Trevor0402's SC-55 soundfont

[DoomGater]

SC-55 (As the SCC-1  and SC-155 also ) was basically a ROM-Sample based Synth with Filters, Envelopes and LFOs, which can not easily be redone with a simple soundfont.
Many SMFs contained a bunch of GS-Sysex (F0h 41h 10h 42h 12h......) to control the synth engine directly end ensure best sound.
Are these soundfonts sysex-wise compatible? I'm not sure, but I doubt it.

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

1 hour ago, DoomGater said:

Are these soundfonts sysex-wise compatible? I'm not sure, but I doubt it.

I think that depends on the synthesizer the SoundFont is loaded into rather than the SoundFont itself.

 

 

More observations:

 

Instrument plays incorrectly: Lead 5 (charang).  Here is a comparison using Wave 1 from Apogee's Raptor (SC-55mkII recording by Nuke.YKT is first):

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/bmnpinggyo37011/raptor - wave 1 - real sc-55 vs sf2 v1.2b.wav?dl=0

 

Out-of-tune instruments: String Ensemble 1 and Distortion Guitar.  Very noticeable in this MIDI from a fighting game (I checked the music with Gravis UltraSound and MS Synth and there were no tuning issues):

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hechmlxbvwj24j6/sango fighter - tong pass - sc-55 sf2 v1.2b.wav?dl=0

 

Out-of-tune instrument: Lead 2 (sawtooth).  Very noticeable in this MIDI from a space shooter:

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/dy9qedixmbhozue/astrobatics - music3 - sc-55 sf2 v1.2b.wav?dl=0

Edited December 30, 2020 by TheUltimateDoomer666

[ketmar]

13 hours ago, TheUltimateDoomer666 said:

Something like this:

this is the first time i actually was able to understand what "envelope" is. post more pictures, please! ;-)

[THEBaratusII]

6 hours ago, TheUltimateDoomer666 said:

Out-of-tune instrument: Lead 2 (sawtooth).  Very noticeable in this MIDI from a space shooter:

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/dy9qedixmbhozue/astrobatics - music3 - sc-55 sf2 v1.2b.wav?dl=0

A bit off-topic here but, I love those MIDIs by the composer "Vakhtang Adamiya". Those MIDIs brings back memories. You should also give After The End MIDIs (made by the same composer) a listen. :)

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

6 hours ago, Baratus II said:

A bit off-topic here but, I love those MIDIs by the composer "Vakhtang Adamiya". Those MIDIs brings back memories. You should also give After The End MIDIs (made by the same composer) a listen. :)

I got the games Atomaders, Astrobatics, and Alien Sky long ago, although I could never finish some of them as they became way too difficult in the later levels.  I know about the After the End game but I've never played it.

[markanini]

CBLOOD7.MID from the game Blood has a erroneous pitchy effect on harp and strings. Here's the source midi:http://vgmpf.com/Wiki/images/b/b7/Blood_(DOS).zip  Compare to a SC-55 capture: https://youtu.be/lBk2YKacZa8

 

[Danfun64]

So apparently some stuff here is out of tune? Is the old EmperorGriefus soundfont out of tune in those same spots?

[OpenRift]

7 hours ago, Danfun64 said:

So apparently some stuff here is out of tune? Is the old EmperorGriefus soundfont out of tune in those same spots?

I don't believe so, but that uses innaccurate samples from the GS Wavetable synth.

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

Out-of-tune instrument: Pad 3 (polysynth). Below is a comparison using a track from the game After the End. The first part is rendered with an official GUS-based SoundFont (Voice Crystal 4 MB), and the second part is the SC-55 SoundFont where the pitch of the lead pads is noticeably off:

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/uhyvxcluwlb34mf/after the end - music6 - vc 4mb v4.1 vs sc-55 sf2 v1.2b.wav?dl=0

 

Out-of-tune instrument: Brass Section.  Noticeable in this intro from a Sonic & Knuckles Collection track (same comparison setup as above):

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/fjhq1cccnw2dob7/s%26kc - data 93 - vc 4mb v4.1 vs sc-55 sf2 v1.2b.wav?dl=0

[RottingZombie]

Generally speaking, is this soundfont an upgrade from scc1t2 (in forum members' opinions?)

[SyntherAugustus]

I'm curious how this compares with Sound Canvas VA. If anyone wants any comparisons, I'd be happy to render some.

 

Edit: They both sound pretty similar. I do prefer the sound of the sc8820 myself.

Edited January 3, 2021 by SyntherAugustus

[markanini]

2 hours ago, RottingZombie said:

Generally speaking, is this soundfont an upgrade from scc1t2 (in forum members' opinions?)

Yes, with one caveat. It's currently having teething problems.

[RottingZombie]

OK i tried it out 4 hours ago, and just stopped playing. Sounds really good for the most part. I setup GZDoom using the fluidsynth, set the gain to 1 and the reverb level to .25. I'm loving it. Had some odd instruments here and there in pwads. One example, map02 in the merry christmassy doom project. If you load that you'll immediately hear something is off. But I'm not too knowledgeable about this stuff so I'm not sure if there's a problem or not. The other two fonts I keep on a keybind are CT8MGM.SF2 and The_Fairy_Tale_Bank.sf2 (if one sounds off on a song, i can swap instantly). This one will become one of my three, replacing scc1t2

 

All in all, I really ultra thank you for this. I love soundfonts and this one seems like the holy grail. If you fix the minor issues people have pointed out, it will become the stuff of legends.

 

So happy.

[OpenRift]

On 1/2/2021 at 9:53 PM, SyntherAugustus said:

I'm curious how this compares with Sound Canvas VA. If anyone wants any comparisons, I'd be happy to render some.

 

Edit: They both sound pretty similar. I do prefer the sound of the sc8820 myself.

I actually tested this a while back and there's a huge caveat: certain instrument aren't the same at all. It's most noticeable on the Doom 1 title screen. 

 

SCVA:

 

SC-55

 

Edited January 4, 2021 by OpenRift

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

5 hours ago, OpenRift said:

I actually tested this a while back and there's a huge caveat: certain instruments aren't mapped properly it seems.

That has nothing to do with instrument mapping.  It's just that some of the instruments sound different.  Although the SC-8820 (hardware)/SCVA (software) does have an SC-55-compatible mode, it uses some different samples compared to native SC-55 (i.e., the mapping/sound set from the original SC-55 modules).  Another instrument difference is String Ensemble 1 (used in E1M5/"Suspense").  The instrument is mapped correctly, but its samples are totally different in SCVA's SC-55 mode versus a real SC-55.

Edited January 4, 2021 by TheUltimateDoomer666

[OpenRift]

1 minute ago, TheUltimateDoomer666 said:

That has nothing to do with instrument mapping.  It's just that some of the instruments sound different.  Although the SC-8820 (hardware)/SCVA (software) does have an SC-55-compatible mode, it uses some different samples compared to native SC-55.  Another instrument difference is String Ensemble 1 (used in E1M5/"Suspense").  The instrument is mapped correctly, but its samples are totally different in SCVA's SC-55 mode versus a real SC-55.

So SCVA uses the SC-8820 ROM as a base, then?

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

4 minutes ago, OpenRift said:

So SCVA uses the SC-8820 ROM as a base, then?

Yes, SCVA is not a dedicated SC-55 emulator.

[Doomkid]

On 1/3/2021 at 1:42 PM, RottingZombie said:

Generally speaking, is this soundfont an upgrade from scc1t2 (in forum members' opinions?)

I would say so, but even if you prefer scc1t2, here’s a version with slightly better tone and better instrument mixing - plus low range piano music doesn’t go out of tune! https://musical-artifacts.com/artifacts/724

 

(You can compare Wormhole from Final Doom as a good test of low range piano sound)

[RottingZombie]

@Doomkid Awesome, downloaded. I'll put this in rotation, thanks!

[Bauul]

Forgive the super newbie question (I have very little knowledge of MIDI soundfonts), but I tried adding this into GZDoom using the FluidSynth (which is what I usually use), and I'm getting a horrendous opening note to E1M6's music:

 

 

Have I set up something really wrong, or is there something off with the soundfont?  I previously used scc1t2 and it sounded fine.

[RottingZombie]

@Bauul I get the same thing, I assume it's something that will be tweaked in further updates. This is why I keep a few soundfonts on keybinds in GZDoom :D

[trioct]

I don't get that sound on e1m6 with prboom+ or gzdoom and fluidsynth with this soundfont. Though I usually use prboom+, so I tested with default settings on gzdoom. Maybe I'm doing something wrong (or right?)

[adamastor]

Does anyone know if it's possible to get this soundfont to work with the EDuke32 source port?

[ThunderMite42]

I have a MIDI that doesn't play properly when using the soundfont with VirtualMidiSynth, which is attached in a zip. To demonstrate, I included an MP3 conversion (by VMS' built-in converter), as well as a comparison recording that I made when using the soundfont in Falcosoft's SoundFont Midi Player (via BassMidi) in the same zip. I don't know if my settings are bad or if it's a problem with the MIDI itself.

CBGiygasint.zip

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

2 hours ago, ThunderMite42 said:

I have a MIDI that doesn't play properly when using the soundfont with VirtualMidiSynth, which is attached in a zip.

I can't recreate the problem.

 

I tested the MIDI with VirtualMIDISynth 2.10.2.0 and 2.11.0.0 with the SC-55 SoundFont loaded, and the MIDI plays correctly.  I also tested VMS' converter and the resulting WAV render did not have any issues.

[Doomag]

I was going to write about how patrch93's soundfont sounds better in certain areas but after some some comparisons I can honestly say that while the drums do indeed sounds a little better with the patch93 version this is indeed the most accurate soundfont I have found. It's not quite 1 to 1 but it's very close. 

 

My only problem is the gain, it's a little on the quite side. Does anyone know how to address this? I am using coolsoft virtualmidisynth 

[Doomag]

On 12/27/2020 at 8:57 AM, Trevor0402 said:

The reverb and chorus system on the unit has a default of 64 and 127 at max. I could only assume with that, that 50 would be normal.

I just now at the time of you reading this. Testing this soundfont's performance with chorus using music from Heretic. Specifically the theme known as Cesspool. This foundfont has reproduced the chorus very accurately to a genuine SC-55 recording. Very impressive.

[OpenRift]

On 2/26/2021 at 1:19 AM, Doomag said:

I just now at the time of you reading this. Testing this soundfont's performance with chorus using music from Heretic. Specifically the theme known as Cesspool. This foundfont has reproduced the chorus very accurately to a genuine SC-55 recording. Very impressive.

Well, it is based on a ROM dump

[Doomag]

On 3/1/2021 at 11:14 AM, OpenRift said:

Well, it is based on a ROM dump

aren't all soundfonts including patch93 based on a ROM?

 

Also is there any way to use the ROM itself with an emulator?

[TheUltimateDoomer666]

20 minutes ago, Doomag said:

aren't all soundfonts including patch93 based on a ROM?

No.  SoundFont is a file format for storing samples (which can be anything from sounds ripped from ROMs to recordings of laughter), while a ROM is the data from a read-only memory chip.

 

20 minutes ago, Doomag said:

Also is there any way to use the ROM itself with an emulator?

There is unfortunately no true SC-55 emulator available.