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DavidN

How did you find out how to defeat the Icon of Sin?

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Posted (edited)

How did you first work out/find out how to hurt and ultimately kill the Icon of Sin?


I was watching a video by @Ryath (aka scwiba) on one of my episodes, and realized I could have done more to indicate the player had to shoot at the Icon-alike to end the last level. Then I remembered how much trouble I had with the end of Doom 2 when I was 12 - did you realize what to do immediately, work it out, cheat past it?

 

It’s like nothing else in any Doom level - a timing challenge where you have to use a very specific weapon. At this stage I was going through the game entirely with IDDQD and was wandering around confused for a long time - I even remember trying to catch one of the spawn cubes to see what it did, and getting a huge surprise when I died - this thing was powerful enough even to cut through my invulnerability!

 

Eventually I noticed the central platform was lifting me up to the inviting-looking exposed brain in the top of the wall. Finding out what to do with it was another challenge - I realized that the platform moved up just slightly too far to be useful, so I started trying to time the charge up of the BFG to shoot through the tiny opening. Naturally that took ages and didn’t do anything once I got it right - but why wouldn’t you assume you had to use your best weapon?!

 

Eventually I cheated through the wall and got a shock when I found a head on a stick, but found that shooting at it made it react and eventually end the level. It was only when I read the ending text - which happens to mention rockets specifically - that I thought to go back and try them on the brain instead.

 

Of course, I wouldn’t understand why only rockets worked until much later on...

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I used to watch my dad play. He couldn't beat Doom II and Plutonia map 30 because we couldn't figure out that you needed to shoot rockets with the correct timing. It became obvious in Evilution Map 30 what you needed to do.

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I enjoyed visiting John Romero's head with idclip as a kid, couldn't figure out why there was a head there and ended up understanding that the hole on the forehead was linked to it. That helped when I did my first legit playthrough.

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Posted (edited)

Trial and error and the lack of knowledge in regards to blast damage

It was (I think) around 2008, when 9 years old me figured out I had to shoot rockets into the "brain" pit, because the BFG didn't work. Back then I didn't know what's really going on behind the fake wall, so I naively launched a green ball of death through it. Of course, it wont work because the tracers hitscans are obscured by the wall, but I wasn't aware of this, until the plasma also failed me and tried to pump rockets through. The rest is history.

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My dad actually told me - only after I tried it multiple times myself w/ no luck... I think I was 8 or 9 when I beat Doom 2 for the first time - only on ITYTD though, lol

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I had heard about the John Romero's head thing and the backwards message before I ever got the chance to play Doom II; I don't remember how, maybe a magazine or some other kid told me. But regardless the mystery of beating the IoS was spoiled for me. I think nowadays, especially with how prominent videos and articles about game easter eggs are, most newer fans already know about some of this stuff before playing the games themselves.

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I never played Doom when I was a kid, picked it up about a 10 months ago, and even though I never saw any video showing the icon of sin being beaten, just from random knowledge of popular games, I just knew what had to be done and that there's a head bad there. Think that's how anyone new to the series these days would figure it out, it's just a thing people know now.

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I never had internet as a kid, when I was first playing through doom, and didn't know anyone else who played the game. So I had to figure it out myself through desperate trial and error. I can't remember the moment I actually figured it out though. 

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I had a feeling you needed to fire into the DBRAIN lava texture head and tried different weapons but then realized the rocket launcher was the way to go.

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I don't remember that much but I believed it was when I noclipped and saw Romero's head and shot him until the level ended. I never beat the map legitimately back then because I didn't knew that the Icon of Sin walls were actually switches that lowered the lifts and I thought they were just decoration.

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I think I was around 12-13. The cubes coming out of the lava texture in its head acted like an instruction manual for my younger self on how to kill it. Took another 5 minutes or so before I figured out I needed to use rockets.

 

I had far more trouble at that age on Map 28 (Spirit World). I was stuck on that map for well over an hour because I didn't know how to open the exit room by shooting the wall. When I finally did open it I was instantly gibbed by the Arch-Viles. I was not a happy puppy.

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Press esc, up arrow, enter and then y. Works every time.

 

...

 

Ok fine I learned it from decino. You can take away my Doomer licence now.

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I read the "Official" DOOM FAQ which got shipped with Ultimate DOOM, before I ever got DOOM II. That gave all the hints needed to find 100% secrets and defeat the final boss. My enjoyment of DOOM II when I finally got it was thoroughly spoiled by this.

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I've heard about the John Romero and the secret message when I was 10, I think, then I nocliped into the Icon's brain and shot at Romero.
Then after some time I watched a playthrough (I think it was either Decino or BigMacDavis), and killed the IOS.
 

Spoiler

I killed him with cheats.

 

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The box of rockets that's on the lift made me put two and two together and figure it out from there.

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I had an attractively-printed Doom II strategy guide which I used to read in detail over and over again (much like the one I think you did for Ascent of Titan, @DavidN).

I think I had that before I had the actual game. I... liked reading gameplay tips for games I didn't own.
 

I have no idea how/whether I would have worked out how to kill the Icon without the guide.

One thing I am proud of is that I immediately recognised the "To Win the Game..." sound clip as backwards speak and used a wad util that had been bundled on a shovelware CD to extract the .wav file. Windows 3.1 sound recorder could reverse sound samples. That was the first easter egg I ever discovered.

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I always just noclipped to Romeo’s head as a kid as never could work out how to do it legit :-P

 

It was probably years later that I worked out you could shoot it as the lift went up.

 

And I only relatively recently learnt from a Decino video that the lift switch gives you a hint :-P

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38 minutes ago, LordEntr0py said:

I had an attractively-printed Doom II strategy guide which I used to read in detail over and over again.

I think I had that before I had the actual game. I... liked reading gameplay tips for games I didn't own.
 

I have no idea how/whether I would have worked out how to kill the Icon without the guide.

Ah yes, the strategy guide. Now there's a relic of a bygone age for ya! I used to own a 200+ page one for Empire Earth II. I read it so often that it practically came apart at the seams (my terrible childhood habit of chewing on the corners of pages didn't help of course...)

 

42 minutes ago, LordEntr0py said:

(much like the one I think you did for Ascent of Titan, @DavidN)

Linky?

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Once the lift is raised was easy to figure out, but playing only keyboard was quite hardcore for a kid.

I thought it was an impossible task and left the game for almost a month. When I came back to try again did it 1st try, was an amazing feeling

watching the Icon of Sin exploding, ahhhh the memories.

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i started shooting rockets randomly, probably with godmode on, and then i realized you have to shoot while your RL is level with it's chin

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1 hour ago, Omniarch said:

Ah yes, the strategy guide. Now there's a relic of a bygone age for ya! I used to own a 200+ page one for Empire Earth II. I read it so often that it practically came apart at the seams (my terrible childhood habit of chewing on the corners of pages didn't help of course...)

My favourite strategy guide was the Civilization II one. Got it alongside the collector's issue of the game one Christmas.

 

Was a week before I could get home to play it. Must have read the entire thing twice before I did.

 

Bit of light bedtime reading.

1 hour ago, Omniarch said:

linky?

There's an example screenshot on David's download page.

 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

hmmm i think searching it on the wiki. 

 

also hoy did you figure how to defeat TNT IoS? That IoS where you have to shoot rockets not to DBRAIN texture but to the nose xD

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Never beat it albeit after cheating I recognized the required strategy at least.

 

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Idclipped to Romero, killed him and then read that red text screen about rockets.

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off topic but sometimes i see some noobs playing doom 2 for the first time online and it saddens my heart when they use the bfg on the icon of sin

saddens me even more when they dont stop after i tell then that it does no damage to him

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1 hour ago, omalefico32x said:

off topic but sometimes i see some noobs playing doom 2 for the first time online and it saddens my heart when they use the bfg on the icon of sin

saddens me even more when they dont stop after i tell then that it does no damage to him

It's one thing if they don't know, but if they keep doing it after you told them that you're supposed to use the rocket launcher, that's just downright retarded. 

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First time I beat the Icon was in GZDoom with mouselook. I hate that I did that, because I didn't know any better. This is where my disdain for GZDoom began. 

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