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Captain Keen

What do you want id to do next after Eternal?

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PAX is going to announce a mystery game. I'm expecting it to be a brand new Quake, especially considering the recent out of nowhere rerelease of Quake 1.

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On 9/3/2021 at 2:57 PM, whatup876 said:

without going too edgy like Agony.

Man I didn't even care about Agony's over-the-top edginess, frankly that's what i went in looking for. Maximum extreme content, just the grisliest, nastiest shit they could dream up. And yet I couldn't get into it at all because no amount of exploitative grindhouse indulgence could make up for crappy, unintuitive, narrow, trial-and-error gameplay.

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Another comparison of TAG and 64 is one new weapon: Unmaker and the Sentinel hammer/Hellbreaker.

 

I heard Agony was also buggy at launch.

Though with Doom's case and extreme content, it's like a matter of "How cool can it be?".

 

edit: also idea for a demon design: a star shaped one like a Decarabia sort of thing.

Edited by whatup876

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Frankly, before id does anything, Microsoft should get them away from the Zenimax corporate structure as soon as humanly possible.

 

id Software as a developer is on the same level of prestige, influence, and consistent critical/commercial success as Nintendo EAD and Rockstar North, and they don't deserve to be a subsidiary of a subsidiary. Shit, Zenimax as a corporation only survived past 2017 based solely on id properties/engines and Doom hype.

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I would actually really love to see a Doom Enemy Territory.

 

Imagine a game where you play as arc or demon forces in the Invasion of Earth. 

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On this episode of "random ideas i pull out of my mind": if id tries another attempt at a "CEO of Hell" (whether or not it's just experimentation or a response to how people felt about TAG 2), maybe the thing on Davoth's chest could be like a weak spot for a boss.

If the IOS has the forehead hole, some other big boss has something in the chest.

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how about a "rage 3", but with entertaining vehicle handling and minus 50% unnecessary filler stuff?

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I was thinking of Animatrix, Star Wars Visions, Batman Gotham Knight, Marvel's What If, Halo Legends and wondered if a "Doom compilation" type of thing could work.

Maybe as an actual series of animated shorts and not an actual game trying different styles.

Reminds me of that Doom tribute animation project from Newgrounds, with the Into Sandy's City remix.

 

Also, just saw this concept art for the shoulder cannon:

 

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If it's a successor: Quake (1) II or Doom (2016) III. 

 

But I would prefer a new IP. What about Wor? 

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Everything about Davoth is such a bitter disappointment that does its damnedest to spoil the entire neu-Doom saga. The only good thing they could do going forward is to ignore him and never mention him again.

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Either a Quake reboot or a new IP all together, i feel like they could benefit from the creative liberty of building something from the ground up, since the Rage series was a flop.

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On 9/14/2021 at 4:49 AM, whatup876 said:

There was some DL concept on Twitter:

The Dark Lord's New Groove.

I actually really like this look a lot. It's probably less memorable than the final one with the face though. The final one has a bold sort of physique to it with the large chest and all, while this one kind of has a large brute form, with lower neck and head and overall wide body.

 

That bold physique in the final very much fits the attitude that the Dark Lord is imposing on the Doom Slayer.

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I still think the armor and the Marauder-like moveset could have been for something else (like a super heavy type enemy), when the "he's you in their world" part and looking like Doomguy meant a more obvious conclusion: mirror/copycat character with similar armor and moveset/arsenal.

Feels like a grand video game err/sin to make a character start off as "he's like an you but evil", then have a gameplay and final design that barely match that.

 

Like, he could have been a Doomguy clone made by Hell just to spite him and "fight fire with fire" but otherwise, it feels more like a bunch of Satanic cultists with high tech and Doomguy's angry twin brother got himself a mech, not so much the "heart of Hell" itself.

Dark Lord as a whole keeps my mind busy because it's a fusion of ideas that could have been seperated and done very differently.

 

Satan? Could have been something stranger and more fucked up than the IOS.

God? VEGA already fills that.

The Mech? Like i said, some super heavy enemy.

Evil Doomguy? Actually make that a thing, because it would even complement the power level/fantasy focus and the character action comparisons.

 

It's something i feel like could be studied.

A lot of the lore feels like it wants to "outnerd Doom" or lean into sci-fi territory of "logic and explenations", which at times doesn't even match a realistic example of what someone thinks a Doom universe could be like.

 

I guess the name "Davoth" in itself isn't bad and the song used by Andrew Hulshult was neat.

 

I think a new IP could be interesting, even if there's a lot about new Doom that feels very different from the previous games.

Like, the Sentinels and Urdak or even just how the UAC and Hell is written/designed now.

So i wonder if a new IP could have things that make you go "that could have been in Doom".

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20 hours ago, whatup876 said:

I still think the armor and the Marauder-like moveset could have been for something else

I gave up all hope for anything clever or imaginative to happen with the series going forward when this was the best they could muster; a retread of the whole Marauder thing, which is already boring as fuck to begin with without being stretched out to a 30-minute-long five-round slog.

 

I want to hope and pray there was originally some much more ambitious ideas for the Dark Lord's design and battle semantics, but the more design stuff they show, the more it seems the awful mech battle was the only thing they ever thought of and we were not just in fact cheated out of something epic by a combination of COVID and Bethesda's shitty marketing ("Year One Pass == it has to be done by a year" - please stop doing this, game studios, just stop - get help).

 

Quote

it feels more like a bunch of Satanic cultists with high tech and Doomguy's angry twin brother got himself a mech, not so much the "heart of Hell" itself.

Dark Lord as a whole keeps my mind busy because it's a fusion of ideas that could have been seperated and done very differently.

The entirety of DLC2 runs off the rails tonally speaking, spoils and trashes all the previous lore, and turns the Doom series into Hugo's personal Marvel Universe wannabe. Hell is no longer actually Hell in the Doom universe, something we'd have called a cardinal sin before. Now it's just some dimension, originally Heaven basically, that the master of went nuts and corrupted of his own accord because he was throwing a toddler-style temper tantrum after his own ill-advised creations realized "hey this guy is a dipshit and is dangerous to all of reality, we should seal him away".

 

The entirety of Immora is disappointing as well, as a would-be finale to the Doom series. It does nothing to sum up your journey to that point. It throws no references to the series, it's just a reskinned Urdak - pretty sure it's the same meshes with palette-swapped textures in many cases. Like, it wouldn't be wrong or impossible to have a techy city in Hell, it's actually a pretty core "Doom" concept, but there's a way to do it, and this is not it. It needs to not override the essence of what Hell itself is, and this does feel like it does that.

 

Are we supposed to actually be sympathetic to Davoth? Oh no he was the real God and was so wronged! Yeah and then he made Hell and demons, and corrupted countless worlds, and consumed all the souls in them to power his own immortality - that's not good or justified in any way. The Father wasn't wrong to seal him away, and you're not wrong to stab him in the heart. So the entire twist of him being "G" God is unnecessary ultimately, it accomplishes nothing narratively speaking.

 

Doom '16 worked as well as it did, with a story thrown together in mere minutes apparently, because they hired a professional writer and most importantly, they let him do his own thing without a bunch of executive meddling. Eternal is a mess because Hugo has his hands in the pie filling, doing part of the writing himself on top of railroading in every random idea he had gameplay-wise. The fact about six different people are credited on Eternal just for writing makes you realize it's no wonder there's so many inconsistencies; violent, jarring twists of narrative; and downright amateur development. That's not to even mention the embarrassing amount of grammar and spelling errors.

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23 minutes ago, Quasar said:

I gave up all hope for anything clever or imaginative to happen with the series going forward when this was the best they could muster; a retread of the whole Marauder thing, which is already boring as fuck to begin with without being stretched out to a 30-minute-long five-round slog.

 

Yes, not to mention Hugo emphasising multiple times how he absolutely LOVES this mechanic and also taking into consideration that Sekiro is his favorite game we are probably going to see more marauder bullshit in the future.

 

Btw. last stream we had a tiny tiny premise that Id is working on something else than doom Hugo said: "Only thing I want to do are doom games" then immediately corrects himself and says: "I shouldn't say that, I want to make action FPS games at Id". Besides, Slayer's arc is over so it makes sense to leave doom for now, but only time will tell.

 

Maybe we shouldn't be so harsh about the DLC it is clear they didn't have much time and they were trying their best, even if it is not very good it is ok. Only thing to do is to wait for another game and we are gonna wait quite a long time sicne thay stopped working on eternal only in march this year after DLC2 release and they still produce new content like master levels, horde mode and maybe even invasion mode I think the next game won't drop before 2025.

.

23 minutes ago, Quasar said:

 

 

That's not to even mention the embarrassing amount of grammar and spelling errors.

Really? that is dissapointing I am not playing on english version and I didn't notice that. Translation seems fine.

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12 hours ago, Quasar said:

I gave up all hope for anything clever or imaginative to happen with the series going forward when this was the best they could muster; a retread of the whole Marauder thing, which is already boring as fuck to begin with without being stretched out to a 30-minute-long five-round slog.

 

I want to hope and pray there was originally some much more ambitious ideas for the Dark Lord's design and battle semantics, but the more design stuff they show, the more it seems the awful mech battle was the only thing they ever thought of and we were not just in fact cheated out of something epic by a combination of COVID and Bethesda's shitty marketing ("Year One Pass == it has to be done by a year" - please stop doing this, game studios, just stop - get help).

 

The entirety of DLC2 runs off the rails tonally speaking, spoils and trashes all the previous lore, and turns the Doom series into Hugo's personal Marvel Universe wannabe. Hell is no longer actually Hell in the Doom universe, something we'd have called a cardinal sin before. Now it's just some dimension, originally Heaven basically, that the master of went nuts and corrupted of his own accord because he was throwing a toddler-style temper tantrum after his own ill-advised creations realized "hey this guy is a dipshit and is dangerous to all of reality, we should seal him away".

 

The entirety of Immora is disappointing as well, as a would-be finale to the Doom series. It does nothing to sum up your journey to that point. It throws no references to the series, it's just a reskinned Urdak - pretty sure it's the same meshes with palette-swapped textures in many cases. Like, it wouldn't be wrong or impossible to have a techy city in Hell, it's actually a pretty core "Doom" concept, but there's a way to do it, and this is not it. It needs to not override the essence of what Hell itself is, and this does feel like it does that.

 

Are we supposed to actually be sympathetic to Davoth? Oh no he was the real God and was so wronged! Yeah and then he made Hell and demons, and corrupted countless worlds, and consumed all the souls in them to power his own immortality - that's not good or justified in any way. The Father wasn't wrong to seal him away, and you're not wrong to stab him in the heart. So the entire twist of him being "G" God is unnecessary ultimately, it accomplishes nothing narratively speaking.

 

Doom '16 worked as well as it did, with a story thrown together in mere minutes apparently, because they hired a professional writer and most importantly, they let him do his own thing without a bunch of executive meddling. Eternal is a mess because Hugo has his hands in the pie filling, doing part of the writing himself on top of railroading in every random idea he had gameplay-wise. The fact about six different people are credited on Eternal just for writing makes you realize it's no wonder there's so many inconsistencies; violent, jarring twists of narrative; and downright amateur development. That's not to even mention the embarrassing amount of grammar and spelling errors.


Davoth isn’t the “G”od of this universe. Martin already implied there are others. And the World Spear is the first hint 

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I still recall the father saying he was "the first being and my creator" and Davoth saying "as all things were made by my hand, shall they soon be unmade, starting with you" and "have you nothing to say to your creator before you strike him down?".

I feel like "he's not God" is from a stream based on fan reaction after TAG2.

It's pretty clear even they are aware of how people reacted to the whole thing.

They also mentioned DL was supposed to have a "dragon" form in a stream, i think.

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On 9/23/2021 at 6:20 AM, whatup876 said:

They also mentioned DL was supposed to have a "dragon" form in a stream, i think.

 

Do you recall in which stream that was said? Something like this, placed in Nekravol, would've been way better, in my opinion:
Unbenannt.png.31a82b7e2daa865f32b951ffaa4a481b.png

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