

Is the ending to dead simple really that off center? Jesus Christ.

[jerrysheppy]

Gotta be E2M9.  Maybe it would have been memorable in terms of the intensity of the fights, for 1993, but absolutely nothing else earns its keep.  Dead Simple at least gestures vaguely in the direction of some effort with the map geometry, and the moving platforms and 666/667 specials add some interest and novelty.

[DarkScythe13]

Honestly, I would go with E1M8. I have mixed feelings about it.

On the one hand, the music and environment carried a very sombre feeling as you march through, onwards to that final portal to be ripped to shreds by demons. In that sense it was something different I would imagine for a game of that time, and I suppose a decent way to set up the registered version episodes.

 

But on the other hand, those same points also make for a rather simple level and abrupt end that I never really looked forward to whenever I played it over the years. From an objective standpoint (for the reasons stated in the previous paragraph) the level was pretty good for what it was. But from a personal standpoint I couldnt help but want something a little different than what was there. I suppose its still the kid in me that felt underwhelmed,

[VGA]

Time to copy paste my comment on the "worst map" thread:

 

E2M1 is very basic and underwhelming. Especially for being the very first map you had to pay for in the history of Doom.

[BladeWolf]

Fortress of Mystery, no cap. Too short for a secret level, and the way it ended with all that door opening felt ridiculous to me. Worst of the 3 secret levels, and overall, less appealing. At least Warrens had you fight a Cybie, even with stuff like Invuls around it was fun.

[xvertigox]

E3M1 - As much as I am fond of it due to nostalgia and familiarity it could be a much stronger map in multiple respects. Progression wise, it's almost a straight line. Balancing wise it's complete dogshit (looking at you 'start of the map'). Some visual elements are good, particularly the starting area but could be expanded upon significantly.

Overall, I'd say it's a mediocre proper first foray into Hell. It does the trick but not well enough.

[Wagi]

On 12/7/2020 at 1:37 PM, IncognitoMode said:

I used to hate E4M1/E4M2 but I kinda like them now because of the challenge. To be honest the rest of thy flesh consumed is pretty forgettable,

and it has some pretty ugly texturing lol

The level doesn't have the best texturing but the complete lack of fake contrast and any sort of light distance fading is making it look way worse than it is supposed to.

[The_Hyphenator]

For most underwhelming, I'd probably have to go with Dead Simple. I like Doom 2 less than the original because so many of the levels boil down to throwing hordes and hordes of enemies at you, but most of the maps at least make it more interesting by having complex layouts. Dead Simple feels like it was just created to be a deathmatch map, and not a particularly interesting one at that. I also dislike it because it does such a poor job of showcasing the Mancubi and Arachnotrons in their first appearance. Doom 1 and 2 usually do an excellent job of introducing the new monster types and making them feel like worthy threats, but Dead Simple just kind of throws them out there without much pomp and circumstance.

[Silhouette 03]

E4M9. It just felt so out of place with the rest of the episode. Just a shores of hell styled techbase level while all the other levels were hellish  marble castle type levels. Not a great secret level either.

[Doomkid]

E3M1, E4M4 and MAP12 of Doom 2 are all contenders. Even the other “not so amazing” Iwad maps have more personality and charm which makes up for their imperfections, these 3 are just phoned in to the max.

[Cruduxy Pegg]

Map04 is more bland than overcooked rubbery boiled eggs. 

[leodoom85]

On 12/8/2020 at 6:12 PM, paturn said:

Mount Pain would have been a great finale to Evilution.

Except that the level sucks. Remaking the map by deleting most areas and make it more action-y would be much better.

At least map 30 has a proper buildup before throwing rockets to that brain once again...

[leodoom85]

About meh maps...I think that Dead Simple is the most meh map ever. Just a bunch of squares and probably 7 textures used.

7 hours ago, The_Hyphenator said:

Dead Simple just kind of throws them out there without much pomp and circumstance.

Yup. Basically they are there as mobile turrets while you have a lot of cover.

[VGA]

2 hours ago, Doomkid said:

E4M4

That map is the first time you start a map in the middle of a skirmish basically, it's awesome. That is my first death while playing PSX Doom currently (on HMP on my PSP). It was amazing, I got caught unaware by that "buncha imps behind your ass while you open a door to a huge room" trap.