Doom 3D limitations visualized with a bit of modding

[borogk]

 

[Dragonfly]

I've got to say, the editing on show here is absolutely fantastic! Informative video that veterans here already know, but a brilliant resource for newer people to the doom scene - were I not already here this content is still the kind of thing I'd happily watch as an outsider (and already do with things like speedrunning channels and the likes)

 

Keep it up!

[tuturbo1991]

I learned so much with your video, thank you! Also great visuals and pace.

[Jimmy]

Fantastic video! The visualisations of both sides of the argument are great. Also, the

 

Spoiler

rocket on legs doing sick platforming

 

made me laugh way more than it should have.

[1Destro3456]

Awesome video, very informative and the editing is so good. Also, even if I knew Doom was actually 3D I still learned something like the pixel columns, I still gotta hand it to you with how you used editing to visualize the effect. Awesome job.

[borogk]

5 minutes ago, 1Destro3456 said:

Awesome video, very informative and the editing is so good. Also, even if I knew Doom was actually 3D I still learned something like the pixel columns, I still gotta hand it to you with how you used editing to visualize the effect. Awesome job.

 

Thanks! It's actually same for me - column rendering is the only thing mentioned in the video, that I didn't know prior to making it.

[snapshot]

wee

 

[Big Ol Billy]

Love it, how do people even do these 3rd-person replay type animations? Really adds a lot and makes the explanations crystal clear.

[Bauul]

I second the above comments. Not only what you is covered extremely accurate (as far as I could tell!), and delivered in a clear and concise way, but the editing is absolutely phenomenal.

 

You didn't need to make a custom sprite of an Imp with a hard hat checking the angle of the wall, but I'm very glad you did!

[roboticmehdi2]

Doomguy has severe neck pains :D good one.

[borogk]

1 hour ago, Big Ol Billy said:

Love it, how do people even do these 3rd-person replay type animations? Really adds a lot and makes the explanations crystal clear.

 

I use ZDoom's MovingCamera actor to capture the footage. It's designed to make cutscenes - so you can put a bunch of waypoints, configure angles and so on.

[borogk]

1 hour ago, roboticmehdi2 said:

Doomguy has severe neck pains :D good one.

 

Can't take the full credit for the joke :) I've read it a while ago in YT comment section, although don't remember where exactly.

[rzh]

Great video, but now I question why people never bring up the other Doom engine games into discussion when talking about 2D vs. 3D. Hexen is probably the most advanced, it has looking up and down, flying, jumping, finite height monsters and explosions, swinging doors and you can even make pseudo-room over room. I don't know much about programming, but I doubt you can take a 2D engine and insert 3D functions in it without rewriting the whole thing which Raven Software obviously didn't do.

[borogk]

1 minute ago, rzh said:

Great video, but now I question why people never bring up the other Doom engine games into discussion when talking about 2D vs. 3D. Hexen is probably the most advanced, it has looking up and down, flying, jumping, finite height monsters and explosions, swinging doors and you can even make pseudo-room over room. I don't know much about programming, but I doubt you can take a 2D engine and insert 3D functions in it without rewriting the whole thing which Raven Software obviously didn't do.

 

You are right, they didn't rewrite the whole thing. I kind of brought up this point on 03:34 when showing how easy it is to implement finite explosions in existing Doom engine. I'm sure Raven did a similar thing to remove other limitations.

 

And I have to confess - I personally never played Hexen or Heretic. One day, one day...

[roadworx]

17 minutes ago, rzh said:

Great video, but now I question why people never bring up the other Doom engine games into discussion when talking about 2D vs. 3D. Hexen is probably the most advanced, it has looking up and down, flying, jumping, finite height monsters and explosions, swinging doors and you can even make pseudo-room over room. I don't know much about programming, but I doubt you can take a 2D engine and insert 3D functions in it without rewriting the whole thing which Raven Software obviously didn't do.

cuz the people who argue that it's 2d probably don't even know that hexen exists lmao

[Peccatum Mihzamiz]

Simply excellent! I'm truly gripped by your editing skills and the pacing of your videos. Please continue making these beautiful things!

[kwc]

Absolutely phenomenal approach to providing visuals to aid in grasping the sometimes-difficult concepts of these engine quirks/limitations.
Greatly appreciate the effort here, cheers @borogk!
 

[Noiser]

Very well done, thanks for doing this!
 

[Bauul]

1 hour ago, rzh said:

Great video, but now I question why people never bring up the other Doom engine games into discussion when talking about 2D vs. 3D. Hexen is probably the most advanced, it has looking up and down, flying, jumping, finite height monsters and explosions, swinging doors and you can even make pseudo-room over room. I don't know much about programming, but I doubt you can take a 2D engine and insert 3D functions in it without rewriting the whole thing which Raven Software obviously didn't do.

 

I think it's because the question is more "Is Doom 3D?", not "Is the Doom engine capable of 3D with changes?".  Because the latter is obviously true, hence source ports and Hexen and all the other examples.

[boris]

Very nice video, the editing is really great. I have a tiny nitpick, though. The reason why Doom doesn't have room over room isn't that it's sector based. The reason is the way Doom uses BSP to determine what to render, and the implementation doesn't work with overlapping geometry. Duke3D, for example, also uses sectors, but is a portal renderer, where such geometry isn't a problem. There was actually a port that could do room over room in Doom, appropriately named RORDoom.

[borogk]

4 minutes ago, boris said:

Very nice video, the editing is really great. I have a tiny nitpick, though. The reason why Doom doesn't have room over room isn't that it's sector based. The reason is the way Doom uses BSP to determine what to render, and the implementation doesn't work with overlapping geometry. Duke3D, for example, also uses sectors, but is a portal renderer, where such geometry isn't a problem. There was actually a port that could do room over room in Doom, appropriately named RORDoom.

 

Very good point. That's was an oversight on my part - I didn't mention that sectors cannot overlap, which is an important factor. It is sort of implied based on presented pictures, but wouldn't hurt to say it more explicitly.

[boris]

It's no big deal, really. For the purpose of the video and its target audience the explanation is "correct enough".