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Could Id make another retro Doom game? What should one look like in your opinion?

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Posted (edited)

Yesterday somebody wrote that a sequel to Doom 64 should be made. O course that got me daydreaming about what a return to the classic Doom would look like. When I play Doom Eternal for a few minutes, I'm stunned by the experience but then I'm good for the day and miss playing my old addictive Doom 2. So maybe there could be a middle ground between dazzling graphics and captivating gameplay. I wonder what new qualities should a new retro Doom bring and which it should preserve. In my opinion, one of the important things that should stay is the horizontal-only look. I get the impression that obligatory freelook is the main factor that spoils the fun of mods like Brutal Doom. What would be great seeing is a departure from flat and gaunt level design and having environments filled with impressive shapes and pixelated textures. I think that the megawad Ancient Aliens serves as a good example in favour of making the environments more varied. 

 

The second question is how absurd it even is to contemplate a possibility of seeing a return to the classics. To which I say this - if you look at Doom 2, it was supposed to be the last Doom game. They even called it Final Doom. Later their games were focused on bringing technical advancements instead of sticking to the old formula, and were indeed different, however Doom 2 wasn't the final retro Doom because we got Doom 64 in 1997 and later in 2020. In 2020 we also got Doom Eternal which on many levels acknowledges, references the classic Doom and existence of its fans. So while modern shooters bring big profit, it's not out of the question that making another boomer shooter could've crossed the mind of people holding the IP. The rise in quantity of boomer shooters is also a positive factor. If tiny studios can pull off impressive games like Prodeus, Viscerafest, a big studio could easily produce something worthwhile for the upcoming 20th anniversary of Doom. 

 

Okay, it's fine - dismiss my wishful thinking. But I wrote this mostly because I'm geninely curious how you'd best see the old Doom resurrected. So if you have some cool ideas share them with the others.

Edited by <<Rewind

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They probably could. Most things could be done. But why would they? Is it a good use of resources / talent / technology to do so? What innovations would it bring to the table? How would it push the genre & technology forward? 

 

Also, you mean 30th anniversary, right?

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Honestly I would love to see a sendup to classic Doom with 2D sprites and everything. Take a little inspiration from Project Brutality and give enemies tons of death animations, throw in some weapons from later games like the gauss cannon and the soul cube, redraw everything in a similar style to the original with improvements a la Sonic Mania.

How cool would it be if they built it with GZDoom so we can mod it?

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2 minutes ago, Rytrik said:

They probably could. Most things could be done. But why would they? Is it a good use of resources / talent / technology to do so? What innovations would it bring to the table? How would it push the genre & technology forward? 

Innovation is a meme. Their #1 priority should be making good games.

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Of course they could, but from my POV the question is not "can they" but "should they".

 

id Software have always been innovators and moving things forward in the industry, so them doing retro games as well sounds a bit counter-intuitive to me. I think that's a job best left to other studios while id focuses on other things instead.

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Maybe a game like this wouldn't require considerable resources and still enrich the gaming world by refining a fairly niche genre. Something golden can be made by respecting what makes Doom relevant, not the altogether different shooters that came afterwards. And well, if you say it needs to be innovative, there's probably a way to be so in doing this.

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I think that they are kinda doing it already.

Thats what the curated add-ons may be, somehow.

 

Those mapset have the seal of quality by them, but the 28 years of mapping experience from the community.

Its a win/win situation.

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Could they? Sure. Should they? Maybe? Will they? Nah.

 

I'd see it much more likely that they'd outsource to the community and do what SEGA did with Sonic Mania. I think that would be really neat, but it's essentially what's been happening on its own just without the commercial bit.

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I thought we the community already do that :O

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, <

Maybe a game like this wouldn't require considerable resources and still enrich the gaming world by refining a fairly niche genre. Something golden can be made by respecting what makes Doom relevant, not the altogether different shooters that came afterwards. And well, if you say it needs to be innovative, there's probably a way to be so in doing this.

 

Everything requires resources. So unless it's a pet project, resources put towards towards this are resources which are pulled away from the main title that they're creating. They're already often in crunch to get the main game made; where are you expecting more time & energy to come from for them to create a retro title? And what sacrifices are you asking them to make to create this retro game? Time with their family / exercise / relaxation / vacation / hobbies?

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I imagine it as a new Doom IWAD, rather than a custom wad for Doom II. I'd love to see some new weapons, new monsters, more textures and new levels. Oh yeah and more Wolfenstein3D and Commander Keen secret levels and references.

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It would be neat, but like others said, it would be more of a side project. I imagine it could be similar to what Bethesda did with Doom 64, let someone make that while you promote the newest and up-to-date game. On the other hand, there's studios who make "new" retro games in the modern day, like New Blood Interactive. Or John Romero, if he feels inclined to do so.

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3 hours ago, <<Rewind said:

I'm geninely curious how you'd best see the old Doom resurrected.

 

While I am also curious about what a Classic Doom remake would look like using the retro throwback angle built on different tech with new art and such, I'm inclined to agree with SOSU on the premise that the community's efforts have pretty much made that kind of idea redundant. I mean, sure, it could work and would in all likelihood be pretty cool, but with everything that's been managed to be achieved in regards to sprite work, textures, modding, sourceport programming, level editing, music and all the other bits and pieces people have injected into Classic Doom that has ensured its continued survival and evolution over the past 20 years, there isn't much of a need for it in all honesty. The Doom community has done-and continues to do-all the leg work the game ever needs to stay relevant. Mind you, I hope I'm not coming across as a naysayer here. If this kind of thing were to be done, I certainly wouldn't fob off the idea and would likely be supportive if it looked promising. But if it never happens, I wouldn't lose sleep over it. After all, you don't need to resurrect something that never died in the first place. ;^) :^P

 

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3 hours ago, Rytrik said:

They probably could. Most things could be done. But why would they? Is it a good use of resources / talent / technology to do so? What innovations would it bring to the table? How would it push the genre & technology forward? 

 

Also, you mean 30th anniversary, right?

 

It is a good Way to let Newcomers to the Company / Job have a Project where they can proof themself, let them collect Experience and also to learn the Philosophy behind the Frenchises.

 

Also it is a cheap Way to gain Information if there is a Market for certain Things.

As they can test Stuff in smaller Projects you can not in bigger Investions.

 

So that C-Team could play around with a classic Game and maybe find some new Ideas.

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Posted (edited)

they could, but a.) they never will cuz they're only gonna do whatever will make the most money and b.) they shouldn't cuz, honestly, it'd probably suck ass.

 

3 hours ago, seed said:

id Software have always been innovators and moving things forward in the industry, so them doing retro games as well sounds a bit counter-intuitive to me. I think that's a job best left to other studios while id focuses on other things instead.

maybe when carmack was still there, buuuut he's not there anymore. i really don't think they're as hell-bent on bringing the world closer and closer to the robot apocalypse as they were when he was there

 

2 hours ago, Rytrik said:

 

Everything requires resources. So unless it's a pet project, resources put towards towards this are resources which are pulled away from the main title that they're creating. They're already often in crunch to get the main game made; where are you expecting more time & energy to come from for them to create a retro title? And what sacrifices are you asking them to make to create this retro game? Time with their family / exercise / relaxation / vacation / hobbies?

okay. so, while i highly doubt they're ever gonna make a new retro-styled game unless the current series gets burnt out or one of the games goes into development hell, they have more than enough resources to do it. they have millions of dollars at their disposal, billions if you count all the money their publisher has. they can just...y'know...hire more people? outsource it? this is an enormous company we're talking about, not a small indie team made up of 6 people

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By "id" you mean current id or, y'know, both Johns, Sandy Petersen, American McGee, Tom Hall and the others?

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2 hours ago, DavetheDoomguy said:

It would be neat, but like others said, it would be more of a side project. I imagine it could be similar to what Bethesda did with Doom 64, let someone make that while you promote the newest and up-to-date game. On the other hand, there's studios who make "new" retro games in the modern day, like New Blood Interactive. Or John Romero, if he feels inclined to do so.

Speaking of which, what ever happened to Blackroom? I have not heard anything about it in years.

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2 minutes ago, Rudolph said:

Speaking of which, what ever happened to Blackroom? I have not heard anything about it in years.

 

No clue, all I could find was that there hasn't been any updates since 2019. 

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13 minutes ago, DU0 said:

By "id" you mean current id or, y'know, both Johns, Sandy Petersen, American McGee, Tom Hall and the others?

 

Honestly this would be super cool.  In particular I would die to see what kind of maps Sandy would make 30 years on and without the same time pressures he had in 1993-4.

 

Honestly I don't really want to see current id Software do a retro project.  It's strange to say given how much I love old games and old media but I like novelty in the actual game industry, and all the nostalgia projects kind of feel worn after a while to be honest.  I get the incentives for AAA game titles and blockbuster films to all be based off of old familiar IPs that they already know will sell but if anything I'd prefer id take another crack at something new.  And this in spite of the fact that I actually both like and admire the two new Doom games for what they set out to do with them.

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Posted (edited)

Given the unbelievable quality this community has pumped out over the last quarter century and change, a lot of which leaves the original maps for dead, I really fail to see the point of them doing so.

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Alot of boomer shooters out there... I'd love to see someone do a real gorgeous one. A trillion sprites, 130 FPS, etc etc

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I don't think Id would be interested in doing such a thing, the continuous stream of high quality WADs makes it so they don't even need to. I imagine, even with their expertise, people would wonder what the point in buying it would be over just playing one of the high quality, curated wads that are already in the official Doom 1 and 2 port. There is always the possibility of a group of devs at Id deciding to work on a little WAD for Doom 2, much like Nerve did with NRFTL or machine games did with their Quake episode.

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Blizzard currently has two side projects bringing the old classics back from the dead (Diablo 2 and a triple pack with The Lost Vikings, Blackthorne, and Rock N Roll Racing). A similar thing has already been done with Doom 64. It goes to show there's interest in this kind of things. While it's true that the old Doom never died, I believe that there could be a new game in the series based on a new, yet still mod-friendly technology. Like Prodeus - modern and retro at the same time. 

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7 hours ago, Egg Boy said:

There is always the possibility of a group of devs at Id deciding to work on a little WAD for Doom 2, much like Nerve did with NRFTL or Machine Games did with their Quake episode.

 

This is why, should there be a Quake remake, I want MachineGames to develop it. That campaign episode was phenomenal, fam. MachineGames gets Quake. It'd be in good hands as far as I'm concerned. 

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