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Master O

Witchaven 1 and 2 Now Available on GOG

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Nice to see old games getting republished officially. Even if they weren't very good games...

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Tempting to grab them and give them both a run with the enhanced build. Could be a laugh.

Tekwar would be amusing, but I've actually played that, unlike the Witchaven games.

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Witchaven really isn't that great. If you are evaluating whether to buy it, you should check Civvie11's review first:

 

 

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Capstone....

 

CAPSTOOO

 

*civvie's intro begins*

Spoiler

Can you guess from which video is? It's EASY, very EASY

 

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Just now, Lol 6 said:

Capstone....

 

CAPSTOOO

 

*civvie's intro begins*

  Hide contents

Can you guess from which video is? It's EASY, very EASY

 

im pretty sure its from 10 changes made to the bible (part 1 of 2)

 

 

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54 minutes ago, SiFi270 said:

Is TekWar also on the horizon?

It may sound weird and stupid, but I really want to play Tekwar

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12 minutes ago, Lol 6 said:

It may sound weird and stupid, but I really want to play Tekwar

See you on the Matrix

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7 minutes ago, Liberation said:

Don't post abandonware links, thank you very much.

i didnt know they werent allowed on the site i though they were fair game because they were abandonware

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Just now, Liberation said:

@omalefico32xNope sorry, technically still warez, abandonware technically does not exist. 

not to derail the thread any longer but i just wanted to say fuck digital rights law all that reminded me of this video

 

maybe i should make a thread to talk about this

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I think games from defunct companies should remain abadonware... It´s a waste of money, especially when the money don´t go to the original developers.

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6 minutes ago, Kloki38 said:

I think games from defunct companies should remain abadonware... It´s a waste of money, especially when the money don´t go to the original developers.

i dont agree... not all of the time anyway for example look at the unity port of  doom sure john romero isnt making money on it anymore but at the same time we still have devs like sponge who worked on the port

 

i 100% agree when its just a dosbox version or something like that with no changes or bug fixes

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The inferior Build games have a lot of interesting elements, and I think it would be cool to see them develop into something good through modern sourceports.

 

I was deeply fascinated by Witchaven as a kid, and I played both games extensively. I kept hoping and hoping that if I just saw them in the right light, and figured out how to play them, that they would turn out to be good after all. The art and music are deeply impressed upon me, and I think there's the basis of a good Diablo/Rogue type game there.

 

I have to buy them. Thanks for the notice.

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2 hours ago, SiFi270 said:

Only one question remains.

 

Is TekWar also on the horizon?

 

 

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Posted (edited)
On 6/9/2021 at 7:18 PM, Lol 6 said:

It may sound weird and stupid, but I really want to play Tekwar

I think you should do it. Both Tekwar and Witchaver are good in my opinion, just different from your typical shooter (Tekwar is very creative, one of the first shooters with an open world mentality). My advice is not listen to youtubers who are more interested on memes than make insightful reviews. Playing the game is the best way to form your opinion, whether you like it or not.

Capstone is a company that never deserved the "LJN" treatment imo. Their games may not be best, but it's far from the greedy "shovelware" company who make "cash grabs" on purpose, which is not only a false narrative in my opinion but also don't represent what most people thought about these games at the time.

Edited by Noiser

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2 hours ago, SiFi270 said:

Only one question remains.

 

Is TekWar also on the horizon?

I doubt it, considering the fact that it's a licensed game, and not a very good one at that.

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Posted (edited)

Epic, and there’s word of a source port on the way as well by Fix. I think these games were really, really rushed out the door when they came out, but there is definitely a lot of neat ideas and concepts found in both games. I’d say the first is the better of the two, but that’s mostly to do with the sequel being far buggier than the first game. With that said, don’t get involved in the story too much because it’s all over the place. The demo has a different story from the final game, so that just goes to show you they weren’t even sure of the story they wanted to go with until the last minute. 

Edited by Gerolf

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1 hour ago, Noiser said:

I think you should do it. Both Tekwar and Witchaver are good in my opinion, just different from your typical shooter (Tekwar is very creative, one of the first shooters with an open world mentality). My advice is not listen to youtubers who are more interested on engage with memes than make insightful reviews. Playing the game is the best way to form your opinion, whatever you like it or not.

Capstone is a company that never deserved the "LJN" treatment imo. Their games may not be best, but it's far from the greedy "shovelware" company who make "cash grabs" on purpose, which is not only a false narrative in my opinion but also don't represent what most people thought about these games at the time.

I agree that Capstone has been dealt a rather shitty reputation. I don't really think that Corridor 7 was as "Bad" as people remember, or have been told to remember. I played it when it came out, and it wasn't Doom, but it wasn't terrible by any means. I certainly enjoyed it, but then again I also loved the Catacombs games, Wolfenstein, and Doom, so what does that say about my opinion? The same with Witchaven 1 and 2, they weren't fantastic, they were buggy, but there was obviously quite a bit of effort put into them. If they would've had more time in development they may have been great.

 

Or they might've still sucked. Capstone did put out some terrible games, but Corridor 7, and the Witchavens felt like they had real effort put into them. Maybe not, but they didn't feel like fly by night, make a quick buck games.

 

That being said, Witchaven is bad, but mainly because it just feels so unfinished and buggy; when it works, it's actually kind of fun. Which you could also blame using an early version of the BUILD engine for some, or most, of that bugginess. Love getting randomly killed by the environment for no apparent reason? Witchaven's got you covered. But really, it was exactly the same as getting randomly crushed by the level in Duke Nukem 3D, Shadow Warrior, and Blood.

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As bad as Witchaven is, I'll always have a strong sense of nostalgia for it. It was one of the first PC games I had access to (before I even played doom). I was too young to see it as anything other than one of earth's most badass creations. For better or worse, it had a huge impact on my mind, and I wonder if I ever would have gotten into Doom if it weren't for Witchaven.

 

All that said though, I have no desire to go back and play it again. It really does suck.

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No game should just be buried forever just because some people don't like them. Old games like these often get patched up and improved by the community anyway.

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As soon as I saw witchaven in the title of this thread, I just knew that someone was gonna post Civvie's review.

 

@deus-ex ... was not disappointed. :)

 

And yes. as @Devalaous has rightly pointed out, no game, no matter how bad, should be lost. I am not saying they should be played, just that they shouldn't be lost.

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With these available again, they might also one day (slim chance, but a chance nonetheless) be supported in Raze, our very own BUILD source port, with all the improvements that brings.

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I agree that no game should be lost. Even though I think most Capstone games aren't very good, there are many interesting ideas and some genuinely good stuff. All of them had pretty good music for instance. 

 

One game of theirs I think is good, really good actually, is Corridor 7. In fact, I'd say it's the best game on the Wolf3D Engine (besides RoTT, but that was heavily modified).   

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Just now, A.H. Sankhatayan said:

I agree that no game should be lost. Even though I think most Capstone games aren't very good, there are many interesting ideas and some genuinely good stuff. All of them had pretty good music for instance. 

 

One game of theirs I think is good, really good actually, is Corridor 7. In fact, I'd say it's the best game on the Wolf3D Engine (besides RoTT, but that was heavily modified).   

 

Totally agree. Corridor 7 was actually pretty good. It rose to the lofty heights of "reasonably interesting," which, by capstone standards, is practically perfection. The level design could be tedious and mazelike at times, but this is more a fault inherent in the limitations of the Wolf3D engine, rather than the design of Corridor 7 itself.

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There is an awesome interview somewhere with Les Bird, programmer of Corridor 7, which contains probably the most information we have from behind the closed doors of Capstone. He says many interesting things, stories from development and so on. Remember those jumpscare monster face things that are both in C7 and Witchaven? The story behind them is quite amusing. If you are interested in Capstone or Corridor 7, you should read it.

http://rvgfanatic.com/wordpress/index.php/corridor-7/ It's halfway through the article, which is a nice read by itself. 

 

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